General Election - December 12th, 2019

Who will you vote for in the 2019 General Election?

  • Conservative

    Votes: 160 30.9%

  • Labour

    Votes: 230 44.4%

  • Liberal Democrats

    Votes: 59 11.4%

  • Green Party

    Votes: 13 2.5%

  • Brexit Party

    Votes: 28 5.4%

  • Plaid Cymru/SNP

    Votes: 7 1.4%

  • Other

    Votes: 21 4.1%
  • Total voters
    518
Ancient Citizen said:
'Shy' Tories are a considerable demographic, folk who don't like being screamed at as racists and bastards may well swing
the result. In contrast, there doesn't appear to be many shy labour voters.
Click to expand...
Course there are. Mcfc1632 meets them all the time.
 
Mike D said:
Yep read this all before mate and although not currently being a socialist ran country they have many socialist policies from previous socialist governments which was the point that I was making with some of the other countries in that list. There are elements of socialism in every country more than others you don't have to be a hyper inflation style Venezuala to have socialist values and policies.
Click to expand...
In other words, you don't need socialism.
 
Too busy to post much but I know one constituency where the LibDem candidate is toying whether to endorse the Labour candidate, but that might mean losing Tory Remainers switching to LibDem.

Question asked at hustings "Do you want to be a remainer that lets in Johnson to 'get Brexit done'?" NB “leaving would cause at least some business uncertainty, while embroiling the Government for several years in a fiddly process of negotiating new arrangements, so diverting energy from the real problems of this country – low skills, low social mobility, low investment etc – that have nothing to do with Europe” (Boris Johnson, Feb 2016)
 
Pretty sure Bury North is a marginal and I haven’t got a scooby whether to vote or not, or if I do who I should give it to.
 
Mike D said:
Boris Johnson has refused to rule out the prospect of a no-deal exit from the EU at the end of 2020, as he abruptly drew a press conference at the Nato meeting to an end.

The Independent challenged the prime minister to say whether it was possible that the UK would reach the end of its transition to Brexit in a year’s time without sealing a trade deal with either the EU or US.


But the PM dodged the question, instead saying he was going to wind up the press conference before launching into a tirade against Jeremy Corbyn and the Labour Party.

Looks like this time next year we will be No Deal Brexit if the polls are anything to go off can't wait!!
Click to expand...

You weren't keen on my flippant response so here are my reasons as to why we will leave the EU with a trade deal on 31st December 2020:

1. The lack of trust in politicians. Remain politicians promised to "Respect" the Leave vote. The politicians did nothing of the sort, "Losers Consent" was withdrawn and "Respect" turned into doing everything possible to stop Brexit. This threatens the very basis of democracy in this country. Even though I am Eurosceptic, and voted Remain, the mendacity of the Remainer position is unacceptable. We have to leave or democracy in this country is done.Leave so we can easily rejoin is the only acceptable "Remain" position, but no, that was not good enough. The mantra (to Leavers) is that Leavers are thick and can be ignored.
2. The Tory Party realised that it was done if this situation continued, thus Boris was elected leader and everything is geared to actually respecting the Leave vote.
3. A deal is far better than WTO exit, but delay will, be seen as backsliding so deadlines have been set to deliver Leave and regain the trust of Leave voters.
4. Barnier said himself that 80% of the deal, including FTA, was done back in 2018. Now the last 20% takes 80% of the time but even so. Even so a lot of it is already done.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/10/eu-michel-barnier-brexit-deal-four-fifths-agreed
5. The deadline set by Boris will not be missed. Trust has to be restored. Even if the FTA is basic, it will be delivered. Anything else would be pushed forward post basic deal. If agreement on a better deal is close, ONLY a temporary WTO Article 24 will be acceptable to the UK to delay.
6. Any other delay that would result in a better long term FTA will be seen as provarication or betrayal that would harm Tory chances at future elections.
7. EU attempts to delay will be seen as provarication. In my opinion, this and a refusal to enact a WTO Article 24 temporary deal is the ONLY way a WTO Brexit can occur.
 
