Making a Murderer

[ancoats]

Manchester33 said:
I'm certain someone with an IQ as low as his couldn't have come up with this much false information, and the fact that it matches up to physical evidence they found speaks volumes

what
(the fact that it matches up to physical evidence) so no DNA in the bedroom or house small drops of his blood in her car but no blood or DNA of hers could have the police planted the DNA to right they could. but going back to evidence the bones was burnt so how could you say she was killed by cutting her throat and raped in the house

1st question
the body is made up of blood and water and organs and many bones so if you are going to chop somebody up there is going to be 1 hell of a mess
2nd question
could you rape and kill somebody and then chop them up then clean up the mess to a point that NO DNA of hers is found in the house or anywhere else even her own car
3rd question
when the police did there search no key was found but then 4 days later it turns up in his house with only stevie avery DNA on it after the Manitowoc police was told not to enter his house

 

[geoff clipp]

Manchester33 said:
I'm certain someone with an IQ as low as his couldn't have come up with this much false information, and the fact that it matches up to physical evidence they found speaks volumes

what
(the fact that it matches up to physical evidence) so no DNA in the bedroom or house small drops of his blood in her car but no blood or DNA of hers could have the police planted the DNA to right they could. but going back to evidence the bones was burnt so how could you say she was killed by cutting her throat and raped in the house

1st question
the body is made up of blood and water and organs and many bones so if you are going to chop somebody up there is going to be 1 hell of a mess
2nd question
could you rape and kill somebody and then chop them up then clean up the mess to a point that NO DNA of hers is found in the house or anywhere else even her own car
3rd question
when the police did there search no key was found but then 4 days later it turns up in his house with only stevie avery DNA on it after the Manitowoc police was told not to enter his house

This was another thing that I found a little bit misleading in the show. In reality nobody told Manitowoc not to enter the house. Nobody told them not to do anything. Manitowoc police voluntarily invited the neighbouring police force to investigate the case so as to avoid any accusations of conflict of interest. I accept they didn't stick to that self imposed rule and i also accept they acted improperly, but it's not true that they weren't "allowed" on the scene. (That said, there probably should be a change in the law regarding that kind of thing)

 

[Manchester33]

Manchester33 said:
I'm certain someone with an IQ as low as his couldn't have come up with this much false information, and the fact that it matches up to physical evidence they found speaks volumes

what
(the fact that it matches up to physical evidence) so no DNA in the bedroom or house small drops of his blood in her car but no blood or DNA of hers could have the police planted the DNA to right they could. but going back to evidence the bones was burnt so how could you say she was killed by cutting her throat and raped in the house

1st question
the body is made up of blood and water and organs and many bones so if you are going to chop somebody up there is going to be 1 hell of a mess
2nd question
could you rape and kill somebody and then chop them up then clean up the mess to a point that NO DNA of hers is found in the house or anywhere else even her own car
3rd question
when the police did there search no key was found but then 4 days later it turns up in his house with only stevie avery DNA on it after the Manitowoc police was told not to enter his house

Physical evidence means something tangible they have that they could use to incriminate Avery.

Handcuffs were mentioned, him being sweaty and removing the car battery, them transporting the body to the pond in the back of the RAV4 etc. That is physical evidence that helps build the story the prosecution thought best fits this murder case. They found physical evidence to back this up (Avery ordering handcuffs of the internet/sweat under the hood hatch/Blood in the back of the RAV4).

1st question wasn't a question, it was a statement. To humour you, yes, a body is made up of blood, water, organs and bones. They never chopped her up (Or not in the house/garage necessarily). Their alibi was that they spent the whole evening cleaning the garage so anything is possible.

2nd question, yes, that is possible if you knew what you were doing. I agree with the idea that Avery probably isn't smart enough to leave a fool proof trail, hence why he left certain clues. He had been cleaning, he had a good few days to clear up his mess so it is theoretically possible. There isn't much in the way of evidence about how gorey the death was, the idea of all this blood and guts is just speculation.

3rd question, the key was hidden, Avery had attempted to clean it but left his own DNA on the key in the process.

 

[Phil1]

Physical evidence means something tangible they have that they could use to incriminate Avery.

Handcuffs were mentioned, him being sweaty and removing the car battery, them transporting the body to the pond in the back of the RAV4 etc. That is physical evidence that helps build the story the prosecution thought best fits this murder case. They found physical evidence to back this up (Avery ordering handcuffs of the internet/sweat under the hood hatch/Blood in the back of the RAV4).

1st question wasn't a question, it was a statement. To humour you, yes, a body is made up of blood, water, organs and bones. They never chopped her up (Or not in the house/garage necessarily). Their alibi was that they spent the whole evening cleaning the garage so anything is possible.

2nd question, yes, that is possible if you knew what you were doing. I agree with the idea that Avery probably isn't smart enough to leave a fool proof trail, hence why he left certain clues. He had been cleaning, he had a good few days to clear up his mess so it is theoretically possible. There isn't much in the way of evidence about how gorey the death was, the idea of all this blood and guts is just speculation.

3rd question, the key was hidden, Avery had attempted to clean it but left his own DNA on the key in the process.

So,(third point) he managed to wipe the key so meticulously that not a single trace of her DNA was anywhere on it but traces of his happened to be? It want hidden either - it was found in plain sight by 'shock horror' one of the bent cops after several searches had previously uncovered nothing.
The Police had him off from the start and even if he did it the conviction shouldn't have been upheld due to the negligence and corruption of the officers involved.

 

[TCIB]

In the slow minded cousins testimony he said they cut her throat whilst alive on the bed, the arterial spray would be everywhere. Especially with her blood pressure at such a stressful time.
It would hit the roof no problem.

