UEFA FFP investigation - CAS decision to be announced Monday, 13th July 9.30am BST

[Tricky_Trev]

If I understand it correctly, if the money didn't come from ADUG then it's not owner investment. UEFAwwill no doubt try to claim otherwise. But even if it was, the Etihad sponsorship was fair value, certainly when compared to what Leterme and his IC allowed PSG to claim.

Again, it's a guess but I'd say everyone gave the money to ADUG for onward transmission to City but City told them not to do that.

Now, when you read all those so-called 'smoking gun' emails in the correct context, rather than the spin put on them by Der Spiegel and others, the picture is really quite different isn't it? That's why I've been banging the drum about context. It's crucial to this.

That’s the thing. When you are trawling through masses of documents, over several months to find something juicy, anything that can be twisted into a smoking gun, will be.

 

[blue b4 the moon]

The actual evidence isn’t the main focus of CAS. It’s simply ‘did UEFA follow their own procedures and governance in conducting their investigation of us’. The only place the evidence would be tested with rigour is in court. I sincerely hope if CAS overturn the ban, we don’t stop at that, we make sure that the evidence is properly reviewed and we are found to have done nothing wrong. Win that case and then go after the media. I can dream....

I know CAS aren't looking at the actual evidence but I'm pretty sure win or lose at CAS we'll be taking this further.

 

[bewildered]

Something occurred to me , its interesting that Khaldoon said he'd rather spend 30 Million on lawyers and keep them in court for 10 years...

Then the fine turns up and its... 30M...

Maybe the club knew what the punishment was going to be ahead of the release date...

Its a strange number to pluck out of the air, 10, 50, 100 maybe more naturally pop into ones head in such moments.

 

[Nightmare Walking]

If I understand it correctly, if the money didn't come from ADUG then it's not owner investment. UEFAwwill no doubt try to claim otherwise. But even if it was, the Etihad sponsorship was fair value, certainly when compared to what Leterme and his IC allowed PSG to claim.

Again, it's a guess but I'd say everyone gave the money to ADUG for onward transmission to City but City told them not to do that.

Now, when you read all those so-called 'smoking gun' emails in the correct context, rather than the spin put on them by Der Spiegel and others, the picture is really quite different isn't it? That's why I've been banging the drum about context. It's crucial to this.

Thank you for your reply Colin :-D

 

[KS55]

UEFA may well be destroyed. If they are shown to be prejudicial then their already questionable authority will evaporate and they will be financially liable for heavy damages.

So far all that has been aired in the media are allegations against Man City whereas City have a body of evidence that has so far remained closed. PB's report is very newsworthy. Are any journalists going to examine that? Are any of them going to look at the bigger picture of the rivalry in football that underlies FFP and this dispute? This is not about Man City misdemeanours. The football authorities have I believe been corralled by the likes of Tebas and profit hungry football executives from rival clubs.

I think UEFA tried to reach an accommodation with City, but City refused to take another pinch, so the whole thing is going to end up in the European courts and it will end with the destruction of UEFA.

Good article in NYT. If you register for free, you get access to several articles per month.
Manchester City Vows to Fight, Because Losing Is Unthinkable https://nyti.ms/2Sx20T3

 

[Nails]

seriously?? what a bunch of......

I posted it again on The Times and, again, they took it down!

 

[cibaman]

I agree. No one wants this case thrown out and City cleared more than me, but there is a level of confidence on this thread that I find hard to share.
I don’t believe UEFA are as thick as they are being made out and I don’t trust CAS.
For all the so called experts on here, it’s funny that not one poster predicted the 2 year ban.

Agreed. If we had irrefutable evidence, a smoking gun, surely we would made it public knowledge by now? Either directly or leaked to the press. Someone like Martin Samuel would be desperate to get hold of that sort of stuff. I just don’t get this idea that we are sitting there holding 4 aces but have decided not to play them yet. It makes absolutely no sense. Why would we let this drag on a minute longer than necessary if we could blow eufa out of the water? Isn’t it a golden rule of PR that you kill bad news as quickly as possible?

 

[wattle]

Something occurred to me , its interesting that Khaldoon said he'd rather spend 30 Million on lawyers and keep them in court for 10 years...

Then the fine turns up and its... 30M...

Maybe the club knew what the punishment was going to be ahead of the release date...

Its a strange number to pluck out of the air, 10, 50, 100 maybe more naturally pop into ones head in such moments.

That’s just what I thought

 

[Gordyola]

Something occurred to me , its interesting that Khaldoon said he'd rather spend 30 Million on lawyers and keep them in court for 10 years...

Then the fine turns up and its... 30M...

Maybe the club knew what the punishment was going to be ahead of the release date...

Its a strange number to pluck out of the air, 10, 50, 100 maybe more naturally pop into ones head in such moments.

The original fine was >£50M of which >£30M was returned for "good behaviour I think that explains the fine

Figures rounded up or down as the fine is in Euros

 

[blueinsa]

Apologies 'tidds' for nicking it.

He is of course correct but certain clubs and sadly, the PL itself see this league as Utd, Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea.

The rest make up the numbers and frankly are of no real concern.

 

[Len Rum]

That's my concern that it gets thrown out for procedure and UEFA and the MSM can still claim we are cheats. Do we then have to go to Federal law in Switzerland to exonerate ourselves.

