Donald Trump

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Dax777 said:
Folks are going to need to make up their mind here. Is he pandering to white nationalists and Racists or is he pandering to blacks? Doing both guarantees he loses both sides. Unless, that is there is a different explanation. You know, a more obvious one that fits the bill. Hmmmm! What could that be?

As I see it there is a serious Injustice being perpetrated in Sweden against an American. Granted, I have issues with the fact it's a popular American, which speaks to issues of 'class'. But that aside, I am happy he is stepping in or trying to in these situations.

I've seen the videos and the Swede was clearly the instigator. That he is walking free and ASAP Rocky is in jail is a travesty to say the least. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

In short, my position on the issue is fuck Sweden and everything they stand for.
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He is a white supprmeicst sympathiser and this stuff with A$AP is all because he has been found out as a racist **** and has had bar PR.


That simple really
 
Dax777 said:
Folks are going to need to make up their mind here. Is he pandering to white nationalists and Racists or is he pandering to blacks? Doing both guarantees he loses both sides. Unless, that is there is a different explanation. You know, a more obvious one that fits the bill. Hmmmm! What could that be?

As I see it there is a serious Injustice being perpetrated in Sweden against an American. Granted, I have issues with the fact it's a popular American, which speaks to issues of 'class'. But that aside, I am happy he is stepping in or trying to in these situations.

I've seen the videos and the Swede was clearly the instigator. That he is walking free and ASAP Rocky is in jail is a travesty to say the least. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

In short, my position on the issue is fuck Sweden and everything they stand for.
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Or he's sucking up to Kanye West, knowing that West has a lot of influence in a sector of the people. Utterly cynical votegrab.
 
MillionMilesAway said:
Or he's sucking up to Kanye West, knowing that West has a lot of influence in a sector of the people. Utterly cynical votegrab.
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1. He likes Kanye West. He is not sucking up. He is using his power to help his friends. ( This by the way is terrible, but still a far cry from the 'pandering' claim)

2. Any black person who doesn't tow the liberal line often gets vilified. Thus, Kanye West has been getting it since he came out and said he supports Trump in 2016. His been accused of being off his meds, losing it or just promoting his album by being controversial e.t.c. As far as politics go, the Left (especially the black left)are working 24-7 to discredit Kanye or any non-white who dsare supports Trump. See Don Lemon, April Ryan, Whoopee Goldberg, etc. For examples of Kanye bashing. This is neither new nor surprising.

3. For the record, Trump is an egomaniacal narcissist. And anything that makes him look like a power broker or someone who can make things happen, he does. It's really that simple. It's about his ego.

This isn't the first time he is doing something like this btw. He did the same with Lonzo Ball's kid brother and his UCLA teammates when they got jailed in China for shoplifting. Trump stepped in and pulled weight.

When Kanye's wife wanted a federal pardon for a Grandma who was jailed for a first time offense of drug trafficking, he granted it.

The woman was convicted under the mandatory minimum laws set up by Clinton (a Democrat) and her appeal was denied by Obama (a black Democrat) in 2017.

This inspite of the initiatives under Obama to release or reduce sentencing for drug offenders with minimum mandatory long sentences . Yet even when leaving with nothing to lose, Obama said Nope... Pass... despite the urging of 6 Congresspeople, her jail Warden, and a US Attorney.

Trump? Granted it immediately. And signed the first recommendation for prison reform. There is a lot to be said about what's horrible about Trump. See @FogBlueInSanFran for some candid personal descriptions of the man's failings. Petulant, childish, egotistical, etc. All of that very well underpins and explains his actions.

The claims of a calculated 'half racist' 'half black panderer' on the other hand? Just doesn't fit the facts. One will have to keep twisting logic and common sense to match that theory to reality.

But I see many here and elsewhere are trying their darndest. A for effort fellas. But It just doesn't fit.
 
urban genie said:
He is a white supprmeicst sympathiser and this stuff with A$AP is all because he has been found out as a racist **** and has had bar PR.


That simple really
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If you say so. But if you are right, he is the worst one of all time going by what he does.
 
Your opinion, and you're entitled to it.
I have mine, and am entitled to it.

That you feel obliged to sneer at an opinion you disagree with is your problem.
 
