Even those who're indifferent to this transfer have to admit it'd have been naive not to secure first refusal at a fair price for this player given his potential; it was necessary to replenish the squad this summer with quality, and naturally that's proved expensive, but if it means we disregard and completely discard a potential superstar it is very short sighted and indicative of no real intent to produce our own players.
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Rony Lopes
- Thread starter BlueDejong
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Neville Kneville
Well-Known Member
It's a load of nonsense & a waste of fucking time. And you have given up your job to watch kids training for other clubs teams & are content with it.
Centurions
Well-Known Member
Lol.And can't be arsed continuing with this nonsense I'm talking about Lopes.
pardoeofftomexico
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I'll agree that the error here was allowing him to reach 12 months left on his contract, an error we also made with Denayer. I'm no talking signing him up to a 4 or 5 year deal 12 months ago, but what's wrong with a 12 month extension? However, on the topic of a buyback clause, that would need to be agreed with both Monaco and Lopes I presume? If one, or both, parties refuse then there's not much City can do (ok, if Monaco refuse we could always look to sell elsewhere I suppose). Lopes' statement looks like he's still on good terms with the club, however these things can be for PR purposes so we can't be 100% certain he isn't feeling a bit aggrieved at not getting regular time at City.
Oh, and none of this is as big a fuck up as the De Gea debacle! That's cost United £30m, plus the reputational damage that is still being caused by the uncertainty, and the blaming between United and Real. City got/will get £9m for Lopes, and the World isn't scrutinising us over it. Even if he turns out to be a £40m/£50m player in the future we'll be cut some slack as it's far from certain. People aren't vilifying Chelsea/Mourinho for selling De Bruyne and look what he's done since.
Denayer signed a 5 year contract with City this summer. Lopes could have signed also had he wanted. He obviously didn't want to. There is very unlikely to be a buyback clause based on the figure Monaco paid.
Neville Kneville
Well-Known Member
A question for anyone who has any interest in the academy & goes to watch games regularly.
Unless City change their current mode of operating, exactly what are you watching & why ?
Unless City change their current mode of operating, exactly what are you watching & why ?
Of course its a major fuck up letting highly talented youth players go without a buy back clause, if that is what has happened. I hope it hasn't. Guess we'll find out.
It's impossible to argue otherwise. Nev talks an absolute huge amount of sense about city in general and the levels people are going to try and put his opinions down as emotive hyperbole baffle me. He clearly cares about the club and he wants to see some of our (very) talented kids come through. And they are very talented, there's no question about it.. Lopes is clearly a highly talented little footballer. He was up and down for Lille, but Lille were fucking shite. Anything good he did he had to do himself in a boring, defensive team. Honestly think he could end up around a Pedro/Sanchez level very easily. He could reach James Rodriguez levels. Lille's management team said the same thing...and imagine how much it'd cost to buy Sanchez or Rodriguez now, or a 22 year old Pedro. If we had the option to resign Lopes in two years for £20m, an example of a buy back clause we could have, that'd be brilliant, cos other teams would have to pay at least twice that if he gets as good as he can.
I don't get why people are arguing against that? It's sound business logic. We ballsed up majorly by letting his contract run down, and the VERY least we could do to salvage something from this particular transaction was ensure a buy back clause. I hope we have.
DISCLAIMER - In before anyone says im anti-Txiki or Pellers, i'm not. I just tend to prefer to analyse each decision on its own individual merits. Sterling in? Good. Lopes out? Not good. De Bruyne in? Amazing. Leaving Zuculini potentially stranded without football? Not good....etc etc. It's been a great summer, but it hasnt been perfect. Nowt wrong with admitting that.
