George Floyd murder | Clashes between US police and protestors

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urban genie said:
How do you know it was ANTIFA in the 2 year old footage? Only reference itls the videos title.

If anything it would be UAF which actually exists.
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I was there, not taking part, I walked past it at the time, they had that Antifa symbol they use, the red and white one and everyone in town I spoke to said it was Antifa, including sympathisers of them.
 
Shaelumstash said:
Strange analogy.

You're equating the oppression people face based on the genetics there were born with, alongside ostracising people who hold racist views.

The two don't tally up.

One party cannot change what they're being ostracised for, even if they wanted to. Whereas the other can change their views and behave like a decent human being if they so wished.

To expand on what I assume was your intended point - that ostracising racists won't solve the problem, there is perhaps a discussion to be had.

Ostracising racists may not solve the problem. Engagement and education will likely be better at helping to change views. But they have to be willing to engage for that to happen, and until that happens, ostracising them seems the best available option.
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My point is who is saying who is what here? Who gets to decide someone is a racist and who isn't? Happy for the law to do that but sorry, not happy for a group on the street or some facebook or twitter group to do it. We are at the point of protest with groups of people attacking others because they feel they can so 20 anti racists as the OP put it and to who i replied, walking down the street see some bloke and say, oh look, a racist lets twat him and that is ok?

All sounds and is a bit fascist to me that sort of thinking and behaviour im afraid and its why the I am in this group and you are in that and i hate you is dangerous territory.

Agree on education because its ignorance at the heart of this issue.
 
Ban-jani said:
I was there, not taking part, I walked past it at the time, they had that Antifa symbol they use, the red and white one and everyone in town I spoke to said it was Antifa, including sympathisers of them.
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I honestly do not understand the insistence they dont exist from some.

Posted a pic yesterday of one with an ANTIFA baseball club t-shirt on clearly showing a masked man with a baseball bat and it wasn't celebrating his love of the game either.
 
Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese said:
I agree the choice of analogy may be questionable, but I agree with the point that there is a section of people on the anti-fascist/racist side who seem to fairly prescriptive and even slightly fascist in the imposition of their own slightly narrow view of what is 'right'. Denouncing anyone who falls outside of this and diluting the actual issue with general anti establishment rubbish
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Keep hearing this, “the anti-fascists are the real fascists”.

I don’t agree.

I think that shows a fundamental misunderstanding of what fascism means.

If you’re saying there are people on the left who are too extreme, then of course there are. There are people who are too extreme in all walks of life

But the idea that they are pushing for is equal treatment of all races. The opposite of fascism.

I totally understand people thinking rioting, looting and destroying things is taking things too far. If change could be enacted by peaceful protest alone, the world would be a much better place.

But unfortunately, there have been dozens of peaceful marches over the last few years on this issue, and nothing has changed.

But the outrage, the anger, has actually made people take notice this time. And it is effecting change in many people, look at NFL commissioner Goodell’s as an example.

It shouldn’t have to be this way.
 
stonerblue said:
I wonder waht todays reason for showing no sympathy, support or allegiance to the cause will be?
Got 20 pages to get through so i'm sure i'll be able to answer my own question shortly. Onwards..
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"I don't give a shit and those who do are stupid. Now here's a couple of videos I looked for of some black people agreeing with me"

and

"I don't believe Britain has a problem with racism. Well, not real racism"

are two of the most predictable templates for responses on bluemoon whenever a thread emerges on the subject.
 
Chippy_boy said:
Why is it a good thing? Do you think we have an institutionally racist society? I do not. This is blown out of all proportion. Poor people brought up in shitty environments do not have as good life chances as rich people. WTF has race got to do with it?
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Not institutionally no but there exists issues still with individuals.

Highlighting the race problem will only make people think more carefully about it.

I do agree it’s been blown out of proportion here and that the protests, in the middle of a pandemic, were ridiculously irresponsible.
 
Shaelumstash said:
Strange analogy.

You're equating the oppression people face based on the genetics there were born with, alongside ostracising people who hold racist views.
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And what is that oppression exactly? How does that manifest itself in 2020 Britain? The "Whites Only" schools? The jobs for which black people cannot apply? The universities which don't accept people of colour? There are no black or Asian doctors?

I am not saying there are no cases of racism whatsoever, but what I am saying is this is HUGELY overplayed by a group who are pissed off about people poor whilst other people are rich. And they have one huge fucking great big chip on their shoulder about it.

EDIT: Just seen your post above. Yes, it's hugely overplayed. Anyone would think we lived in 1970's South Africa. We do not.
 
nimrod said:
Thoughts of some famous black people. Surprised me.

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It'd be interesting to see what they say now, being rich Black folks that have gotten themselves out of the system, about Breonna Taylor? About the knee on George Floyd's neck? About the scores, the hundreds of thousands of marching people all over the world?

