The Sun is now supporting Cameron

Swales lives said:
Bingobango, I have a deep hatred for the Tories, but even the depths of my hate
would be nothing to how the Scots feel about them. I think the tvvats will get in though,
England is full of brainless zombies who care more about PS3s than politics.

I was born in Warrington in the early 80s, then grew up in Scotland, so I've had it worse from these shitbags (hehe) I'm a reasonable man, but when people start going on about how good the Tories are looking I get scared. They did it once, and they'll do that stuff again. Like you, I think they will get in, though hopefully without a huge majority - a coalition with the Lib Dems might keep the fuckers in line.

Is it any wonder the Tories are practically extinct in Scotland though? They used it as a test-bed for all these hideous policies (poll tax etc) before foisting them on the rest. Unforgiveable.
 
bronco said:
BingoBango said:
Balti said:
England did not vote Brown in and England will not vote Brown, or the Labour Party, in. The man is a liability. He should sit in the Scottish Assembly voting on Scottish issues that affect Scottish people - if they'll have him.

And the Taxman should take that feckin Union Jack down at number 10 seeing as his party has presided over the political break up of our Union and the implementation of Health and Education policies in Scotland and Wales that the English are apparently not entitled to, despite paying the highest taxes on record for shitty 'public services' that mostly don't actually exist any more.

What do these people actually do for us apart from tax the living daylights out of us for fewer and fewer services? The whole political structure is antiquated and needs to be completely overhauled, modernised and trimmed.

I'd prefer it if there were other truly democratic options but in the absence of them then change is the best that we can hope for and Cameron is the only viable option. Not that it will make much difference.......

Perhaps it's just because there are fewer people living in Scotland than in England, and we can afford to do things like free prescriptions etc up there.

Do people not remember the 80s? And if the do, how can they even consider voting for the Tories?



absolutely spot on - the only people with happy memories of the tories in power during the 80,s and 90,s are the handful of business people who made a great deal of money, usually at the expense of their down trodden workforce whom they were legally allowed (by tory abolition of union powers ) to treat like dirt , they changed the landscape of this country for ever and i personally hold them responsible for the social underclass that infest our towns and cities these days . i had a chuckle to myself this week when "dave" was quoted as saying - they were going to fix broken britain ? IT WAS THOSE BASTARDS WHO BROKE IT IN THE FIRST PLACE !

But New Labour have just carried on where the Tories left off. They are no better. Has the manufacturing industry been restored or even protected? No. Is unemployment rising? Yes. Are people losing their homes in ever greater numbers? Yes. Are taxes higher? Yes. Are 'public services' better? No. Have pensions been crippled (by Brown)? Yes. Have pensioners been better looked after? No. Have their council tax bill increases outstripped their meagre pension increases? Yes. Has there been less sleaze and corruption? No. Have we been in fewer wars? No. Have we abondoned nuclear missiles and energy? No. Is EducationEducationEducation better? No. is the NHS better? No. Are hospitals still closing? Yes. Have they presided over the demise of NHS dentists? Yes. Are community schools still being closed? Yes. Is there less Crime? No. Did they give us the promised vote on europe? No. Did they break their promise and increase university top-up fees? Yes, in England. Do the Scots vote on English only matters? Yes. Do the English vote on Scottish only issues? No. Are they weakening the Union? Yes. Did they break their promise on the 10p tax rate? Yes. Do they really think that HazelfeckinBlear is actually a good politician? Apparently Yes. Have they spent more and more of our money on a nanny state that produces no significant improvements? Yes. Have they failed miserably? Yes. Etc etc etc etc etc.......................

Honestly just how has New Labour improved things in our country 'cos they don't look very different to me, and things are generally worse if anything for the majority. Under the Tories things got very messy at the end just like they are doing now. The only thing that has been proved to me is that 3 terms of either party is too many and that the worse excesses of each can be minimised by chopping and changing them every other term of office or two.
 
But New Labour have just carried on where the Tories left off. They are no better. Has the manufacturing industry been restored or even protected? No. Is unemployment rising? Yes. Are people losing their homes in ever greater numbers? Yes. Are taxes higher? Yes. Are 'public services' better? No. Have pensions been crippled (by Brown)? Yes. Have pensioners been better looked after? No. Have their council tax bill increases outstripped their meagre pension increases? Yes. Has there been less sleaze and corruption? No. Have we been in fewer wars? No. Have we abondoned nuclear missiles and energy? No. Is EducationEducationEducation better? No. is the NHS better? No. Are hospitals still closing? Yes. Have they presided over the demise of NHS dentists? Yes. Are community schools still being closed? Yes. Is there less Crime? No. Did they give us the promised vote on europe? No. Did they break their promise and increase university top-up fees? Yes, in England. Do the Scots vote on English only matters? Yes. Do the English vote on Scottish only issues? No. Are they weakening the Union? Yes. Did they break their promise on the 10p tax rate? Yes. Do they really think that HazelfeckinBlear is actually a good politician? Apparently Yes. Have they spent more and more of our money on a nanny state that produces no significant improvements? Yes. Have they failed miserably? Yes. Etc etc etc etc etc.......................

