The General Election Thread

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SNP came second in the only three seats that they failed to win

that is incredible

I hope the Scots are happy to have all those MP's sat on the opposition benches with little or no power
 
Jesus Christ I'm laughing so much at this that I can barely breathe

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2015/may/08/democracy-a-religion-that-has-failed-the-poor" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... d-the-poor</a>

Democracy is a religion that has failed the poor

Voting expresses our desire to belong. But is it worth belonging to a country that has become little more than an aggregation of self-interest?

Right now I feel ashamed to be English. Ashamed to belong to a country that has clearly identified itself as insular, self-absorbed and apparently caring so little for the most vulnerable people among us. Why did a million people visiting food banks make such a minimal difference? Did we just vote for our own narrow concerns and sod the rest? Maybe that’s why the pollsters got it so badly wrong: we are not so much a nation of shy voters as of ashamed voters, people who want to present to the nice polling man as socially inclusive, but who, in the privacy of the booth, tick the box of our own self-interest.

Rewind 24 hours and it felt so different. Thursday morning was lovely in London, full of the promise of spring. Even the spat I had with the man outside my polling station shouting at “fucking immigrants” didn’t disrupt an overall feeling of optimism. Were people walking just a little bit more purposefully? Was I mistaken in detecting some calm excitement, almost an unspoken communal bonhomie? Perhaps also a feeling of empowerment, a sense that it was “the people” that could now make a difference. But by bedtime the spell had been broken. Things were going to stay the same. No real difference had been made.

The utterly miserable thought strikes me that Russell Brand just might have been right. What difference did my vote make? Why indeed do people vote, and care so passionately about voting, particularly in constituencies in which voting one way or the other won’t make a blind bit of difference? And why do the poor vote when, by voting, they merely give legitimacy to a system that connives with their oppression and alienation? The anthropologist Mukulika Banerjee suggests a fascinating answer: elections are like religious rituals, often devoid of rational purpose or efficacy for the individual participant, but full of symbolic meaning. They are the nearest thing the secular has to the sacred, presenting a moment of empowerment.

But is this empowerment illusory? Is, as Banerjee asks, “the ability to vote … a necessary safety valve which allows for the airing of popular disaffection, but which nevertheless ultimately restores the status quo. In such a reading, elections require the complicity of all participants in a deliberate mis-recognition of the emptiness of its procedures and the lack of any significant changes which this ritual brings about, but are a necessary charade to mollify a restless electorate.” The morning after all the hope of election day feels a lot like this.

But rejecting cynicism, Banerjee insists that voting is more an expression of one’s citizenship than a rational procedure for changing the world. Why else would someone go out of their way to find a polling station only to spoil their ballot paper? Surely because being handed a blank ballot paper in the polling station is a way in which one’s rights – even identity – are acknowledged. “If I don’t even vote, no one will know I exist,” is what one man told Banerjee while she was conducting her research in rural “semi-forgotten” parts of India. Another said: “If we don’t vote, how can we prove we are citizens of this country?”

I spent some of election morning with a woman who wasn’t sure if she was eligible to vote. We spent a couple of hours trudging round polling stations, phoning up the town hall, working out if she was. It was obviously terribly important to her – but the funny thing was, despite all this, she didn’t really know who to vote for. That wasn’t really the point.

Church-speak for this is: belonging precedes believing. The idea is that people tend to join churches not because of any specific belief but as a marker of belonging. And the rituals of the church are more an expression of this belonging then they are an ideological statement of faith. So too the rituals of democracy. We try and control the gods of Rothermere and Murdoch with our electoral intercessions. But maybe they are just too powerful, too remote. “As flies to wanton boys, are we to the gods.” Shakespeare had it right.

If that was a comedian I'd buy his shit Christmas DVD.
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
I think, along with 1997 and 1945 this will go down as a truly seismic election night whose consequences will be just as far reaching as both those general elections.

The Tories have demonstrated that this nation's voters are conservative with a small 'c' and whether you admire or revile George Osborne it's difficult to escape from the fact that he's engineered what appears to be a master stroke of timing with the economy; whether it's a sleight of hand or not, remains to be seen. Cameron, as incumbent Prime Minster always oozed palpably more statesmanship than Miliband, which will have assisted the Tories cause greatly. He's in for a testing second term though. The right wing of his party is populated by an odious bunch of cunts and with such a small majority, they will hold a bit more of the whip hand than the last parliament when they were kept in check by the Lib Dem voting block.

