Another new Brexit thread

[Vic]

Looks like those odds have shortened considerably from a “million-to-one against” then.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...f-no-deal-brexit-are-a-million-to-one-against

The chance of anything coming from Mars...

 

[cibaman]

Once again for those at the back


They will not give any concessions that will risk the further break up of the Eu......they will not allow us to trade with them without a customs border or union. And the certainly will not enter into any trade agreement without settlement of the agreed outstanding amount.

Also, by adopting Trump tactics, Johnson is making it more difficult for them to offer concessions. If mini Trump is seen to defeat them, how much more difficult would it be for them when dealing with the real thing?

 

[George Hannah]

Looks like those odds have shortened considerably from a “million-to-one against” then.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...f-no-deal-brexit-are-a-million-to-one-against

Do I detect a certain anxious restlessness at the back? Calm yourselves we are going nowhere except deeper into the bosom of our superstate, they killed Brexit long ago.

 

[mcfc1632]

Once again for those at the back


They will not give any concessions that will risk the further break up of the Eu......they will not allow us to trade with them without a customs border or union. And the certainly will not enter into any trade agreement without settlement of the agreed outstanding amount.

Your comments in no way contradict the veracity of my post

 

[mcfc1632]

They have a deal which they negotiated with the UK PM and see no reason to re-visit it despite the bullshit Johnson continually spouts. He is aiming at a series of events that will make him out to the worst PM ever..............and given who he succeeded that would be quite a feat.

IMO - There is a large whiff of wishful thinking in your posts

 

[urban genie]

This probably gone undr the radat and yes we all know francois isn't representative if the cabinet, but him and the erg still hold the same position to block johnson at every turn.



Best(or worst) bits is he doesn't know how tarrifs work and his smug claim that if the car industry colapsed at least we chose that ourselves.

 

[bluethrunthru]

You forget one small but very important point, The deal they wanted was not ratified by the UK parliament. Remember the parliament that so many remainers wanted to have a final say on. Oh the irony. It's all up for renegotiation until both parties agree. Time for the UK to start playing hardball just like the EU have been doing all along. First off immediately stop all payments to the EU. Then they will be quicker to the negotiating table.

Not forgotten at all - it is the job of the PM - whomsoever that may be - to get the agreement passed by Parliament to progress on to phase two of the talks. That is how the agreement was left with Mayday - Vauxhall workers in Ellesmere Port look like getting what they voted for - liberation from those pesky Europeans who employ them. Great work.

 

[bluethrunthru]

This probably gone undr the radat and yes we all know francois isn't representative if the cabinet, but him and the erg still hold the same position to block johnson at every turn.



Best(or worst) bits is he doesn't know how tarrifs work and his smug claim that if the car industry colapsed at least we chose that ourselves.

PSA are the ones choosing to shut Ellesmere Port in the event of a No Deal not the UK. Francois is a total prick.

 

[west didsblue]

You forget one small but very important point, The deal they wanted was not ratified by the UK parliament. Remember the parliament that so many remainers wanted to have a final say on. Oh the irony. It's all up for renegotiation until both parties agree. Time for the UK to start playing hardball just like the EU have been doing all along. First off immediately stop all payments to the EU. Then they will be quicker to the negotiating table.

That'd really work!
Breaching some international agreements will be good practice for breaching a few more if we leave with No Deal.

 

[Ric]

Do I detect a certain anxious restlessness at the back? Calm yourselves we are going nowhere except deeper into the bosom of our superstate, they killed Brexit long ago.

I very much hope you are right George!

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Not forgotten at all - it is the job of the PM - whomsoever that may be - to get the agreement passed by Parliament to progress on to phase two of the talks. That is how the agreement was left with Mayday - Vauxhall workers in Ellesmere Port look like getting what they voted for - liberation from those pesky Europeans who employ them. Great work.

Always glass half empty with you, i have never seen you give a balanced view on Brexit once. Car production in the UK has dropped as a direct result of being in the EU with the latest EU Japan trade deal. But strangely you never mention that.