FWIW - i dont think a great club truly becomes a 'Great' club until it has some players of its own that come through and define the club. Raul. Casillas. Messi. Cruyff. Van Basten. Puyol. Xavi...even Beckham. Scholes. Giggs. Beckenbauer. Schweinsteiger.... genuinely believe that every truly great club at some point has their 'own' players that forge that true identity and connection to the fanbase. That's when an era is truly made and defined... i dont want Sterlings and KDBs forever personally - dont get me wrong, i like that, but i do want someone to come through, and im not asking for the world here, maybe two players over three years, to feel like 'ours'. It means more. And its possible, hence why i twinge with despair when i see how we handle Denayer and Lopes.
It's impossible to argue otherwise. Nev talks an absolute huge amount of sense about city in general and the levels people are going to try and put his opinions down as emotive hyperbole baffle me. He clearly cares about the club and he wants to see some of our (very) talented kids come through. And they are very talented, there's no question about it.. Lopes is clearly a highly talented little footballer. He was up and down for Lille, but Lille were fucking shite. Anything good he did he had to do himself in a boring, defensive team. Honestly think he could end up around a Pedro/Sanchez level very easily. He could reach James Rodriguez levels. Lille's management team said the same thing...and imagine how much it'd cost to buy Sanchez or Rodriguez now, or a 22 year old Pedro. If we had the option to resign Lopes in two years for £20m, an example of a buy back clause we could have, that'd be brilliant, cos other teams would have to pay at least twice that if he gets as good as he can.
I don't get why people are arguing against that? It's sound business logic. We ballsed up majorly by letting his contract run down, and the VERY least we could do to salvage something from this particular transaction was ensure a buy back clause. I hope we have.
DISCLAIMER - In before anyone says im anti-Txiki or Pellers, i'm not. I just tend to prefer to analyse each decision on its own individual merits. Sterling in? Good. Lopes out? Not good. De Bruyne in? Amazing. Leaving Zuculini potentially stranded without football? Not good....etc etc. It's been a great summer, but it hasnt been perfect. Nowt wrong with admitting that.
FWIW - i dont think a great club truly becomes a 'Great' club until it has some players of its own that come through and define the club. Raul. Casillas. Messi. Cruyff. Van Basten. Puyol. Xavi...even Beckham. Scholes. Giggs. Beckenbauer. Schweinsteiger.... genuinely believe that every truly great club at some point has their 'own' players that forge that true identity and connection to the fanbase. That's when an era is truly made and defined... i dont want Sterlings and KDBs forever personally - dont get me wrong, i like that, but i do want someone to come through, and im not asking for the world here, maybe two players over three years, to feel like 'ours'. It means more. And its possible, hence why i twinge with despair when i see how we handle Denayer and Lopes.
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JoeMercer'sWay
Well-Known Member
It depends if you give a shit & take an interest or not. Many of you don't. I do. I watched him play quite a fair bit for Lille & he ranged from 'ok' to fantastic. The rags have just paid 36 mil rising to 50 plus, for 'ok' in the same league. That bloke may end up better than Lopes or not as good. Both outcomes are possible
Transfer fees are only going one way, up & up & up. If Lopes is 'ok' he'll be worth double what we got for him, if he's fantastic, he'll be worth 10 times what we got. If we haven't got a buyback then it's a potential fucking disaster, especially when you read his tweets & how much he loves the club. De Gea doesn't love Utd & had no reason to sign. If Real Madrid had been hunting Lopes, it would be pretty understandable we lost him. Lopes should have been signed ages ago.
I've been completely supportive of City on transfers in. But I'm not kissing their arses if they've fucked up. All of the most talented kids should be signed up long term & if they are allowed to leave like this, we should have a buyback & a sell-on clause.
I trust we have.
However, he could be worth 10 times what we sold him for, yet we may not need him then anyway. Can only have 25 players.
A question for anyone who has any interest in the academy & goes to watch games regularly.
Unless City change their current mode of operating, exactly what are you watching & why ?
The future of City, the future of English football, the future of European football, the future of world football.
as well as better football than most professional clubs at a cheap price, in great facilities.
Neville Kneville
Well-Known Member
However, he could be worth 10 times what we sold him for, yet we may not need him then anyway. Can only have 25 players.