Dax777 said:
1. He likes Kanye West. He is not sucking up. He is using his power to help his friends. ( This by the way is terrible, but still a far cry from the 'pandering' claim)

2. Any black person who doesn't tow the liberal line often gets vilified. Thus, Kanye West has been getting it since he came out and said he supports Trump in 2016. His been accused of being off his meds, losing it or just promoting his album by being controversial e.t.c. As far as politics go, the Left (especially the black left)are working 24-7 to discredit Kanye or any non-white who dsare supports Trump. See Don Lemon, April Ryan, Whoopee Goldberg, etc. For examples of Kanye bashing. This is neither new nor surprising.

3. For the record, Trump is an egomaniacal narcissist. And anything that makes him look like a power broker or someone who can make things happen, he does. It's really that simple. It's about his ego.

This isn't the first time he is doing something like this btw. He did the same with Lonzo Ball's kid brother and his UCLA teammates when they got jailed in China for shoplifting. Trump stepped in and pulled weight.

When Kanye's wife wanted a federal pardon for a Grandma who was jailed for a first time offense of drug trafficking, he granted it.

The woman was convicted under the mandatory minimum laws set up by Clinton (a Democrat) and her appeal was denied by Obama (a black Democrat) in 2017.

This inspite of the initiatives under Obama to release or reduce sentencing for drug offenders with minimum mandatory long sentences . Yet even when leaving with nothing to lose, Obama said Nope... Pass... despite the urging of 6 Congresspeople, her jail Warden, and a US Attorney.

Trump? Granted it immediately. And signed the first recommendation for prison reform. There is a lot to be said about what's horrible about Trump. See @FogBlueInSanFran for some candid personal descriptions of the man's failings. Petulant, childish, egotistical, etc. All of that very well underpins and explains his actions.

The claims of a calculated 'half racist' 'half black panderer' on the other hand? Just doesn't fit the facts. One will have to keep twisting logic and common sense to match that theory to reality.

But I see many here and elsewhere are trying their darndest. A for effort fellas. But It just doesn't fit.
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I believe that he's not a racist; I've said that numerous times.

But he uses the racism of some of his supporters to craft words and policy that appeals to them, and simultaneously infuriates his opponents.

Here's what I understand and many don't, Dax:

That's fucking WORSE.
 
Dax777 said:
If you say so. But if you are right, he is the worst one of all time going by what he does.
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What exploits situations to suit his needs, as I said sympathiser, never said he was in the clan, but he encourages their bullshit for his own benefit,
 
FogBlueInSanFran said:
I believe that he's not a racist; I've said that numerous times.

But he uses the racism of some of his supporters to craft words and policy that appeals to them, and simultaneously infuriates his opponents.

Here's what I understand and many don't, Dax:

That's fucking WORSE.
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I'm going to need examples of policies he crafts to appeal to racists.

But at a more basic level, the problem with your claim ( as is with that of many here) is that it assumes facts that are at best ambiguous as if they were in fact incontrovertible truths.

It doesn't take much to see what's problematic about a claim like "he appeals to racist while simultaneously infuriating his opponents.' As one reason doesn't require the other. Nor are both reasons ever necessary to explain his actions.

Personally, I'm an Occam's razor kind of guy. The explanation that needs the least amount of twisting is most likely the right one.
 
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Dax777 said:
I'm going to need examples of policies he crafts to appeal to racists.

But at a more basic level, the problem with your claim ( as is with that of many here) is that it assumes facts that are at best ambiguous are in fact incontrovertible truths.

It doesn't take much to see what's problematic about a claim like "he appeals to racist while simultaneously infuriating his opponents.' As one reason doesn't require the other. Nor are both reasons ever necessary to explain his actions.

Personally, I'm an Occam's razor kind of guy. The explanation that needs the least amount of twisting is most likely the right one.
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Occams razor is the explanation that needs the least Speculation not twisting, change that last word and it changes the meaning.

And the explanation that need the least speculation is that he is racist, as he has openly been it, while there are those finding many reason why he isn't so if you do follow occams razor you believe he is racist.


Though you say you don't think he is and are not going to change your mind, so if I don't reply to your possible reply to this it is because my reply would be pointless.
 
MillionMilesAway said:
Your opinion, and you're entitled to it.
I have mine, and am entitled to it.

That you feel obliged to sneer at an opinion you disagree with is your problem.
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I'm not sneering. I'm expressing a different opinion. While putting prior opinions to test with the facts. I welcome anyone and everyone to do the same with my opinions. As @FogBlueInSanFran has clearly attempted to above.