A trained FBI CSI team would struggle to clean it so well that no dna of hers was found at all and leave no trace of cleaning agents all over the room (no cleaning agents were found). In fact it was a pretty tatty room that had not seen a duster in a while from what i saw, not filthy but not shiny clean by any stretch.

She used that same key for 6-7 years, non of her dna was found at all on the key.
Not one bit even ground into the nylon webbing attaching the key to the fob.
That would make an amoeba hold his cell up and say "hey wtf this is proper dodgy"

 

[Ghandi's Flip Flops]

One part of defence's case that gets over looked (mainly because it wasn't featured in MaM) is regarding the condition of the victim's remains.
To reduce a body down to the bone fragments that were found actually takes some doing. It would require either a massive amount of heat (something like an industrial incinerator) or exposure to a conventional fire over a considerable length of time (like 5-6 days).

Having seen pictures of some of the kids bodies that were actually pulled out of the 'Waco Siege' fire after it ended, with them still resembling actual bodies, i honestly can't believe the fire pit next to Avery's trailer was the place where the body was burned.

Strangely, i am pretty sure there was an industrial incinerator on the Avery property which was thoroughly examined and no bone fragments found.
So, bone fragments found in the 'burn barrel' and the 'burn pit' (and possibly at the quarry) but none in an incinerator they could have used. hmmm


Also the other thing i have difficulty understanding is the allegations of sexual abuse by Steven Avery towards Brendan and some of the other cousins. When is this supposed to have happened?

Maybe i'm being dumb, but Brendan wasn't even born when Steven Avery started his 18 year stretch for the rape he didn't commit. Same goes for most of the other cousins. So his only window of opportunity would have been when he got his eventual release from prison (and Brendan would have been at least 14). Is this when he went on his supposed rampage of mass child sex abuse?

Other than heresay and wild allegations by the anti-Steven Avery mob, i haven't been able to find anything that shows Steven Avery abused anyone within his family. (Although there does seem to be some evidence that another Avery family member might have done).

 

[bluemc1]

he might have done it but it was bent as fuck, without doubt stuff was planted or hidden to make sure he was found guilty

the bit that stuck out was copper stand who had his phone call taped of him reading out her reg plate 2 days before car was found, he was clearly stood looking at that car and when it was found it had no reg plates on WTF

also if I've got this right, how can Steve Avery get found guilty for killing her in the garage with a gun and his nephew found guilty of killing the same woman in the trailer by slitting her throat ??? don't the justice system have to say " we've got 1 person in prison here who clearly didn't do what they've been found guilty of

 

[Uncle Wally One Ball]

I got as far as the third one and while there are good points, pretty much all of them can be easily debunked and they are debunked by people in the comments section. It makes me laugh how so much is made of him answering the door to Theresa Halbach wearing "only a towel". So what - it's his house and does that automatically make him a murderer? Not only that, how much evidence is there that Theresa never wanted to go up to his property again? After all, she went there of her own accord on October 31st 2005 so she can't have been that freaked out by him.

One inescapable fact is that this was never a fair trial in a million years.

So do you didnt read all of them as you have a closed mind to it. Therein lies the problem with all this

 

[geoff clipp]

he might have done it but it was bent as fuck, without doubt stuff was planted or hidden to make sure he was found guilty

the bit that stuck out was copper stand who had his phone call taped of him reading out her reg plate 2 days before car was found, he was clearly stood looking at that car and when it was found it had no reg plates on WTF

Yeah that bit looked very suspect though a few people have said it might well have been Colborn simply checking through his list of things to do/look out for that day. One theory I quite liked which somebody posted a link to on here, was that maybe the brother and ex boyfriend had taken matters in their own hands and trespassed at the salvage yard to look for the car, found it and then called the police. The police then had to make it look as though it had been found in a more legitimate way hence it all looking a bit shifty.

 

[ancoats]

One part of defence's case that gets over looked (mainly because it wasn't featured in MaM) is regarding the condition of the victim's remains.
To reduce a body down to the bone fragments that were found actually takes some doing. It would require either a massive amount of heat (something like an industrial incinerator) or exposure to a conventional fire over a considerable length of time (like 5-6 days).

Having seen pictures of some of the kids bodies that were actually pulled out of the 'Waco Siege' fire after it ended, with them still resembling actual bodies, i honestly can't believe the fire pit next to Avery's trailer was the place where the body was burned.

Strangely, i am pretty sure there was an industrial incinerator on the Avery property which was thoroughly examined and no bone fragments found. So, bone fragments found in the 'burn barrel' and the 'burn pit' (and possibly at the quarry) but none in an incinerator they could have used. hmmm


Also the other thing i have difficulty understanding is the allegations of sexual abuse by Steven Avery towards Brendan and some of the other cousins. When is this supposed to have happened?

Maybe i'm being dumb, but Brendan wasn't even born when Steven Avery started his 18 year stretch for the rape he didn't commit. Same goes for most of the other cousins. So his only window of opportunity would have been when he got his eventual release from prison (and Brendan would have been at least 14). Is this when he went on his supposed rampage of mass child sex abuse?

Other than heresay and wild allegations by the anti-Steven Avery mob, i haven't been able to find anything that shows Steven Avery abused anyone within his family. (Although there does seem to be some evidence that another Avery family member might have done).

I did say early on in this its would take 1 hell of a fire to burn a body to small bones like they had. could they have been somebody else bones the police used to fake her death at the avery home. could they have faked the DNA YES. could they and planted avery blood YES. could they planted the key YES. could her DNA be cleaned to a point that nothing remains NOPE. so if her DNA was not found in or on thing that links them to steven avery even the blood spots in the car are not really any uses if hers are not there aswell

so the BIG mistake here is the none DNA of hers they must be DNA from something hair nails blood skin saliva body fluids from a woman fighting for her life