Charly Musonda Jr.

Manu Garcia isn't even in the top five potential players at this club.

Who are the attacking midfielders with more potential? Kelechi not included

I'd go further, and say Manu isn't even in the Top 10 potential players. How he gets anywhere near the 1st team is the biggest mystery at the club. I can only assume he is one of those players who, in training, looks a lot better with better players around him (or cynically I could say it's that we spent a lot of money on him, at a very young age, and need to put him in the shop window for European teams- where his game may be more suited, and his reputation from his younger days will ensure we recoup some of the what we have spent on him... as we did with Lopes & Pozo!)

In the 20+ times I've watched him at EDS / U18 level he has never once been even close to being the stand out player on the pitch. in my opinion the following players have all shown more in U18's and EDS than Garcia ever has... Celina, Nemane, Barker, Brahim, Nmecha, & Bytyqi (before his injury)... plus Roberts despite never playing at EDS level... and Kelechi obviously. That's 8 attacking options, and I could name several other defensive-minded midfielders and defenders who I would also put in this list if I wasn't sticking just to attack-minded players!

Some of these aren't 'ready' yet... but in my opinion neither is Manu... and I have seen nothing in him to make me think he ever will be!

Back on topic... Musonda (along with Abraham & Swift) have been the 3 stand out players each time we have played a very good Chelsea team over the past couple of seasons. If Musonda is available on the cheap through a tribunal fee, and if he isn't a billy-big-bollocks, then I see no real harm in snapping him up. Although for me, making this signing, and bringing in another young midfielder (even if a more attack-minded one) before giving Evans a proper chance would be disappointing, as I still feel that with a bit of luck and a boost to his confidence, then Evans has the ability and mentality to make it at the highest level.
 
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Manu Garcia is one of about two or three players we have at the club who could be genuinely world class. As in playing for a very top CL team 40 games a season world class. He isn't getting the odd first team action despite Pellegrini's stupid picking policies at 17 years of age for no reason. Absolutely stunned that some people can't see this, in fact if I had to bet money now on the future careers of every single player in our entire Academy then I'd bet Manu Garcia will eclipse all of them
 
Manu Garcia is one of about two or three players we have at the club who could be genuinely world class. As in playing for a very top CL team 40 games a season world class. He isn't getting the odd first team action despite Pellegrini's stupid picking policies at 17 years of age for no reason. Absolutely stunned that some people can't see this, in fact if I had to bet money now on the future careers of every single player in our entire Academy then I'd bet Manu Garcia will eclipse all of them

See i really rate Manu, a lot, but i don't think he's done anything to suggest he's a better prospect than several players. He hasn't performed better, done anything more special or been more consistent. I'm not saying he's crap, I think he's fantastic prospect, cos you can *tell* he *could* be special, but he's simply not ahead of others at the moment. I think half of the appeal is that he looks like he'll be a Silva-type. Yet I still think that could go either way as he does have a long way to go...and the matter of fact is that he's struggled a lot in the u21s this year. A weak link at times.

I'm delighted he's involved, just feel that if he is involved, others should be, if we're talking on merit. Still agree though, he'll be a very good player one day - but i think several should be. And several could be too given the same involvement.
 
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See i really rate Manu, a lot, but i don't think he's done anything to suggest he's a better prospect than several players. He hasn't performed better, done anything more special or been more consistent. I'm not saying he's crap, I think he's fantastic prospect, cos you can *tell* he *could* be special, but he's simply not ahead of others at the moment. I think half of the appeal is that he looks like he'll be a Silva-type. Yet I still think that could go either way as he does have a long way to go...and the matter of fact is that he's struggled a lot in the u21s this year. A weak link at times.

I'm delighted he's involved, just feel that if he is involved, others should be, if we're talking on merit. Still agree though, he'll be a very good player one day.

I think we've had this chat before mate, but I see this guy as somebody who has ridiculous processing time. He has already made his decision when everybody else is still deciding and that is one of the few skills that are incredibly hard to teach. His technique falls under "fine to great" rather than "good to great" which we'd want though I'd argue that he's at a disadvantage due to him not being compared to those of his age rather than those who more advanced.

