Islamic Terrorism: is religion/belief no matter how misguided, the main motivator?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Magicpole, 24 May 2017.

  1. arfurclue

    arfurclue

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    Interesting reading.

    An hypothesis of sorts in relation to this - 'so long as the primary focus is upon finding, and implementing, a unified theory (whether through
    religion, science, whatever...) rather than coming to know a unified experience, then humanity will stay stuck in cycles of war (and other forms of conflict)
    and temporary truce.'

    Essentially a focus on unified experience allows many different theories, a focus on unified theory leads to 'arguments' about whose theory is 'right' and who
    'understands' this theory best, whilst 'forgetting' a unified experience.
     
  2. chedlee

    chedlee

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    I think that blaming religion per se is too simplistic and misses what is really going on.

    ISIS (or whatever term they are currently using) has emerged in areas that have leaders who are trying to model their countries along western lines. They see the massive potential benefits (for them) of western global capitalism and seek to exploit their own people with the help of western (and eastern in some cases - the difference is not that great ideologically) government and business intervention.

    If Islam, the religion, was so hell bent on world domination through a global caliphate how do you explain the Islamic Republic of Iran, one of the most progressive and inclusive countries in the region?

    This is about power, politics and wealth which is exactly what all war and conflict is about. Religion (or pretty much any ideology) is a tool wielded by those in power to control everyone else.
     
  3. chedlee

    chedlee

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    I honestly thought you were about to describe America there, in fact a slight tweak would work:

    "A mixture of religion, backward societies and intolerant culture, fanned by fanaticism - the latter being based on real and/or perceived historical injustices inflicted by the liberal elite. It's a heady mix"
     
  4. steviemc

    steviemc

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    I heard that a third of American Christians recently polled still believe that the Bible is the Word of God and to be interpreted literally. That doesn't really suggest much in the way of an evolving religion to me.
     
    Last edited: 24 May 2017
  5. che_don_john

    che_don_john

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    You can't mean that, surely?! Iran? A country that interfered with it's own elections, put out a fatwah on a novelist, prosecuted a man for making a dance video and continually treats women as second class citizens?
     
  6. Dave Ewing's Back 'eader

    Dave Ewing's Back 'eader

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    I worked for nigh on twenty years with people who were of a Muslim/Islamic culture whether they were full on Muslims or not, and I never got the impression they would have me topped. They were nice people who wanted the same as I wanted - a job, a house, a generally pleasant environment in which to pass our days.

    Anybody who tags on evil deeds in the name of anything, whether it be religion, cultism, fascism or what, is just that - evil!
     
  7. Magicpole

    Magicpole

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    That's what I was saying 99% are just people trying to get by like us all.
     
  8. chedlee

    chedlee

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    I am not saying Iran is some perfect model of how societies should be run, however to answer your points specifically: on elections one word - Trump, on the fatwah, post-Khomeini Iran is a very different place to the one of 30 years ago. I don't know about the dance thing but female education, employment and life expectancy have all improved markedly in the last 20-30 years. Yes they have a different attitude to women but that does not make them second class citizens.

    The point I was really making is that Iran is an Islamic state and has been since 1979. The revolution, like all such upheavals, was brutal, as I said I am not trying to make them out to be perfect. They have been heavily involved in supporting Islamic causes in the region but they have not invoked or provoked anything like ISIS or ISIL, indeed they have been involved in fighting them in Iraq and Syria.

    There are parts of the Middle East that are a mess but that is not because the Islamic religion want to take over the world as was posited in the OP.
     
  9. steviemc

    steviemc

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    I don't think religion is the only motivator, but it's certainly a major motivator. It's easier to get people onside by making them believe they're working towards a cause, or for the greater good.

    I'm sure very few would consider becoming a suicide bomber without the brainwashed belief that martyrdom is praised somewhere beyond this life. The indoctrination directly suggests that a religious body offers gifts outside of this life for martyrdom, so religion (or religious beliefs) certainly play a major role.
     
  10. Crouchinho

    Crouchinho

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    Religion is just an excuse. If there was no religion there would be some other excuse or reason to be a dicky. Humans have been killing each other for thousands of years it's never gonna stop, religion or no religion
     

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