COVID-19 — Coronavirus

[Gaylord du Bois]

It’s just a surprise that the back death hasn’t been renamed the yellow death. Maybe Donald hasn’t googled that yet,

The Back Death ?

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

Maybe one day you’ll grow up mate and have a reasonable discussion.

Maybe stop the sound bites like a pound shop Piers Morgan.

What do you mean? The Black Death started in China. It’s the kind of thing Donald would say to deflect attention.

I haven’t been sensationalist about it. If he found out, he would use it.

 

[Marvin]

"The government's policy is still herd immunity", by Anthony Costello, professor of global health at UCL, and former director of maternal and child health at the WHO.

https://www.dumptheguardian.com/com...herd-immunity-community-surveillance-covid-19

 

[Ban-jani]

What do you mean? The Black Death started in China. It’s the kind of thing Donald would say to deflect attention.

I haven’t been sensationalist about it. If he found out, he would use it.

Apologies, I thought you were calling me Donald.

 

[Ban-jani]

The Back Death ?

Where did you get my picture?

 

[cleavers]

Bats are known to carry diseases though. They eat stuff that’s known to carry disease.

Without wanting to come over as wanting an argument most animals carry disease, chickens carry some horrible ones but we all still eat them, its not really what they eat, its the hygiene surrounding how they eat it that's the actual issue.

This really isn't the right thread for this discussion though, its happened, and we have this mess to deal with, the time for blame is when its finally (somehow) resolved, which looks a long long way away right now.

 

[meltonblue]

Of course something has changed since. The whole world went into lockdown thinking China’s had worked but it’s emerging quickly it’s totally manipulated news.

Whilst lockdown is the only way now, people looked to them thinking only 3k-4K had died there and it’s total bollocks.

Look at how they’ve treated Hong Kong and how many Muslims are in concentration camps now?? Why’s no **** talking about that??

These people aren’t level with our values and whilst we need to do business as they’re so big, we shouldn’t be allowing them control over our 5G network.

Fuck that.

You can’t really equate our lockdown, or any of the wests, to China’s though. Ours still isn’t anywhere even close to it (probably thankfully, but it’s not a comparable, even with the caveat that their numbers will
be higher than reported).

People are talking about those things, just as they were before and they will be afterwards. Again, it’s not to do with this though, why would the current situation make them talk more about it? Most people right now will Be focussing on the actions of their own governments, as they should be. I’d like
more people to be aware of things like that as well though, just like I’d like more people to be aware of the persecution and oppression that happens closer to home too.

If you don’t want them to control an element of our 5g network, that’s fine. Like I said, I didn’t either. The reasons for that are nothing to do with Coronavirus though.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

Apologies, I thought you were calling me Donald.

You haven’t stooped that low.











Yet. ;-)

 

[Ban-jani]

I’ve seen them and agree with your post in general. Even if we all lived as sterile a life as possible, they would still start one in 5.1 pandemics.

Their cultural culinary weirdness probably bumps that up Into 1 in 4 region statistically.

Honest question.

Does it not piss you off that our entire economy is fucked, our friends and family are being laid off and are sometimes dying, because they can’t eat fucking normal food?

 

[Ban-jani]

Without wanting to come over as wanting an argument most animals carry disease, chickens carry some horrible ones but we all still eat them, its not really what they eat, its the hygiene surrounding how they eat it that's the actual issue.

This really isn't the right thread for this discussion though, its happened, and we have this mess to deal with, the time for blame is when its finally (somehow) resolved, which looks a long long way away right now.

If it’s not the right threat I’ll stop but I would just argue that bats are known to be far more dangerous than chicken. Everything carries disease really but we won’t eat rats because we know they do.

 

[Ban-jani]

You can’t really equate our lockdown, or any of the wests, to China’s though. Ours still isn’t anywhere even close to it (probably thankfully, but it’s not a comparable, even with the caveat that their numbers will
be higher than reported).

People are talking about those things, just as they were before and they will be afterwards. Again, it’s not to do with this though, why would the current situation make them talk more about it? Most people right now will Be focussing on the actions of their own governments, as they should be. I’d like
more people to be aware of things like that as well though, just like I’d like more people to be aware of the persecution and oppression that happens closer to home too.

If you don’t want them to control an element of our 5g network, that’s fine. Like I said, I didn’t either. The reasons for that are nothing to do with Coronavirus though.

