Another new Brexit thread

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Chris in London said:
Well they certainly aren’t ignoring it then. Can we agree you were wrong to complain that the result has been ignored, but you are justified in saying it hasn’t been implemented?
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If they have been refusing to implement, it can then be construed as ignoring, although why this point is being repeated is strange.
The option was never 'With a deal" that has only since been introduced by the surrender act, so we should have been out without one on 29 March.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
If they have been refusing to implement, it can then be construed as ignoring, although why this point is being repeated is strange.
The option was never 'With a deal" that has only since been introduced by the surrender act, so we should have been out without one on 29 March.
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As per A50.....
 
west didsblue said:
Clearly it does. They’ve set the agenda without seeking consensus even within their own ranks. How can you blame anyone else?
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The Torries offered a referendum the electorate set the agenda, the government offered a way forward to meet the elctorates wishes. MPs from all parties have rejected it. But mostly opposition. Pretty clear cut to me
 
carlosthejackal said:
I voted to remain because from the outset it was blatantly obvious to me that the promises made could never be kept , I voted to remain because I couldn’t align myself with a blatant racist like Farage , I voted to remain because I want to keep the gains made in Ireland , I voted remain because I despise what the likes of Gove, Duncan Smith , Rees Mogg stand for .
I am more than happy to leave with a sensible deal that won’t cost jobs and people’s health and well-being. As for the utter **** who is now prime minister don’t get me started. What I don’t believe for one minute that 17.4 million people decided to self harm. Nor do I think 17.4 million are bigoted racists, but the rise in hate and nationalism is both a disgrace and embarrassment.
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carlosthejackal said:
I voted to remain because from the outset it was blatantly obvious to me that the promises made could never be kept , I voted to remain because I couldn’t align myself with a blatant racist like Farage , I voted to remain because I want to keep the gains made in Ireland , I voted remain because I despise what the likes of Gove, Duncan Smith , Rees Mogg stand for .
I am more than happy to leave with a sensible deal that won’t cost jobs and people’s health and well-being. As for the utter **** who is now prime minister don’t get me started. What I don’t believe for one minute that 17.4 million people decided to self harm. Nor do I think 17.4 million are bigoted racists, but the rise in hate and nationalism is both a disgrace and embarrassment.
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And I voted to leave for none of those reasons.
Glad we got that sorted.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
I've recently had a similar conversation on here, I wasn't told any lies that affected my vote, I'm sure you weren't.
What I did believe, was that the vote would be respected, as yet, it hasn't, after over 3 years.
For now, we wait another couple of weeks to find out.
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It is in the process of being respected..
 
Ancient Citizen said:
A rational and pragmatic remainer, wish there were a few more.
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I think there's quite a lot more to be honest:

The Remain parliament (I seem to remember something like 450 to 500 of the 650 MPs are Remainers) have sought to portray Johnson as the liar, the duplicitous one not following or honouring the democratic mandate (of Parliament). The public, would seem to be thinking otherwise. There's a lot of Remainers like me who have reached the point where we think we just have to get on with it now.

 
Chippy_boy said:
To be fair (and speaking as a Remainer) i think it's fair to say the referendum result has been ignored.

The referendum provided parliament with a clear instruction that we should leave the EU. An argument can be made that since the Leave side so clearly stated that getting a deal would be like falling off a log, and that no-one was selling the idea of leaving without a deal, then fair enough, we should leave with a deal. To be honest, even that is throwing us Remainers a bone, since the requirement to have a deal was not on the ballot paper.

But Theresa May's deal, was us leaving with a deal. After 3 years of negotiations, we'd got to the point of OK we now must respect the referendum result, we went further and said we must leave with a deal, and here's the deal. And MP's ignored the mandate and voted it down.

At the time, I was supportive of this, since in my heart I do not want us to leave. But acting as we did WAS ignoring the mandate given in the 2016 referendum. There's no hiding from that fact.
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Seriously?

Let’s look at this.

After the referendum result the prime minister resigned.
His replacement tried to exit the EU by breaking the law. She was defeated in the Courts.
She then introduced legislation to bring about the referendum result. That legislation require parliamentary approval.
She then negotiated a comprehensive withdrawal agreement with the EU. She then tried on three occasions to obtain said parliamentary approval. Without success.
She then resigned.
Her replacement tried unlawfully to prorogue Parliament in order to avoid parliamentary scrutiny of his attempts to the referendum result was implemented. He lost in the courts.
As the law stands the prime minister must seek an extension to the withdrawal period. If it is refused we leave the EU on 31 October.

