FA Youth Cup 4th Round vs Liverpool (19:00 KO)

Impressive performances and results, but until one of them makes the big leap to the First Team, (and starts featuring on a regular basis, as opposed to the odd cameo when we''re already winning 4-0), there will always be an air of cynicism, regarding the long term prospects. (it only seems like yesterday when I was watching Brandon Barker dismantle Bayern Munich)
Similarly, Chelsea are hailed as the leaders of youth team football, but despite all the recent success, the majority of their 2015 team are facing the same issues, with loan spells in Holland or the Championship
 
Impressive performances and results, but until one of them makes the big leap to the First Team, (and starts featuring on a regular basis, as opposed to the odd cameo when we''re already winning 4-0), there will always be an air of cynicism, regarding the long term prospects. (it only seems like yesterday when I was watching Brandon Barker dismantle Bayern Munich)
Similarly, Chelsea are hailed as the leaders of youth team football, but despite all the recent success, the majority of their 2015 team are facing the same issues, with loan spells in Holland or the Championship

It's all down to the coaches in charge. Chelsea's young lads are phenomenal but like us, they've got a real problem with having the balls to use them. I'm hoping it'll change for both clubs tbh cos the Premier League will be a better place for it in general.
 
It's all down to the coaches in charge. Chelsea's young lads are phenomenal but like us, they've got a real problem with having the balls to use them. I'm hoping it'll change for both clubs tbh cos the Premier League will be a better place for it in general.

A genuine question and please don't get shirty.

Which of city's youth players would now be playing in the first team or elsewhere in the premier league if they had been fast tracked or given a run in the team.

I do not mean the players you watched last night as we do not know yet if or when they may be introduced..I like others hope it is soon.

I mean past youth players or under23s.
 
A genuine question and please don't get shirty.

Which of city's youth players would now be playing in the first team or elsewhere in the premier league if they had been fast tracked or given a run in the team.

I do not mean the players you watched last night as we do not know yet if or when they may be introduced..I like others hope it is soon.

I mean past youth players or under23s.

No reason to get shirty, don't worry! It's a very hard question to answer, but when you consider that Glenn Whelan is currently playing in the Premier League and basically anyone we've had in our academy sides for the past few years is probably better than he ever was as a kid, then you'd guess many could if given a chance. It's all guess work cos it depends on how they reacted to the situation. Some seemingly lesser players blossom surrounded by great players, some fall, despite being more talented. Someone like Evans could have surprised us. He's now playing near the top end of the Championship and always looked very good in preseason with the first team, surrounded by top class players. What's to say that he couldn't have fitted in and been a good squad player for us? People like Lopes too could have been a terrifying impact sub, and he actually showed that v West Ham, looking excellent...then explicably never got another shot again. Someone like Kean Bryan is a very tidy footballer with bags of heart, great physicality and a proper warrior. I've absolutely no doubt that if he'd have been introduced as a late sub and told to destroy anything in front of our defence, instead that went to Demichelis for some baffling reason, he'd have 100% not let us down and probably won a few home fans over too with his determination.

Barker maybe should have got a chance as a sub when he was absolutely flying and full of confidence (and he really, really was a couple of years back) and Ambrose was also causing all manner of problems at 17/18. Denayer 100% should have become a squad regular last year seeing as he was ours, he'd just been one of the best, if not the best, player over in Scotland (you can mock it, but as a kid on loan in a physical league, to win the young player of they ear in your first ever pro season is impressive) and he was impressing for Belgium and away at Inter in a 10 man team, but (yet again) MP picked Demichelis over him which boggles the mind. Basically, you never really fully *know* until they get a chance. I don't expect any kids to be thrown in as regulars, even now. I don't think Maffeo or Garcia should be playing every game, though I think they're both excellent footballers. I just expect us to know when the right moment is for them to be challenged further.

A young game changer like Barker was at 17/18, genuinely destroying basically everyone he faced at youth level week in week out should have totally been rewarded with a 20 minute cameo when he was flying. That's what you do. You give them that taste. The worst case scenario is that he would've been quiet, done nowt and no damage would have been done. The best case scenario is that, full of confidence, he could have skinned his FB, set up a last minute goal and saw his self-belief and confidence rocket. A star is born. Think Rashford, a player that had done significantly less than Barker at youth level and couldn't get anywhere near the England youth setup cos of Barker. This stuff CAN happen, but it can only happen when they get a chance. Instead Barker never got his shot, was faffing about in the EDS a year later, his form and confidence started to drop as he stagnated and he was shipped out on a fucking terrible loan to Rotherham which dented him further. Not a single person in the world *knows* if a talented kid will make it or not. If they say they do, they don't. I don't, Pep doesn't, MP doesn't. Txiki doesn't. Some opinions are more informed than others, definitely, but no one ever fully knows until it happens out on the pitch.