Last edited:
BlueAnorak said:
You weren't keen on my flippant response so here are my reasons as to why we will leave the EU with a trade deal on 31st December 2020:

1. The lack of trust in politicians. Remain politicians promised to "Respect" the Leave vote. The politicians did nothing of the sort, "Losers Consent" was withdrawn and "Respect" turned into doing everything possible to stop Brexit. This threatens the very basis of democracy in this country. Even though I am Eurosceptic, and voted Remain, the mendacity of the Remainer position is unacceptable. We have to leave or democracy in this country is done.Leave so we can easily rejoin is the only acceptable "Remain" position, but no, that was not good enough. The mantra (to Leavers) is that Leavers are thick and can be ignored.
That is total BS. It was good enough - "stay in a FTZ from Iceland to the Russian border". It wasn't Remainers who went batshit hard leave.
2. The Tory Party realised that it was done if this situation continued, thus Boris was elected leader and everything is geared to actually respecting the Leave vote.
But not the Leave promise that we'd "stay in a FTZ from Iceland to the Russian border"
3. A deal is far better than WTO exit, but delay will, be seen as backsliding so deadlines have been set to deliver Leave and regain the trust of Leave voters.
We were supposed to leave last March. That went well.
4. Barnier said himself that 80% of the deal, including FTA, was done back in 2018. Now the last 20% takes 80% of the time but even so. Even so a lot of it is already done.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/10/eu-michel-barnier-brexit-deal-four-fifths-agreed
I've climbed 80% of Everest. The rest will be easy.
5. The deadline set by Boris will not be missed. Trust has to be restored. Even if the FTA is basic, it will be delivered. Anything else would be pushed forward post basic deal. If agreement on a better deal is close, ONLY a temporary WTO Article 24 will be acceptable to the UK.
Oh come on. The Article 24 stuff is rubbish, designed for people without a deal working toward a deal, not countries dismantling deals.
6. Any other delay that would result in a better long term FTA will be seen as provarication or betrayal that would harm Tory chances at future elections.
And the interests of the Tory party outweigh the long-term interests of the nation. OK, got that.
7. EU attempts to delay will be seen as provarication.
What EU attempts to delay? It will be the same, the UK begging for an extension - and this time all 27 will have to agree.
Click to expand...

1. The lack of trust in politicians. Remain politicians promised to "Respect" the Leave vote. The politicians did nothing of the sort, "Losers Consent" was withdrawn and "Respect" turned into doing everything possible to stop Brexit. This threatens the very basis of democracy in this country. Even though I am Eurosceptic, and voted Remain, the mendacity of the Remainer position is unacceptable. We have to leave or democracy in this country is done.Leave so we can easily rejoin is the only acceptable "Remain" position, but no, that was not good enough. The mantra (to Leavers) is that Leavers are thick and can be ignored.
That is total BS. It was good enough - "stay in a FTZ from Iceland to the Russian border". It wasn't Remainers who went batshit hard leave.
2. The Tory Party realised that it was done if this situation continued, thus Boris was elected leader and everything is geared to actually respecting the Leave vote.
But not the Leave promise that we'd "stay in a FTZ from Iceland to the Russian border"
3. A deal is far better than WTO exit, but delay will, be seen as backsliding so deadlines have been set to deliver Leave and regain the trust of Leave voters.
We were supposed to leave last March. That went well.
4. Barnier said himself that 80% of the deal, including FTA, was done back in 2018. Now the last 20% takes 80% of the time but even so. Even so a lot of it is already done.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/10/eu-michel-barnier-brexit-deal-four-fifths-agreed
I've climbed 80% of Everest. The rest will be easy.
5. The deadline set by Boris will not be missed. Trust has to be restored. Even if the FTA is basic, it will be delivered. Anything else would be pushed forward post basic deal. If agreement on a better deal is close, ONLY a temporary WTO Article 24 will be acceptable to the UK.
Oh come on. The Article 24 stuff is rubbish, designed for people without a deal working toward a deal, not countries dismantling deals.
6. Any other delay that would result in a better long term FTA will be seen as provarication or betrayal that would harm Tory chances at future elections.
And the interests of the Tory party outweigh the long-term interests of the nation. OK, got that.
7. EU attempts to delay will be seen as provarication.
What EU attempts to delay? It will be the same, the UK begging for an extension - and this time all 27 will have to agree.​