Well not sure we can mate.
We've agreed to abide by UEFA's rules with CAS being the final arbiter.
Reference to the Swiss court can only be made on limited grounds.
One of which allows us to challenge FFP in it's entirety.
Whilst this is exciting and all very big picture and may well be the ultimate end game, it could take a long time and doesn't help us in our current predicament.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

If it's Matthew Syed, he hates us.

It appears that he doesn't like muslims and it seems to seep through everything he writes about City. What this whole saga has shown to me is the latent racism, bigotry, xenophobia, call it what you like, which seems to be a bedrock of British society and especially the media. They accuse us City fans of being deluded conspiracy theorists but we can all recognise sheer hatred when we see it. Syed is truly disgusting. He has no serious background as a journalist but is given a national platform to spout his poisonous views. He is just an upmarket Katie Hopkins, albeit from the other end of the political spectrum.

 

[domalino]

UEFA may well be destroyed. If they are shown to be prejudicial then their already questionable authority will evaporate and they will be financially liable for heavy damages.

So far all that has been aired in the media are allegations against Man City whereas City have a body of evidence that has so far remained closed. PB's report is very newsworthy. Are any journalists going to examine that? Are any of them going to look at the bigger picture of the rivalry in football that underlies FFP and this dispute? This is not about Man City misdemeanours. The football authorities have I believe been corralled by the likes of Tebas and profit hungry football executives from rival clubs.

I think UEFA tried to reach an accommodation with City, but City refused to take another pinch, so the whole thing is going to end up in the European courts and it will end with the destruction of UEFA.

Once you start considering that City might win the appeal on the evidence, as opposed to just avoiding sanction via standing/process like PSG, then it does open up some interesting next steps.

If City genuinely have what they say, undeniable proof of their innocence/compliance than how exposed are UEFA. If Yves Leterme (He who rejected UEFA's 7m/year valuation of Qatars PSG sponsorship and classified it as 100m/year) has ignored such evidence, gotten City banned and caused all this fallout, someone must be getting sued.

 

[bewildered]

The original fine was >£50M of which >£30M was returned for "good behaviour I think that explains the fine

Figures rounded up or down as the fine is in Euros

Are you referring to the original sanction? I'm on about this current sanction (subject to CAS ruling).

As I understand it the original fine was £47M of which £31M was returned when we met certain criteria the year after.

 

[Newman Noggs]

agreed.

the fans of other teams shouldn’t be laughing at us and falling for journalist propaganda that this is a just punishment.

they should be furious that the only chance they’ll ever have of getting to the top is being destroyed. They should be furious that they are doomed to have their best players taken, time and time again by United or Liverpool.

Why are the actually “history” clubs doomed to be just “history” and never again grace the top of the table? Why must they sell their players to keep afloat and be content with that?
Don’t they ever want more than to languid in mid-table obscurity? I know I would.

Surely every football fan dreams their club reaches the dizzying heights, but they’ve been told they can’t have it, and like lowly serfs they nod and agree with the pundits that they aren’t royalty and happily accept their players being tapped up and treated with contempt because they think that’s what they deserve.

Instead they should be rallying and saying “fuck you and everything you stand for. We are not your servants and we deserve more.”

Football needs a revolution to stoke the embers and breath life back into it. Everyone should be fighting, not us.

In fairness to Liverpool, they are European royalty in a Marie-Antoinette ish way. As far as the rest of the clubs in the country are concerned, whilst they are troughing at the CL table, it's an attitude of "let them eat cake".

Hopefully, Liverpool will meet the same end.

 

[bewildered]

It appears that he doesn't like muslims and it seems to seep through everything he writes about City. What this whole saga has shown to me is the latent racism, bigotry, xenophobia, call it what you like, which seems to be a bedrock of British society and especially the media. They accuse us City fans of being deluded conspiracy theorists but we can all recognise sheer hatred when we see it. Syed is truly disgusting. He has no serious background as a journalist but is given a national platform to spout his poisionous views. He is just an upmarket Katie Hopkins, albeit from the other end of the political spectrum.

This is exactly right, the whole thing stinks of racism across the board, not just that tool Syed

 

[Roachy]

That's my concern that it gets thrown out for procedure and UEFA and the MSM can still claim we are cheats. Do we then have to go to Federal law in Switzerland to exonerate ourselves.

P1654 on this thread, 3rd post down possibly puts a different light on it. Facts as well as procedure.

 

[waspish]

Well not sure we can mate.
We've agreed to abide by UEFA's rules with CAS being the final arbiter.
Reference to the Swiss court can only be made on limited grounds.
One of which allows us to challenge FFP in it's entirety.
Whilst this is exciting and all very big picture and may well be the ultimate end game, it could take a long time and doesn't help us in our current predicament.

So did Bayern PSG and Juventus but Uefa let them get away with what we have supposed to have done!

 

[paulchapo]

We have to trust that CAS is independent, this is a very high profile case any sign of bias to any party would be jumped upon

Hopefully.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

Matthew Syed is guest speaker at the ASCL conference this year in Birmingham on March 13th/14th.
Laughably the theme of the conference is Diversity. Yet here is another middle class white man talking to an audience of 99% middle class white men and women.
I believe Syed to be racist as well as a cheat and I’m looking forward to asking him some questions

He's not white but his religious views are certainly not muslim and he can't hide his beliefs in his writing.