Honestly just how has New Labour improved things in our country 'cos they don't look very different to me, and things are generally worse if anything for the majority. Under the Tories things got very messy at the end just like they are doing now. The only thing that has been proved to me is that 3 terms of either party is too many and that the worse excesses of each can be minimised by chopping and changing them every other term of office or two

I should say, I'm not a Labour partisan by any means - I'd vote Lib Dem at the next election were it not for wanting to keep the Tories out.

But there is less crime now than in any recent period - Home Office figures back that up, as much as the Daily Mail etc would have us believe otherwise. The NHS, for all its manifold faults, is a wonderful thing - possibly the best thing about this country. I was in Australia recently and there (I didn't have a Medicare card since I was on a Tourist visa) I paid £30 to see a doctor, and £60 for a prescription. Admittedly you would get most of that back being an Aus citizen, but paying to visit the doctor?

And the minimum wage!

And things were more than 'a little messy' at the end of the Tories reign too, what about the preceding miserable decade before that?

Hazel Blears is a fucking drone, though. And James Purnell needs to be smacked in his fat mouth.

I like your final idea though, limiting terms. I'd be all for introducing proportional representation and forcing them to form coalitions, were it not for the fact that would probably let in headcases like the BNP.
 
BingoBango said:
But New Labour have just carried on where the Tories left off. They are no better. Has the manufacturing industry been restored or even protected? No. Is unemployment rising? Yes. Are people losing their homes in ever greater numbers? Yes. Are taxes higher? Yes. Are 'public services' better? No. Have pensions been crippled (by Brown)? Yes. Have pensioners been better looked after? No. Have their council tax bill increases outstripped their meagre pension increases? Yes. Has there been less sleaze and corruption? No. Have we been in fewer wars? No. Have we abondoned nuclear missiles and energy? No. Is EducationEducationEducation better? No. is the NHS better? No. Are hospitals still closing? Yes. Have they presided over the demise of NHS dentists? Yes. Are community schools still being closed? Yes. Is there less Crime? No. Did they give us the promised vote on europe? No. Did they break their promise and increase university top-up fees? Yes, in England. Do the Scots vote on English only matters? Yes. Do the English vote on Scottish only issues? No. Are they weakening the Union? Yes. Did they break their promise on the 10p tax rate? Yes. Do they really think that HazelfeckinBlear is actually a good politician? Apparently Yes. Have they spent more and more of our money on a nanny state that produces no significant improvements? Yes. Have they failed miserably? Yes. Etc etc etc etc etc.......................

Honestly just how has New Labour improved things in our country 'cos they don't look very different to me, and things are generally worse if anything for the majority. Under the Tories things got very messy at the end just like they are doing now. The only thing that has been proved to me is that 3 terms of either party is too many and that the worse excesses of each can be minimised by chopping and changing them every other term of office or two

I should say, I'm not a Labour partisan by any means - I'd vote Lib Dem at the next election were it not for wanting to keep the Tories out.

But there is less crime now than in any recent period - Home Office figures back that up, as much as the Daily Mail etc would have us believe otherwise. The NHS, for all its manifold faults, is a wonderful thing - possibly the best thing about this country. I was in Australia recently and there (I didn't have a Medicare card since I was on a Tourist visa) I paid £30 to see a doctor, and £60 for a prescription. Admittedly you would get most of that back being an Aus citizen, but paying to visit the doctor?

And the minimum wage!

And things were more than 'a little messy' at the end of the Tories reign too, what about the preceding miserable decade before that?

Hazel Blears is a fucking drone, though. And James Purnell needs to be smacked in his fat mouth.

I like your final idea though, limiting terms. I'd be all for introducing proportional representation and forcing them to form coalitions, were it not for the fact that would probably let in headcases like the BNP.


you make a lot of good points , expecially about drone politicians like blears (i am not a violent person but i would willingly smash her in the face with a cricket bat ) however, i would not take home office stats as gospel , their figures are just as likely to be spun as any other statistics .
 
BingoBango said:
I should say, I'm not a Labour partisan by any means - I'd vote Lib Dem at the next election were it not for wanting to keep the Tories out.