I don't consider his attempt a sneer. If you think my examination of your opinion was a sneer, I apologise. That was not my intent. Rather, I'm pro examination of facts. Not because I like Trump. But rather on the principle that all claims should be fairly examined.

One day it might be you or I in the eye of of the popular storm. If such a day ever comes, I'd hope that those for and against whatever position you or I hold have the principle to examine the claim or claims being made in the clear light of facts and truth.
 
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urban genie said:
Occams razor is the explanation that needs the least Speculation not twisting, change that last word and it changes the meaning.

And the explanation that need the least speculation is that he is racist, as he has openly been it, while there are those finding many reason why he isn't so if you do follow occams razor you believe he is racist.


Though you say you don't think he is and are not going to change your mind, so if I don't reply to your possible reply to this it is because my reply would be pointless.
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Least speculation and least amount of twisting in this context are the same.

A racist would not keep going out of his way to help the people he supposedly hates. Even the kids of those who are openly hostile to him. See Lavar Ball.

A racist will not sign bills that disproportionately helps the people he is supposed to hate. Hence why you have to speculate that he is 1) a racist and 2) Likes Pandering to black folks as a cover for his racism. Those 2 claims simply don't align well. Hence not Occam's razor. There are many better explanations. That don't require the assumption of racist plus subterfuge.

Unfortunately, you have decided discussion should seize If it doesn't agree with you. I guess ur wish is my command :)
 
Dax777 said:
Least speculation and least amount of twisting in this context are the same.

A racist would not keep going out of his way to help the people he supposedly hates. Even the kids of those who are openly hostile to him. See Lavar Ball.

A racist will not sign bills that disproportionately helps the people he is supposed to hate. Hence why you have to speculate that he is 1) a racist and 2) Likes Pandering to black folks as a cover for his racism. Those 2 claims simply don't align well. Hence not Occam's razor. There are many better explanations. That don't require the assumption of racist plus subterfuge.

Unfortunately, you have decided discussion should seize If it doesn't agree with you. I guess ur wish is my command :)
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So you're saying he cant be racist if he does something to help a black man that also benefits him? Not as 'pardon the pun' black and white as that
 
Dax777 said:
Least speculation and least amount of twisting in this context are the same.

A racist would not keep going out of his way to help the people he supposedly hates. Even the kids of those who are openly hostile to him. See Lavar Ball.

A racist will not sign bills that disproportionately helps the people he is supposed to hate. Hence why you have to speculate that he is 1) a racist and 2) Likes Pandering to black folks as a cover for his racism. Those 2 claims simply don't align well. Hence not Occam's razor. There are many better explanations. That don't require the assumption of racist plus subterfuge.

Unfortunately, you have decided discussion should seize If it doesn't agree with you. I guess ur wish is my command :)
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No point repeating the same think with no chance of a change of opinion, wastes my time and yours, that isn't shutting down discussion because I odn't like the counter arguement, it's not acceptign your postion and finding something more useful to do to fulfil my time.
 
Dax777 said:
I'm going to need examples of policies he crafts to appeal to racists.

But at a more basic level, the problem with your claim ( as is with that of many here) is that it assumes facts that are at best ambiguous as if they were in fact incontrovertible truths.

It doesn't take much to see what's problematic about a claim like "he appeals to racist while simultaneously infuriating his opponents.' As one reason doesn't require the other. Nor are both reasons ever necessary to explain his actions.

Personally, I'm an Occam's razor kind of guy. The explanation that needs the least amount of twisting is most likely the right one.
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I said words and policies, not just policies. And, for the 4,587th time, all one needs is the words. The policies are not relevant once the words are spoken. That's my entire objection to the man.

The wall.

The census question.

"Very fine people on both sides".

"Go back and help fix the totally broken and crime infested places from which they came." Said to Americans.

“When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending the best."

Lowering the refugee quota after HHS determined "the net fiscal impact of refugees was positive over the [last] 10-year period, at $63 billion" (I'm close to this one as some of my economic research is in the HHS report).

Then there's this -- related to education and housing -- though one might be prepared to argue the "disparate impact" idea:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...d3874f1ac36_story.html?utm_term=.e050e9451b42

Happy to find more. Shouldn't be hard. These were off the top of my head.

Incidentally, IMO, if you were actually an Occam's Razor kind of guy, you wouldn't be arguing the point.
 
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