Labour are potentially staring into the abyss. In all probability without that rump of Scottish MPs they will be virtually unelectable for the next decade as the economy continues to grow. They've got a lot of big decisions to make. Shift to the left and 'virtually' becomes 'completely' - and they need to guard against this imo. The bare facts are that most people in this country who engage with the electoral process either are, or consider themselves to be middle class. This is an inescapable mathematical truth which they forget at their peril. Their next leader needs to be chosen wisely.

I'm hugely disappointed about the Lib Dem return, which I expected to be nearer the 25 mark. I felt they did the right thing in 2010 and have played a part in curtailing the worst excesses of the Tories. They also had a lot of good constituency MPs who've lost their seats. This country needs a broad range of political parties and I really hope that this setback doesn't consign the party to a period of political irrelevance like they suffered in the middle of the last century. It's possible they could shift significantly to the left to fill the gap potentially left by Labour. I certainly don't blame Clegg for going into coalition with the Tories. Anyone who does fails to appreciate what ultimately motivates politicians: power. To expect a politician not to seize such an opportunity is like expecting a City fan not to smile when united get beat.

UKIP have peaked as a political force imo, but they also might be able to fill the gap left by a Labour shift to the right. Appealing to the disenfranchised white working classes is something they've latched onto to some effect more recently and a tactic they may well try to develop further going forward. Their pitiful return in terms of the number of seats compared to the number of votes they garnered is a shameful indictment on an electoral system which is both anachronistic and undemocratic. The EU referendum could, whichever way it goes, prove to be a pivotal moment in the downwards decline of the party, however.

The SNP are huge winners, obviously. They'll get pretty much anything they want short of independence from the Tories. It suits both their agendas. Notwithstanding that, I believe the fault lines in the Union are so pronounced now that full blown independence is inevitable within a decade. There will be significant pressure from the people both nations to effectuate that in the coming years, especially from Scotland when the price of oil starts to rise again.

As to me, what will the next five years hold? I'll be better of financially, of that I'm pretty certain. I've had a few tough years in that regard and I've really started to come out the other side in the last twelve months. I fully expect that to continue under a Conservative government, as I believe they are discernibly better at running the economy than Labour.

That doesn't mean I'm happy with the outcome, however. I believe in positively engaging with Europe and there are too many people in the Tory party who are fundamentally at odds with me on this. Their right wing is populated by deeply unpleasant people who are a complete anathema to my liberal outlook on life and the world. Primarily, however, I want to be part of a country at ease with itself. There will always be people doing better than others: that is the nature of human affairs, but those that are doing well have a duty to try and help those less fortunate than themselves. We are a wealthy country and the social care we provide for those less fortunate should reflect that. I believe this is something which Conservatives simply fail to accept or appreciate sufficiently. Maybe I'm a left wing Tory at heart, but that doesn't mean I could ever bring myself to vote for them. Too many cunts by far.

Whatever I think, it's going to be an interesting five years. To think, five years ago we hadn't won a trophy for 34 years.

How time flies.
Best post on the previous 30 pages (other than PB calling me pretty).
 
Just got in after visiting a Blue in hospital in Wigan, what's going on, who's had a warning who's been banned and how many have gone missing?
I'v got about 100 pages to go back through, is it worth it?
 
mackenzie said:
Pretty sure Ducado doesn't work for the Public Sector.
And the attacks on Rascal were pretty unsavoury. Rascal once posted something, a couple of years back, that gave insight into how his life really is as someone who suffers from quite debilitating conditions. If you have met him in real life then you understand where he is coming from.
He's a great guy and I'm fortunate enough to call him a mate.

I just hope he's ok, usually when he disappears, it's because he's chasing the nurses again.
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
I think, along with 1997 and 1945 this will go down as a truly seismic election night whose consequences will be just as far reaching as both those general elections.

The Tories have demonstrated that this nation's voters are conservative with a small 'c' and whether you admire or revile George Osborne it's difficult to escape from the fact that he's engineered what appears to be a master stroke of timing with the economy; whether it's a sleight of hand or not, remains to be seen. Cameron, as incumbent Prime Minster always oozed palpably more statesmanship than Miliband, which will have assisted the Tories cause greatly. He's in for a testing second term though. The right wing of his party is populated by an odious bunch of c**ts and with such a small majority, they will hold a bit more of the whip hand than the last parliament when they were kept in check by the Lib Dem voting block.

Labour are potentially staring into the abyss. In all probability without that rump of Scottish MPs they will be virtually unelectable for the next decade as the economy continues to grow. They've got a lot of big decisions to make. Shift to the left and 'virtually' becomes 'completely' - and they need to guard against this imo. The bare facts are that most people in this country who engage with the electoral process either are, or consider themselves to be middle class. This is an inescapable mathematical truth which they forget at their peril. Their next leader needs to be chosen wisely.