All this has taken over three years and has occupied the attention of the nation to the exclusion of all else in the political sphere. Yet you say the referendum result has been ignored.


This must be some strange use of the word ‘ignored’ that the rest of the English speaking world is unaware of.
 
France giving our balls a squeeze...

‘France has said “there can be no assumptions” about a free-trade agreement with the UK after Brexit. A French diplomat was said to have made a forceful intervention in the latest Brexit meeting between EU diplomats with European commission this morning’ @Guardian
 
Ancient Citizen said:
If they have been refusing to implement, it can then be construed as ignoring, although why this point is being repeated is strange.
The option was never 'With a deal" that has only since been introduced by the surrender act, so we should have been out without one on 29 March.
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You can’t possibly construe the amount of attention this issue has generated as it being ignored. Why are you so keen to say it’s been ignored when it manifestly hasn’t?
 
kevin horlocks wand said:
well the mps pretty much unanimously voted to trigger article 50 which said the U.K. would leave the Eu deal or no deal.

funnily they forget that last bit and claim they didn’t know it said that , that’s the mps .
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If they'd known then what they know now, they wouldn't have voted to let the PM trigger Article 50.

Unknown unknowns...
 
Chris in London said:
Seriously?

Let’s look at this.

After the referendum result the prime minister resigned.
His replacement tried to exit the EU by breaking the law. She was defeated in the Courts.
She then introduced legislation to bring about the referendum result. That legislation require parliamentary approval.
She then negotiated a comprehensive withdrawal agreement with the EU. She then tried on three occasions to obtain said parliamentary approval. Without success.
She then resigned.
Her replacement tried unlawfully to prorogue Parliament in order to avoid parliamentary scrutiny of his attempts to the referendum result was implemented. He lost in the courts.
As the law stands the prime minister must seek an extension to the withdrawal period. If it is refused we leave the EU on 31 October.

All this has taken over three years and has occupied the attention of the nation to the exclusion of all else in the political sphere. Yet you say the referendum result has been ignored.


This must be some strange use of the word ‘ignored’ that the rest of the English speaking world is unaware of.
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The "Ignored" part, Chris was when the opportunity for us to leave when May presented her deal to Parliament and Parliament ignored the mandate to leave and voted it down. Everything else above is just noise. We had the opportunity to leave, Parliament ignored it.
 
Chris in London said:
Seriously?

Let’s look at this.

After the referendum result the prime minister resigned.
His replacement tried to exit the EU by breaking the law. She was defeated in the Courts.
She then introduced legislation to bring about the referendum result. That legislation require parliamentary approval.
She then negotiated a comprehensive withdrawal agreement with the EU. She then tried on three occasions to obtain said parliamentary approval. Without success.
She then resigned.
Her replacement tried unlawfully to prorogue Parliament in order to avoid parliamentary scrutiny of his attempts to the referendum result was implemented. He lost in the courts.
As the law stands the prime minister must seek an extension to the withdrawal period. If it is refused we leave the EU on 31 October.

All this has taken over three years and has occupied the attention of the nation to the exclusion of all else in the political sphere. Yet you say the referendum result has been ignored.


This must be some strange use of the word ‘ignored’ that the rest of the English speaking world is unaware of.
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I would reply to this but I have you on the Brexit definition of ‘ignore’.
 
Chippy_boy said:
The "Ignored" part, Chris was when the opportunity for us to leave when May presented her deal to Parliament and Parliament ignored the mandate to leave and voted it down. Everything else above is just noise. We had the opportunity to leave, Parliament ignored it.
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No, it voted against a particular manifestation of leave, and is yet to agree on a manifestation of leaving that it approves. It is now out of our hands whether we leave or not on 31/10. It certainly hasn’t ignored the result. Anything but.

What’s interesting is the way the emotive term ‘ignored’ has been hijacked when what people mean is in fact ‘not been completed.’ That isn’t a surprise coming from some posters for a variety of reasons, but from you it surprised me.
 
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