Agree that he's struggled at times in the U21s. But again he's 17. We shouldn't be comparing him to people of that age group as his peers though obviously we always will.

Just as a comparison, I look at him and perennial BM favourite Barker and it just seems that there's light years between them. Barker is going to be a good player somewhere but he'd never developed a brain defensively nor as part of a 11 man tactical system that requires complete flow, rhythm and that type of movement.

I look at Manu Garcia and see a man who understands how to express his ideas within the greater collective unit without detracting from it. That's a bit special at only 17.
 
I think we've had this chat before mate, but I see this guy as somebody who has ridiculous processing time. He has already made his decision when everybody else is still deciding and that is one of the few skills that are incredibly hard to teach. His technique falls under "fine to great" rather than "good to great" which we'd want though I'd argue that he's at a disadvantage due to him not being compared to those of his age rather than those who more advanced.

Agree that he's struggled at times in the U21s. But again he's 17. We shouldn't be comparing him to people of that age group as his peers though obviously we always will.

Just as a comparison, I look at him and perennial BM favourite Barker and it just seems that there's light years between them. Barker is going to be a good player somewhere but he'd never developed a brain defensively nor as part of a 11 man tactical system that requires complete flow, rhythm and that type of movement.

I look at Manu Garcia and see a man who understands how to express his ideas within the greater collective unit without detracting from it. That's a bit special at only 17.

See that's the thing, you say about seeing the game and making his decision, but the thing that stands out so far in the EDS, is that he gets the ball and turns into his man and dawdles on it. If deciding what to do is turn the wrong way into a man that's marking him, then I agree. Whereas I see someone like Patching, younger, play in the same u19s side, and the EDS now, and actually look more alive and alert and turn into space better and more intelligently when receiving the ball, while looking every bit as graceful. Plus being a greater goal threat and a better dribbler. Same as Boadu last year.

That's the exact thing we've not seen so far in the EDS, despite it apparently being his main strength. There's been hints at it, but very sporadically, and it'd be the least I expect too. I totally agree re he's only young, but then again, most of that team are young too, and i saw people doing better than what he's doing now last year aged 16/17 in the EDS. And I've seen that this year too.

The Barker comment I don't get. He was absolutely exceptional in the balanced EDS and u18s side last year, so that's an odd statement. His linkup play with Angelino, Byrne and Ambrose around him, dropping back and pushing forwards, was exceptional. As was the flow and rhythm of the team. Garcia's not shown that for the u18s youth teams or the EDS yet, but has looked really nice playing some neat passes in some preseason friendlies for the first team.

I'm *really* not slagging off Garcia, I just believe you're playing up what he's done so far a hell of a lot. I properly pay attention to these games, and i've been looking for signs of encouragement all season and the things that's let me down so far is the fact that he isn't reading the game, looking lost and making bad decisions... which is the exact opposite of what you believe he's doing...in my opinion.

PS - i think Garcia's a class prospect, if there was any doubt about that. Ha. I'm just being realistic, imo, based on what i've seen so far having seen him in 20/30 games, which i think is fair.
 
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See that's the thing, you say about seeing the game and making his decision, but the thing that stands out so far in the EDS, is that he gets the ball and turns into his man and dawdles on it.

This isn't a fair assessment. One of the reasons that I personally believe that he's been called up in front of others is that he makes a decision in the EDS, then has to wait around for others to make their decision before releasing which tends to dawdle. I'll agree on many aspects that he can improve on but his speed of processing is genuinely something that I think is in front of the rest of the team which hurts him, a little like Robinho at City, Veron at Utd, Kezman at Chelsea - sometimes the whole doesn't fit. Obviously he's not good enough as a player to play in the first team but this specific part of his game is extremely well developed in my opinion.

The Barker comment I don't get. He was absolutely exceptional in the balanced EDS and u18s side last year, so that's an odd statement. His linkup play with Angelino, Byrne and Ambrose around him, dropping back and pushing forwards, was exceptional. As was the flow and rhythm of the team. Garcia's not shown that for the u18s youth teams or the EDS yet, but has looked really nice playing some neat passes in some preseason friendlies for the first team.