I'm hugely disappointed about the Lib Dem return, which I expected to be nearer the 25 mark. I felt they did the right thing in 2010 and have played a part in curtailing the worst excesses of the Tories. They also had a lot of good constituency MPs who've lost their seats. This country needs a broad range of political parties and I really hope that this setback doesn't consign the party to a period of political irrelevance like they suffered in the middle of the last century. It's possible they could shift significantly to the left to fill the gap potentially left by Labour. I certainly don't blame Clegg for going into coalition with the Tories. Anyone who does fails to appreciate what ultimately motivates politicians: power. To expect a politician not to seize such an opportunity is like expecting a City fan not to smile when united get beat.

UKIP have peaked as a political force imo, but they also might be able to fill the gap left by a Labour shift to the right. Appealing to the disenfranchised white working classes is something they've latched onto to some effect more recently and a tactic they may well try to develop further going forward. Their pitiful return in terms of the number of seats compared to the number of votes they garnered is a shameful indictment on an electoral system which is both anachronistic and undemocratic. The EU referendum could, whichever way it goes, prove to be a pivotal moment in the downwards decline of the party, however.

The SNP are huge winners, obviously. They'll get pretty much anything they want short of independence from the Tories. It suits both their agendas. Notwithstanding that, I believe the fault lines in the Union are so pronounced now that full blown independence is inevitable within a decade. There will be significant pressure from the people both nations to effectuate that in the coming years, especially from Scotland when the price of oil starts to rise again.

As to me, what will the next five years hold? I'll be better of financially, of that I'm pretty certain. I've had a few tough years in that regard and I've really started to come out the other side in the last twelve months. I fully expect that to continue under a Conservative government, as I believe they are discernibly better at running the economy than Labour.

That doesn't mean I'm happy with the outcome, however. I believe in positively engaging with Europe and there are too many people in the Tory party who are fundamentally at odds with me on this. Their right wing is populated by deeply unpleasant people who are a complete anathema to my liberal outlook on life and the world. Primarily, however, I want to be part of a country at ease with itself. There will always be people doing better than others: that is the nature of human affairs, but those that are doing well have a duty to try and help those less fortunate than themselves. We are a wealthy country and the social care we provide for those less fortunate should reflect that. I believe this is something which Conservatives simply fail to accept or appreciate sufficiently. Maybe I'm a left wing Tory at heart, but that doesn't mean I could ever bring myself to vote for them. Too many c**ts by far.

Whatever I think, it's going to be an interesting five years. To think, five years ago we hadn't won a trophy for 34 years.

How time flies.
1970 and 1992 were also unexpected Election nights .
I still don't know how Kinnock lost that election to John Major .
Labour will come back again .
They just need a strong leader .
With proper policy's .
 
mackenzie said:
Pretty sure Ducado doesn't work for the Public Sector.
And the attacks on Rascal were pretty unsavoury. Rascal once posted something, a couple of years back, that gave insight into how his life really is as someone who suffers from quite debilitating conditions. If you have met him in real life then you understand where he is coming from.

I normally don't comment on things that I have not been involved in but

As an accusation has been made directly against me can I just say I wasn't even on line when this happened I never saw it so I presume that it was all deleted.

I have had my run ins with Rascal and it has been heated but we both gave and got as good as each other but I actually have a disabled wife so I do understand better than most there is a line even if Rascal has pushed it himself sometimes.
 
I felt about a week or so before the end that the Tories were playing it quite well. They'd got rid of the bickering of the debates early, allowed Miliband to make lots of early noise and momentum that made it look like he was ahead, but they allowed him to run out of steam by getting ahead early and keeping Cameron away from him, meaning he had to try things like the stone to keep his momentum going.

So the Tories let that happen and let there be an opposition debate early on,, putting those minor parties in with Ed and thus scaring half the country to death about the prospect of a anti-austerity Labour coalition, sewing the seed of doubt early and then in the final week or two the Tories exploited that beautifully.

They've absolutely managed Ed and Labour beautifully. It's like Damo saying earlier about Cameron being more than a nice guy, his lot are actually fairly ruthless politicians at the same time. What a campaign they've pulled off.
 
malg said:
Christ, I can't believe the Conservatives came anywhere near second in Scotland. UKIP done well. Farage needs to stay on as leader.
Cameron has taken their reason to be though with the referendum.

Once the country votes to stay in the EU, UKIP are finished n
 
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