But there is less crime now than in any recent period - Home Office figures back that up, as much as the Daily Mail etc would have us believe otherwise. The NHS, for all its manifold faults, is a wonderful thing - possibly the best thing about this country. I was in Australia recently and there (I didn't have a Medicare card since I was on a Tourist visa) I paid £30 to see a doctor, and £60 for a prescription. Admittedly you would get most of that back being an Aus citizen, but paying to visit the doctor?

And the minimum wage!

And things were more than 'a little messy' at the end of the Tories reign too,what about the preceding miserable decade before that?
Hazel Blears is a fucking drone, though. And James Purnell needs to be smacked in his fat mouth.

I like your final idea though, limiting terms. I'd be all for introducing proportional representation and forcing them to form coalitions, were it not for the fact that would probably let in headcases like the BNP.

The Police have targets to hit. If they can talk someone out of officially reporting a crime they will do, as it's one less to solve and statistically keeps the crime rate down.

The other highlighted bit, have a look at my earlier post. The Tories had to rip everything up and start again. Thatcher was the only person with the balls big enough to take on the over powerfull Unions.
 
I wouldnt be far off if I said that most of this countries problems have in one way or another been caused by Margaret Thatcher
 
NQT said:
BingoBango said:
I should say, I'm not a Labour partisan by any means - I'd vote Lib Dem at the next election were it not for wanting to keep the Tories out.

But there is less crime now than in any recent period - Home Office figures back that up, as much as the Daily Mail etc would have us believe otherwise. The NHS, for all its manifold faults, is a wonderful thing - possibly the best thing about this country. I was in Australia recently and there (I didn't have a Medicare card since I was on a Tourist visa) I paid £30 to see a doctor, and £60 for a prescription. Admittedly you would get most of that back being an Aus citizen, but paying to visit the doctor?

And the minimum wage!

And things were more than 'a little messy' at the end of the Tories reign too,what about the preceding miserable decade before that?
Hazel Blears is a fucking drone, though. And James Purnell needs to be smacked in his fat mouth.

I like your final idea though, limiting terms. I'd be all for introducing proportional representation and forcing them to form coalitions, were it not for the fact that would probably let in headcases like the BNP.

The Police have targets to hit. If they can talk someone out of officially reporting a crime they will do, as it's one less to solve and statistically keeps the crime rate down.

The other highlighted bit, have a look at my earlier post. The Tories had to rip everything up and start again. Thatcher was the only person with the balls big enough to take on the over powerfull Unions.

to be fair Heath did too, but history only remembers the winners, always interested me why people hate Thatcher so much but rarely have much to say about Heath. Noone carps on about the winter of discontent and bodies piling up in motuarys, rubbish piled high in the street and power strikes.
It took Heath trying and failing to allow Thatcher to win her battle with the unions I think (just an opinion), there were too many that resented the power the unions had wielded against the Heath Government, and she learnt many of the lessons he hadnt had the chance to learn such as stockpiling coal, banning fly picketing etc etc
 
sorry to correct you but the winter of discontent (78/79)when it was that bad that gravediggers went on strike and people could not even bury their dead relatives , was actually under callaghans labour govt ,which created the vacuum that brought thatcher to power - heath was brought down as a result of the miners strike in 1974 . i personally believe she was viewed as a succesful prime minister for all the wrong reasons . she nationalised industries and sold the shares to the public (eg .BT )which were not actually hers to sell (if she was such a believer in free enterprise why not give the shares to the britis public for free ?) it was the same with her selling off council houses cheaply- she was selling off properties that had on the whole been built during labours post war years in power , she was basically selling what was not hers and in return the grateful recipients were voting here back in office , but the biggest con of all was in 1982 ;- 3 years after thatcher came to power she was well and truly on the bones of her arse (unemployment had tripled to 3 million - inflation was 22% , not quite zimbabwes standards but still more than 4 times than it is these days ) and her days were well and truly numbered , then "hey presto" a stupid military government in argentina who were actually more unpopular than her at the time(which believe me took some doing) decides to invade a group of islands mainly inhabitated by sheep a few miles from their coast which for some strange reason was a british colony . thatcher saw here chance and overnight became the "iron lady " the gullible british public swallowed it hole and the rest is history. like a number of politicians she has blood on her hands and i do not think the history books in years to come will remember her kindly .
 
I can't really disagree with what you've posted Bronco, but don't forget the absolute fucking mess this country was in when Thatcher inherited it. Whether she was right or wrong the only thing Labour put up against her was Michael Foot. When the country came to choose between her and him it's no wonder the Labour party got absolutely caned.
 

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