I was going to say that I'm not slagging off Barker but I suppose that that is wrong. It's not that I think he's a bad player, more that I think he needs to learn maturity when it comes to being disciplined. For lack of a better term, and I do this appreciate this isn't a fantastic analogy, he seems very Adam Johnson to me.

I'm *really* not slagging off Garcia, I just believe you're playing up what he's done so far a hell of a lot. I properly pay attention to these games, and i've been looking for signs of encouragement all season and the things that's let me down so far is the fact that he isn't reading the game, looking lost and making bad decisions... which is the exact opposite of what you believe he's doing...in my opinion.

We all have our favourites for different reasons. I like Manu and look at him as something that can be somebody special in his raw attributes. I appreciate that he hasn't made a huge, fantastic mark that other have done but whilst there's a good 5-10 players who I think can help us, I also find another 20 players who probably won't make it. When I look at young players I don't really look at technique because it can be taught, nor physicality because it lies by age; instead my little fetish is in decision making speed when they can see the whole pitch and this is where Manu comes in for me.
 
This isn't a fair assessment. One of the reasons that I personally believe that he's been called up in front of others is that he makes a decision in the EDS, then has to wait around for others to make their decision before releasing which tends to dawdle. I'll agree on many aspects that he can improve on but his speed of processing is genuinely something that I think is in front of the rest of the team which hurts him, a little like Robinho at City, Veron at Utd, Kezman at Chelsea - sometimes the whole doesn't fit. Obviously he's not good enough as a player to play in the first team but this specific part of his game is extremely well developed in my opinion.

See I think it is a fair assessment. This is entirely the individual's perspective, I guess. I've seen Ambrose, Nemane or Faupala in recent weeks make great runs off him, then found it highly frustrating that he's dawdled and run into a man or played a baffling naff over-hit pass as the running players have thrown their arms up in frustration. I don't agree at all that it's always the EDS's failings always. I think that's an easy excuse for some poor performances. There may be the odd situation where that happens, yes, but i've often found so far that it's been his problem. I agree he *can* do it, definitely, but it's too sporadic at the moment and nowhere near as sharp as it should be...and it shouldn't lead to him giving the ball away as much as he currently does.

However, what I will say is that the last couple of games have seen some encouragement. I actually think I will be wrong, for what its worth, but I don't think this season he's shown it all if im calling it as it is.

This whole argument simply stems from a poor use of players anyway by MP, which i think we'd both agree about. It's nice to even ahve this discussion, cos we're effectively arguing over who's the better brighter prospect, while agreeing that we have many that could be that.
 
See I think it is a fair assessment. This is entirely the individual's perspective, I guess. I've seen Ambrose, Nemane or Faupala in recent weeks make great runs off him, then found it highly frustrating that he's dawdled and run into a man or played a baffling naff over-hit pass as the running players have thrown their arms up in frustration. I don't agree at all that it's always the EDS's failings always. I think that's an easy excuse for some poor performances. There may be the odd situation where that happens, yes, but i've often found so far that it's been his problem. I agree he *can* do it, definitely, but it's too sporadic at the moment and nowhere near as sharp as it should be...and it shouldn't lead to him giving the ball away as much as he currently does.

However, what I will say is that the last couple of games have seen some encouragement. I actually think I will be wrong, for what its worth, but I don't think this season he's shown it all if im calling it as it is.

This whole argument simply stems from a poor use of players anyway by MP, which i think we'd both agree about. It's nice to even ahve this discussion, cos we're effectively arguing over who's the better brighter prospect, while agreeing that we have many that could be that.

I can't disagree on his performances, nor really on the runs people make off of him. My rating of him comes from incidents where he's picked up the ball, sort of turned and then hesitated. We have probably both seen the same thing but I've declared it genius to your useless. Only time will tell I presume, but for my money he's a better first team player in terms of passing than he is EDS player, and it's made me think he's ahead of the class. Obviously it just makes sense that if somebody is ahead of the game mentally at 17 then suggesting they're going to be exceptional is par for course. We all wrongly presume a linear or even exponential progression of talent, despite hundreds of players who have shown this up.
 

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