CitizenTID
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- 9 Feb 2013
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This was my reply to the few posters who responded to my first post (which I can't remember since it'd been removed due to being misinterpreted by the looks of it but is a further elaboration of it):
To be clear I haven't defended either side or offered opinion on the EDL's (or other) political views but seems my first post was taken wrongly because I didn't support what Saffiyah actually did.
P.S. On the video there was no mention of a minutes silence around the time the commotion started (he'd just finished his speech before the next guy presumably).
Right I watched up to the kerfuffle on the full video.
From their speech, clearly they aren't the most articulate in getting their feelings across and are prone to swearing practically every sentence (you shouldn't dismiss them for poor communication skills) and taking a hard line on issues relating to radical Islam (though they mention this at the start they make the mistake of dropping the "radical" part and just referring to Islam, which passers-by would interpret as only hate speech). From that speech (and what they were talking about before it all kicked off), they actually are giving an anti-left-wing globalism/multiculturalism, anti-communism/socialism speech as much as anything else before the girl in the hijab (that Saffiyah Khan says she intervened to defend) starts shouting "Nazis" repeatedly from afar to the left whereby she angers some nearby EDL straddlers which causes a bit of a commotion and some start with "muslim scum off our streets." The police do a great job of dealing with the situation and the EDL (also due to calls from their stage) begin to return to their protest area. Saffiyah Khan has entered during the police dealing with it (she stands on the periphery watching) and some other anti-EDL protestors have gathered as the EDL supporters are walking back - then the anti-EDL gathering start to should "Nazi scum off our streets" in which Saffiyah is central to starting this (she says in an interview on the news she does this to show solidarity in defending the girl in the hijab who'd been confronted, whereas this is the first time she speaks up as the EDL have begun walking back - she was probably too far away to realise the girl in the hijab actually started it). This then all kicks off into a bit of a kerfuffle.
So it was practically as I first posted. The "muslim scum off our streets" is obviously extreme, unacceptable behaviour on their part - however this is in response to them being called Nazis which has got them emotional whereby they replied in an at least equally extreme manner (typical human nature in argumentative scenarios). The EDL aren't Nazis in any sense of the word. They're (clumsily/unintelligently) trying to protect what they deem as their culture against politics/societal attitudes that they perceive have had a negative impact on that and the speaker at the start (representing the EDL) is clear it's not immigration to the country he has a problem with - this is not Nazism and I'm sure they take offence to this where they are clearly very patriotic and their fathers/grandfathers fought the Nazis to preserve British culture and way of life.
Where the actual purpose of the EDL is concerned, the tension always comes down to a collision of politics (esp. with antifa) and misunderstanding/unwillingness to listen (e.g. herd mentality I mentioned which happens with so much in our society today, probably partly due to the short attention span phenomenon of the technology age). People typically don't spend the time to form their own objective, uninfluenced opinion. There are no extreme politics involved in this, therefore both sides have a right to their views (basic example: socialism vs. nationalism). It always seems to come down to an "us vs. them" mentality (same thing happens in Westminster at the top level of politics, e.g. labour vs. tories dismissing each other on matters due to preconceived views of one another) rather than having the intelligence to at least listen to the other side objectively without preconceived bias whereby they can work together to resolve issues for the benefit of everyone.
Re: "like the EDL do?" - When I've seen Tommy Robinson interviewed such as on Question Time, people jeered him before he got his first few words out. They aren't prepared to listen to what he has to say when he was trying to have a reasonable debate - this escalates tension within the argument and all sides end up attacking one another even if it contradicts the stance they were trying to take since, again in typical human nature, people end up going on the verbal attack when they feel they have been themselves, emotions rise = people get less articulate and focus is lost on the points they tried to get across. You can't control what everyone in society feels about certain matters, so as I said, the issues /tensions will be there in society whether you like it or not - if you want to iron them out instead of escalating them the only thing you can do is take what every side has to say without preconceived bias and work on the best/most fair solution with them (yes you will have to concede some things but this will yield a balanced outcome that best represents views within the nation).
In the same spirit of my point - look at the progress made in Northern Ireland. Within a few decades of throwing grenades at funerals: it may not be perfect but they came to a peaceful democratic solution after they began to listen to one another and understand the other's point of view. In some cases they even became mates and whilst not liking the other's views, they became respectful in their behaviour when dealing with those views.
To be clear I haven't defended either side or offered opinion on the EDL's (or other) political views but seems my first post was taken wrongly because I didn't support what Saffiyah actually did.
P.S. On the video there was no mention of a minutes silence around the time the commotion started (he'd just finished his speech before the next guy presumably).
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