All Tory candidates have agreed to vote for the UK-dividing deal. Have they all agreed that if the only FTA deal we could get by December 2020 is crap, they would let us crash out rather than delay for a better deal? Francois and his ilk already lobbying for no FTA deal.
 
Last edited:
Vic said:
That is total BS. It was good enough - "stay in a FTZ from Iceland to the Russian border". It wasn't Remainers who went batshit hard leave.
2. The Tory Party realised that it was done if this situation continued, thus Boris was elected leader and everything is geared to actually respecting the Leave vote.
But not the Leave promise that we'd "stay in a FTZ from Iceland to the Russian border"
3. A deal is far better than WTO exit, but delay will, be seen as backsliding so deadlines have been set to deliver Leave and regain the trust of Leave voters.
We were supposed to leave last March. That went well.
4. Barnier said himself that 80% of the deal, including FTA, was done back in 2018. Now the last 20% takes 80% of the time but even so. Even so a lot of it is already done.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/10/eu-michel-barnier-brexit-deal-four-fifths-agreed
I've climbed 80% of Everest. The rest will be easy.
5. The deadline set by Boris will not be missed. Trust has to be restored. Even if the FTA is basic, it will be delivered. Anything else would be pushed forward post basic deal. If agreement on a better deal is close, ONLY a temporary WTO Article 24 will be acceptable to the UK.
Oh come on. The Article 24 stuff is rubbish, designed for people without a deal working toward a deal, not countries dismantling deals.
6. Any other delay that would result in a better long term FTA will be seen as provarication or betrayal that would harm Tory chances at future elections.
And the interests of the Tory party outweigh the long-term interests of the nation. OK, got that.
7. EU attempts to delay will be seen as provarication.
What EU attempts to delay? It will be the same, the UK begging for an extension - and this time all 27 will have to agree.

All Tory candidates have agreed to vote for the UK-dividing deal. Have they all agreed that if the only FTA deal we could get by December 2020 is crap, they would let us crash out rather than delay for a better deal? Francois and his ilk already lobbying for no FTA deal.
Click to expand...
Uber Remain voters like yourself clearly haven't a clue as to why Boris will win the General Election. You accuse Boris of lying yet fail to see that every Remain politician has totally and utterly betrayed the Leave vote and also lied through their teeth.
 
BlueAnorak said:
You weren't keen on my flippant response so here are my reasons as to why we will leave the EU with a trade deal on 31st December 2020:
Click to expand...

We won’t.

We went through all this nonsense three years ago when we triggered A50. In March 2017 we confidently said we would negotiate the Withdrawal Agreement and a future trade deal in the two year timeframe. Fast forward to December 2019 and we still haven’t even ratified the Withdrawal Agreement.

Anyone who thinks this will be done in 11 months is an idiot. Take NAFTA 2, a shallower trade arrangement between three aligned countries, negotiations started in May 2017 and ‘concluded’ Sept 2018 and over a year later is still not in force as neither the US or Canada have ratified it. US have just proposed stripping out Pharma legal protections (which is interesting given the recent hoo-hah) so technically it’s still not concluded. Two and a half years it’s taken and that’s just a renegotiation of an existing deal not creating a new relationship from scratch, a relationship that seeks to diverge trade not bring it closer which has never been done before.

11 months. Jeez.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top