All I ask as a fan is that they get a chance when they deserve it. I trust and hope Pep knows this. I think he does. The fact that Foden was involved the other week as a 16 year old is brilliant. Genuinely. It's Pep doing EXACTLY what I explained up there ^ Rewarding an exceptional young lad on a very upwards trajectory with that taste to keep him motivated. It's a shame he didn't get on, but it's still huge for the lad. He's 16. Imagine the boost that gave him. Brahim got it too v Swansea earlier this season. You reward exceptional talent with that taste to encourage them. If you don't give it them, their heads drop. That doesn't then mean they're then not good enough or strong enough mentally. It means they're human, they're kids and they react to things emotionally like the rest of us. I'm totally aware it's not always possible to give kids a chance, but it 100% has been possible for that to happen over the last couple of years. We've had an 18 year old Ambrose on the bench, in the middle of a great run of form, at home 3-0 up to WBA, and MP then brings on Scott fucking Sinclair instead. Literally what is the point? Bring a reject on who everyone knew would leave in a couple of months who hadn't played a game in ages cos he wasn't good enough, or bring the kid on who could be the potential future of your club? There is literally no excuse for that. A single decision like that can change the whole feeling around the academy.

I don't expect ten academy players in the first team. I know its not possible, but what I do expect, and hope for, is that we offer actual incentives for these young lads and show them that their exceptional form at youth level will be rewarded potentially. There has been absolutely loads of good young players at City over the past 2/3 years. Not all would have gone to be stars, but a few could have definitely surprised us and saved us a fortune in the transfer market. I just wish we'd had the guts to actually find out. We get it so wrong in this country. We'd much rather buy someone else's young lad who's played 30 games instead of develop our own. The irony is that our young lads had probably out-played that young lad at youth level only a few months earlier too...
 
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A genuine question and please don't get shirty.

Which of city's youth players would now be playing in the first team or elsewhere in the premier league if they had been fast tracked or given a run in the team.

I do not mean the players you watched last night as we do not know yet if or when they may be introduced..I like others hope it is soon.

I mean past youth players or under23s.

Suarez, Rekik, Lopes and Guidetti are all playing regular football in top leagues across Europe, and yet 3 of them didn't feature in a single league game when they were at City.
 
No reason to get shirty, don't worry! It's a very hard question to answer, but when you consider that Glenn Whelan is currently playing in the Premier League and basically anyone we've had in our academy sides for the past few years is probably better than he ever was as a kid, then you'd guess many could if given a chance. It's all guess work cos it depends on how they reacted to the situation. Some seemingly lesser players blossom surrounded by great players, some fall, despite being more talented. Someone like Evans could have surprised us. He's now playing near the top end of the Championship and always looked very good in preseason with the first team, surrounded by top class players. What's to say that he couldn't have fitted in and been a good squad player for us? People like Lopes too could have been a terrifying impact sub, and he actually showed that v West Ham, looking excellent...then explicably never got another shot again. Someone like Kean Bryan is a very tidy footballer with bags of heart, great physicality and a proper warrior. I've absolutely no doubt that if he'd have been introduced as a late sub and told to destroy anything in front of our defence, instead that went to Demichelis for some baffling reason, he'd have 100% not let us down and probably won a few home fans over too with his determination.

Barker maybe should have got a chance as a sub when he was absolutely flying and full of confidence (and he really, really was a couple of years back) and Ambrose was also causing all manner of problems at 17/18. Denayer 100% should have become a squad regular last year seeing as he was ours, he'd just been one of the best, if not the best, player over in Scotland (you can mock it, but as a kid on loan in a physical league, to win the young player of they ear in your first ever pro season is impressive) and he was impressing for Belgium and away at Inter in a 10 man team, but (yet again) MP picked Demichelis over him which boggles the mind. Basically, you never really fully *know* until they get a chance. I don't expect any kids to be thrown in as regulars, even now. I don't think Maffeo or Garcia should be playing every game, though I think they're both excellent footballers. I just expect us to know when the right moment is for them to be challenged further.