The future of City, the future of English football, the future of European football, the future of world football.
as well as better football than most professional clubs at a cheap price, in great facilities.
But not necessarily any of them ever play more than a couple of games for City.
How will you know that any of the players you are watching, no matter how good, will actually ever become City players ? If players can do basically everything right, & not even get on the subs' bench, how do you know that even one of them will play for City, even if it turns out they are actually good enough ? How do you know that you will find out they are good enough, before they leave the club, if the plan is not to play them ?
I've been watching the current group come through for the last few years & imo some are good enough to be in this squad being introduced to the first team. I don't know for sure that Lopes & Denayer would become stars at City, but I know they are good enough to be given the benefit of a chance. I don't know if I'll ever see either again. I don't know if I'll ever see Brandon Barker or Thierry Ambrose get a decent chance. I believe Iheanacho will, but he's not fro the academy anyhow.
Personally, I'm not bothering investing regular time sitting in the rain & freezing cold, watching kids being groomed to play for Monaco or Gent. If we start to use some in our squad then I'll start attending more often again, or if Diaz turns out t be Messi, but otherwise, I'll just stick to watching the first team & the loanees occasionally on tv & maybe take in an occasional academy game, but n the whole I'll just stick to the first team from now on.
JoeMercer'sWay
Well-Known Member
But not necessarily any of them ever play more than a couple of games for City.
How will you know that any of the players you are watching, no matter how good, will actually ever become City players ? If players can do basically everything right, & not even get on the subs' bench, how do you know that even one of them will play for City, even if it turns out they are actually good enough ? How do you know that you will find out they are good enough, before they leave the club, if the plan is not to play them ?
I've been watching the current group come through for the last few years & imo some are good enough to be in this squad being introduced to the first team. I don't know for sure that Lopes & Denayer would become stars at City, but I know they are good enough to be given the benefit of a chance. I don't know if I'll ever see either again. I don't know if I'll ever see Brandon Barker or Thierry Ambrose get a decent chance. I believe Iheanacho will, but he's not fro the academy anyhow.
Personally, I'm not bothering investing regular time sitting in the rain & freezing cold, watching kids being groomed to play for Monaco or Gent. If we start to use some in our squad then I'll start attending more often again, or if Diaz turns out t be Messi, but otherwise, I'll just stick to watching the first team & the loanees occasionally on tv & maybe take in an occasional academy game, but n the whole I'll just stick to the first team from now on.
good for you.
I have a little more faith, will take it for what it is and understand the wider picture, and enjoy the entertainment on offer. At the end of the day for the past few years I've refereed youth football fairly regularly, and I fill with joy the day I turn up and see a kid whose actually got something, it's a joy to watch. Having that, from a whole youth team, at a cheap price, and watch them develop and forge their careers, is fun, if one of them makes it with us, great, if not then I know we're doing our bit for the community and football as a whole, which is still important, regardless of the competition at the top end.
Take it for what it is rather than purely what your idealisation wants it to be.
Neville Kneville
Well-Known Member
good for you.
I have a little more faith, will take it for what it is and understand the wider picture, and enjoy the entertainment on offer. At the end of the day for the past few years I've refereed youth football fairly regularly, and I fill with joy the day I turn up and see a kid whose actually got something, it's a joy to watch. Having that, from a whole youth team, at a cheap price, and watch them develop and forge their careers, is fun, if one of them makes it with us, great, if not then I know we're doing our bit for the community and football as a whole, which is still important, regardless of the competition at the top end.
Take it for what it is rather than purely what your idealisation wants it to be.
I admire you for taking that interest, but my main interest at that level has always been City.
I figured were building something special, not just with the quality of the kids, but also the playing style which is different/better than any other club in this country & that we were putting together a system where the whole is even better than the individuals in it, so for instance, every player promoted to the first team wouldn't have to be a genius, just able to make the system work whilst the real genius players did their thing . I recon that's what Vieira thought/thinks he was doing. I found that even more exciting than the first team, like we were building the next stage of football, a level ahead of everyone else.
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