 

[urban genie]

You forget one small but very important point, The deal they wanted was not ratified by the UK parliament. Remember the parliament that so many remainers wanted to have a final say on. Oh the irony. It's all up for renegotiation until both parties agree. Time for the UK to start playing hardball just like the EU have been doing all along. First off immediately stop all payments to the EU. Then they will be quicker to the negotiating table.

Thing is if we don't deal or break existing deals as your suggestion to withhold funds are, the international legal position is to sanction the state breaking the agreement.

We had a chance to dictate some of the deal, unfortunately we went all billy big bollocks straight after for about a week after the referendum, then realised it didn't work, mays inability to recover from her short sightedness has left us weak in negotiating and it's deal or ne deal with both screwing us over.

 

[BobKowalski]

So Barnier admitted May and her team never really tried to get a decent deal for the UK. She never put no deal on the table. All those times she spouted about a no deal being better than a bad deal. Laughable really. All the while the EU have been dictating the terms of leaving, cutting options and benefits such as Galileo to the UK while still taking the cash. She and her team of civil servants were simply awful at negotiation, i predicted this two or three years ago when i said they were not suitable or experienced in how to carry out any hard negotiation. They should have tasked business leaders with the job. People who know how to negotiate not politicians and civil servants. Total shambles. A wasted three years.

International Agreements are not business deals. It’s a different skill set. The negotiators on the EU side are experienced politicians and civil servants and seem quite capable of conducting hard negotiations. Deluding ourselves over how we got into this mess will not help us find a way out of it.

 

[BobKowalski]

Always glass half empty with you, i have never seen you give a balanced view on Brexit once. Car production in the UK has dropped as a direct result of being in the EU with the latest EU Japan trade deal. But strangely you never mention that.

Probably because the tariffs on Japanese cars will be gradually lowered over an eight year period so there is no ‘direct result’.

 

[aguero93:20]

Probably because the tariffs on Japanese cars will be gradually lowered over an eight year period so there is no ‘direct result’.

Plus if it hadn't been for the Brexit vote the UK could have vetoed lowering those tariffs.

 

[cibaman]

Plus if it hadn't been for the Brexit vote the UK could have vetoed lowering those tariffs.

Isn’t that a good reason why we shouldn’t want to be locked into a “permanent” customs union post brexit.

 

[Blue Hefner]

This probably gone undr the radat and yes we all know francois isn't representative if the cabinet, but him and the erg still hold the same position to block johnson at every turn.



Best(or worst) bits is he doesn't know how tarrifs work and his smug claim that if the car industry colapsed at least we chose that ourselves.

The issue with ‘balance’, right there in a 9 minute clip

 

[BobKowalski]

Isn’t that a good reason why we shouldn’t want to be locked into a “permanent” customs union post brexit.

Yes. Which is why Labour proposed that we be allowed representation on negotiations to address any U.K. concerns. Whether this would be possible would be a matter of negotiation but given the importance of the Irish border there would be strong arguments for CU membership with a voice. The EU would be wary of precedent but the political importance of the border question would I think trump that.

The EU had similar concerns over the all U.K. backstop but ultimately went with it over their preferred NI only option purely because of the Irish border.

 

[mcfc1632]

So Barnier admitted May and her team never really tried to get a decent deal for the UK. She never put no deal on the table. All those times she spouted about a no deal being better than a bad deal. Laughable really. All the while the EU have been dictating the terms of leaving, cutting options and benefits such as Galileo to the UK while still taking the cash. She and her team of civil servants were simply awful at negotiation, i predicted this two or three years ago when i said they were not suitable or experienced in how to carry out any hard negotiation. They should have tasked business leaders with the job. People who know how to negotiate not politicians and civil servants. Total shambles. A wasted three years.

Utter incompetence by Robbins and May

The EU team must have been pissing themselves laughing as their best outcomes were ceded without having to give anything in return

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Thing is if we don't deal or break existing deals as your suggestion to withhold funds are, the international legal position is to sanction the state breaking the agreement.

We had a chance to dictate some of the deal, unfortunately we went all billy big bollocks straight after for about a week after the referendum, then realised it didn't work, mays inability to recover from her short sightedness has left us weak in negotiating and it's deal or ne deal with both screwing us over.

There's always time to do a decent deal for the UK and the EU. You just have to have the right people in charge. And that isn't inexperienced politicians and civil servants.