MPs in Italy have said they followed China’s lead thinking they’d beat it, initially. It’s unforgivable for them to have lied over that.

We fucked up absolutely but we didn’t have it start in our country and let it spread worldwide.

I was suspicious in the first instance, I’m now convinced we can’t trust them.

It’ll be a dark day when we let China control our infrastructure.

 

[doots]

Pretty sure most of the food the western world eats isn't still flapping about.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

Honest question.

Does it not piss you off that our entire economy is fucked, our friends and family are being laid off and are sometimes dying, because they can’t eat fucking normal food?

Looking forward is hard as we’re borrowing mental amounts of money. Pretty much all of the first world are.

Because of this, it could be a good time to write off all governmental debts as I think there will have to be some amnesty globally to stop everybody plunging into mad recessions.

It may well reset the global economy, so why not start at zero everywhere.

The random eating of live animals doesn’t anger me. I can’t get my head around it and of course it increases the chances of it starting a virus, but viruses have been around as long as we have. They will always be a threat to our species. We can’t irradiate them, but we can minimise them happening as much as we can.

The person eating the bat/mongoose/chicken didn’t want to put all humans in danger. He probably didn’t know he could.

I’m just not in the right state of mind to want to throw blame at people. I just want my household, my street, my town, my city, my region, my country etc to be ok.

Once we are through this, should I make it, I will look at what evidence is out there to see whether this was preventable (which I doubt as viruses mutate at random).

I don’t blame you for being wanting to be angry at the Chinese in some ways as anger is part of the reaction to danger and fear.

What I didn’t like was the “I’m outraged so you should be too” tone of your posts, which is why I made the comparison that I did.

I think you are a good poster when you are not angry or outraged. You make salient posts then.

When on your “high horse” you do tend to sensationalise things and portray some of the aspects of Piers.

Don’t stop being you. Your heart is in the right place. Just don’t be so shouty when on a mission!

 

[cleavers]

MPs in Italy have said they followed China’s lead thinking they’d beat it, initially. It’s unforgivable for them to have lied over that.

Problem is in Italy it leaked before they did it, and literally thousands upped and left before it came into action, closing the stable doors after the horse bolted.

 

[Ban-jani]

Problem is in Italy it leaked before they did it, and literally thousands upped and left before it came into action, closing the stable doors after the horse bolted.

That’s very true but China were and still are detrimental to the global effort.

 

[kaz7]

Trump knew there was going to be an pandemic and ignored it,says a dr on CNN

Americs going down the DNR route as wll

 

[TCIB]

https://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2020/03/30/science.abb6936

The suggestion here is that the time span between incubation period whilst being infectious and showing symptoms can be large. This would bypass or otherwise make social distancing much less effective. It renders manual contact tracking redundant. Not great news sadly but it is what it is.

 

[meltonblue]

MPs in Italy have said they followed China’s lead thinking they’d beat it, initially. It’s unforgivable for them to have lied over that.

We fucked up absolutely but we didn’t have it start in our country and let it spread worldwide.

I was suspicious in the first instance, I’m now convinced we can’t trust them.

It’ll be a dark day when we let China control our infrastructure.

Of course MPs in Italy said that, they didn’t follow China’s lead though, none of us have. They didn’t lockdown and they didn’t quarantine travellers. You’re saying they lied over the numbers, that’s fine, they more than likely did over the overall numbers (although I still have not heard any reason anywhere why they would include pneumonia cases that weren’t confirmed as Covid in their numbers if they were looking to actively suppress them significantly).

At the start of their outbreak though, they did say the rate of contagion was 2.6 and they also reported a mortality rate of 1.4%. The first one is similar to what other countries have reported (and our and other lockdowns that are less than China’s have already reduced that) and the mortality rate will end up being around that or significantly less, depending how far we can go with testing to prove it and also how many asymptomatic cases haven’t been accounted for.

It spreading worldwide is on everyone. Remember the WHO, even after China went into lockdown, were still advising that international travel was ok. China started self quarantining everyone travelling into and out of the country, as did some other Asian countries that limited the spread, we didn’t do that even from hotspots and still aren’t doing that now.

Blame them for the beginning of the out break absolutely and ultimately hold them accountable if you want to. Don’t let it account for the inactivity of others though and as an excuse for more than it should be. This conversation is exactly what western governments want us to be having as it detracts from thinking and talking about their own actions failures, which are the ones that now directly impact us, nothing else.