Maybe they're all blind and just these affluent people are right...?

It's interesting Washington got himself involved between a cop and a Black men 10 days ago following the George Floyd murder!

I wonder why he bothered...
 
Ban-jani said:
I was there, not taking part, I walked past it at the time, they had that Antifa symbol they use, the red and white one and everyone in town I spoke to said it was Antifa, including sympathisers of them.
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Fair enough,

I have seen that symbol at ralies, they are given out like SWP ones to people not affiliated to unions or groups, who haven't got placards mainly.

I get given Unison ones or labour party ones as I am memeber of both, SWP ones have been handed to me at marches and other crank groups I tell them to fick off as they are cunts.

I did march with a YPG placard and the Kurdistan movement at the last one in town for a bit, which legally makes me a terrorist supporter as the YPG are on the list of terrorist organisations.
 
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urban genie said:
Fair enough,

I have seen that symbol at ralies, they are given out lislke SWP ones to people not affiliated to unions or groups, who haven't got placards mainly l.

I get given Unison ones or labour party ones as I am memeber of both, SWP ones have been handed to me at marches and other crank groups I tell them to fick off as they are cunts.

I did march with a YPG placard and the Kurdistan movement at the last one in town for a bit, which legally makes me a terrorist supporter as the YPG are on the list of terrorist organisations.
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Which is utterly ridiculous by the way.
 
Honestly, stomach churning virtue signalling at its worst from Nancy Pelosi and crew to Jamie Dimond's 'down wid da peeps album cover' kneeling shots. Ironically, all wanted and have looted the tax payer to bailout big businesses before people.

https%3A%2F%2Fd1e00ek4ebabms.cloudfront.net%2Fproduction%2Fa3492eaf-eb4b-4099-aef5-a513a5ccc392.jpg


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It's sickening and like the cops before you doing this, you don't really give a shit!
 
Shaelumstash said:
Keep hearing this, “the anti-fascists are the real fascists”.

I don’t agree.

I think that shows a fundamental misunderstanding of what fascism means.

If you’re saying there are people on the left who are too extreme, then of course there are. There are people who are too extreme in all walks of life

But the idea that they are pushing for is equal treatment of all races. The opposite of fascism.

I totally understand people thinking rioting, looting and destroying things is taking things too far. If change could be enacted by peaceful protest alone, the world would be a much better place.

But unfortunately, there have been dozens of peaceful marches over the last few years on this issue, and nothing has changed.

But the outrage, the anger, has actually made people take notice this time. And it is effecting change in many people, look at NFL commissioner Goodell’s as an example.

It shouldn’t have to be this way.
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Difficult balance. If a protest causes no disruption then it passes unnoticed, but once the violence/ vandalism starts it loses popular support. I don't know if there is an easy answer. The climate change protests seemed to get it right, but as it dragged on the disruption in London seemed to start losing support rather than gaining attention. I think the shorter a protest is, the more disruption can be tolerated. If the BLM protests depend into violence and vandalism on a weekly basis public opinion will harden and the original point will be lost.
 
Chippy_boy said:
Absolutely agreed.

I think the rioters and protestors in the main have very little to do with objecting to racism. They consist of marxist hippies, idealistic 20-year olds (i.e. people who haven't got a fucking clue) and then swathes of poor people, who don't like being poor and living in Easton or Hartcliffe or Knowle West in Bristol, for example. For they are shit holes.
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Haha this is ridiculous. I could just as easily say that the people who oppose of the protests are mainly racists, fascists and brexit supporters. Neither of us would be correct.
 
blueinsa said:
Agree to an extent but...

The issues start when the self proclaimed anti racists start to call people who are not racist.....racists. What makes you visibly anti racist? Saying so on social media? Going on a march? Taking a knee? Wearing a face scarf whilst chanting BLM?
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Doesn't take much to be branded a Nazi these days. Plus everything right of left seems to have a 'far' in front of it. I've noticed the media doing this also. It can't be helping any cause because of the watering down effect due to it's overuse. It's almost like the shock effect of being branded a racist is being lost. Another thing, people on the left like to think everyone as one yet they are by far the worst for pigeonholing people. The whole issue is a fucking mess.
 
Bigga said:
Honestly, stomach churning virtue signalling at its worst from Nancy Pelosi and crew to Jamie Dimond's 'down wid da peeps album cover' kneeling shots. Ironically, all wanted and have looted the tax payer to bailout big businesses before people.

https%3A%2F%2Fd1e00ek4ebabms.cloudfront.net%2Fproduction%2Fa3492eaf-eb4b-4099-aef5-a513a5ccc392.jpg


8mjlf7ijq9351.jpg


It's sickening and like the cops before you doing this, you don't really give a shit!
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All part of the system that is currently enslaving black men and Hispanics in their millions by mass long term incarceration and then forced labour for large multinationals.
 
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