A young game changer like Barker was at 17/18, genuinely destroying basically everyone he faced at youth level week in week out should have totally been rewarded with a 20 minute cameo when he was flying. That's what you do. You give them that taste. The worst case scenario is that he would've been quiet, done nowt and no damage would have been done. The best case scenario is that, full of confidence, he could have skinned his FB, set up a last minute goal and saw his self-belief and confidence rocket. A star is born. Think Rashford, a player that had done significantly less than Barker at youth level and couldn't get anywhere near the England youth setup cos of Barker. This stuff CAN happen, but it can only happen when they get a chance. Instead Barker never got his shot, was faffing about in the EDS a year later, his form and confidence started to drop as he stagnated and he was shipped out on a fucking terrible loan to Rotherham which dented him further. Not a single person in the world *knows* if a talented kid will make it or not. If they say they do, they don't. I don't, Pep doesn't, MP doesn't. Txiki doesn't. Some opinions are more informed than others, definitely, but no one ever fully knows until it happens out on the pitch.

All I ask as a fan is that they get a chance when they deserve it. I trust and hope Pep knows this. I think he does. The fact that Foden was involved the other week as a 16 year old is brilliant. Genuinely. It's Pep doing EXACTLY what I explained up there ^ Rewarding an exceptional young lad on a very upwards trajectory with that taste to keep him motivated. It's a shame he didn't get on, but it's still huge for the lad. He's 16. Imagine the boost that gave him. Brahim got it too v Swansea earlier this season. You reward exceptional talent with that taste to encourage them. If you don't give it them, their heads drop. That doesn't then mean they're then not good enough or strong enough mentally. It means they're human, they're kids and they react to things emotionally like the rest of us. I'm totally aware it's not always possible to give kids a chance, but it 100% has been possible for that to happen over the last couple of years. We've had an 18 year old Ambrose on the bench, in the middle of a great run of form, at home 3-0 up to WBA, and MP then brings on Scott fucking Sinclair instead. Literally what is the point? Bring a reject on who everyone knew would leave in a couple of months who hadn't played a game in ages cos he wasn't good enough, or bring the kid on who could be the potential future of your club? There is literally no excuse for that. A single decision like that can change the whole feeling around the academy.

I don't expect ten academy players in the first team. I know its not possible, but what I do expect, and hope for, is that we offer actual incentives for these young lads and show them that their exceptional form at youth level will be rewarded potentially. There has been absolutely loads of good young players at City over the past 2/3 years. Not all would have gone to be stars, but a few could have definitely surprised us and saved us a fortune in the transfer market. I just wish we'd had the guts to actually find out. We get it so wrong in this country. We'd much rather buy someone else's young lad who's played 30 games instead of develop our own. The irony is that our young lads had probably out-played that young lad at youth level only a few months earlier too...

Superb post that! As good a summary of the situation as I've seen and one which is hard to disagree with!
 
It's all down to the coaches in charge. Chelsea's young lads are phenomenal but like us, they've got a real problem with having the balls to use them. I'm hoping it'll change for both clubs tbh cos the Premier League will be a better place for it in general.

Agree entirely with this, and your longer post. I've slowly become more bitter towards the chances our youth get - somewhat convincing myself the likes of Aleix and Tosin are just there as bodies during training, despite how often our first team are found lacking.
 
I think there's an expectation issue as well. In order to be useful in a 25 man squad, our youth players need only be better than the 25th best first team player. They don't need to be the next Messi to get a chance.

I also think our first team players tend to be quite good at filling a few positions, so there should be no reason why a spot or two on the bench can't be reserved for a youth player in 80% of matches. Then, on the off chance we do have a healthy lead, we always have the opportunity to blood a young player.
 
Suarez, Rekik, Lopes and Guidetti are all playing regular football in top leagues across Europe, and yet 3 of them didn't feature in a single league game when they were at City.

Of those 4 Suarez is a standout to me.
Yet there were regular eds posters who dismissed him.
Of the other 3, guidetti was ill, for a long period. He had issues also and was often quoted as his dream was to play for Milan or barca or anyone,
The other 2 you could not see as even squad players with a future at city.
 

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