It does whittle away a few more hours until we’re all free again though, so I don’t mind it :)

 

[Ban-jani]

Looking forward is hard as we’re borrowing mental amounts of money. Pretty much all of the first world are.

Because of this, it could be a good time to write off all governmental debts as I think there will have to be some amnesty globally to stop everybody plunging into mad recessions.

It may well reset the global economy, so why not start at zero everywhere.

The random eating of live animals doesn’t anger me. I can’t get my head around it and of course it increases the chances of it starting a virus, but viruses have been around as long as we have. They will always be a threat to our species. We can’t irradiate them, but we can minimise them happening as much as we can.

The person eating the bat/mongoose/chicken didn’t want to put all humans in danger. He probably didn’t know he could.

I’m just not in the right state of mind to want to throw blame at people. I just want my household, my street, my town, my city, my region, my country etc to be ok.

Once we are through this, should I make it, I will look at what evidence is out there to see whether this was preventable (which I doubt as viruses mutate at random).

I don’t blame you for being wanting to be angry at the Chinese in some ways as anger is part of the reaction to danger and fear.

What I didn’t like was the “I’m outraged so you should be too” tone of your posts, which is why I made the comparison that I did.

I think you are a good poster when you are not angry or outraged. You make salient posts then.

When on your “high horse” you do tend to sensationalise things and portray some of the aspects of Piers.

Don’t stop being you. Your heart is in the right place. Just don’t be so shouty when on a mission!

Fair post and this is the nicest we’ve been to each other for a while, which says something.

By the way though, we’re currently discussing my anger at the diet of certain Chinese areas, which is susceptible to change.

My view against the Chinese state will be total disgust until the day they die and are replaced by the next dictator.

They’ve currently got Muslims in concentration camps, as we speak and are laying a political siege on Hong Kong. To say I hate the CCP, is an understatement.

As a libertarian, they’ll always be my enemy.

The diet aspect I may stray into language that can be perceived as bigotry, but I don’t mean it, I just cannot fathom their behaviour.

It’s such behaviour that has meant my mates’s grandad has died, my friends and family have lost loads of money and I cannot visit my lonely old nan.

I’m heart on my sleeve kind of guy and I’m fucking pissed off.

 

[Ban-jani]

Of course MPs in Italy said that, they didn’t follow China’s lead though, none of us have. They didn’t lockdown and they didn’t quarantine travellers. You’re saying they lied over the numbers, that’s fine, they more than likely did over the overall numbers (although I still have not heard any reason anywhere why they would include pneumonia cases that weren’t confirmed as Covid in their numbers if they were looking to actively suppress them significantly).

At the start of their outbreak though, they did say the rate of contagion was 2.6 and they also reported a mortality rate of 1.4%. The first one is similar to what other countries have reported (and our and other lockdowns that are less than China’s have already reduced that) and the mortality rate will end up being around that or significantly less, depending how far we can go with testing to prove it and also how many asymptomatic cases haven’t been accounted for.

It spreading worldwide is on everyone. Remember the WHO, even after China went into lockdown, were still advising that international travel was ok. China started self quarantining everyone travelling into and out of the country, as did some other Asian countries that limited the spread, we didn’t do that even from hotspots and still aren’t doing that now.

Blame them for the beginning of the out break absolutely and ultimately hold them accountable if you want to. Don’t let it account for the inactivity of others though and as an excuse for more than it should be. This conversation is exactly what western governments want us to be having as it detracts from thinking and talking about their own actions failures, which are the ones that now directly impact us, nothing else.

It does whittle away a few more hours until we’re all free again though, so I don’t mind it :)

My view is that China hid it, thinking they didn’t want to fuck their economy and way of life, and hid it and hid it until they thought bollocks it’s out of control now we have to inform everyone.

They did that and locked down to contain but didn’t want to publish the damage, so they hid tens of thousands of deaths and millions of cases, likely.

The problem is, amongst these lies, and they’re also definitely to blame, the west gambled on it by not crashing their economies with authoritarianism measures and now we’re having to do that anyway, as it was always inevitable.

Had the west known earlier though, we would have imposed the measures earlier and many lives would have been saved.

That’s why I blame China. The lies were detrimental to every other country.

Now our own governments deserve criticism but not as much as those cunts.