Another new Brexit thread

[Metal Biker]

How many different versions of remain do you think there might have been?

Status Quo, MORE Europe, becoming a member of the Eurozone, terrified about life no longer being an EU member. Take your pick.

 

[Metal Biker]

He included us all, apart from 0.00001%. And he's right.
You gonna tell me you were always au-fait with trade agreements, lpf, gfa, taxes, security, fucking fishing, wto rules etc etc? If you were then consider yourself part of the 0.000001% and give yerself a pat on the back.

Nope, because none of that was my motivation, as you well know, Mr "Ignore-my-posts-if-they-bore-you"

Do you really believe that 99.99% of the population admits to reading every single political party manifesto before making their choice? If not I guess those people should be ineligible to vote eh? What elitist crap! XD

 

[ganganvince]

Then you missed out. Brexit itself was the result of a decades long campaign by the print media, of hostility to a Europe and anti-immigration sentiment. Tories themselves have long been hostile to Europe and Europeans at a grass roots level.

There are many ways to effect change. Sitting there passively isn’t one of them.

Only relevant if you want to force your opinion on others rather than accept democratically arrived at decisions your post by ommision would suggest labour weren't anti EU.

 

[Metal Biker]

He is right though, it was built on lies

Examples. Was it a lie that the EU has become more political and people were opposed to that development?

 

[Vic]

You fight, campaign, speak out, organise, demonstrate and seek to overturn an outcome you disagree with.

Decisions whether through Govt actions or via direct referendum are never set in stone, they are subject to changing events, changing mood of the electorate, greater realisation and understanding of the core issue etc.

And if you're Starmer

He included us all, apart from 0.00001%. And he's right.
You gonna tell me you were always au-fait with trade agreements, lpf, gfa, taxes, security, fucking fishing, wto rules etc etc? If you were then consider yourself part of the 0.000001% and give yerself a pat on the back.

Next he'll be telling us he didn't want to stay in a free trade zone from Iceland to the Russian border.

 

[BobKowalski]

How do you think it's going so far?

Pretty good, given I’m rooting for Brexit to be an epic shitshow and so far it’s been an epic shitshow. Highlights of this week include:

Brexit INEOS boss promising to build cars in Wales and then doing a last minute switch to France with a ‘soz lads’
More Banks moving assets to the EU.
A UK PM asking to speak to the French President and getting told he’s busy can he call you back? Spoiler. He isn’t.
Capitulating on the law breaking clauses in the IMB and facilitating the transfer of NI to the EU. In retaliation we made EU personnel in NI ‘hot desk’ rather than give them permanent office space. That’ll show ‘em!

There is probably more, but these have been the most fun.

 

[HelloCity]

Fairly put to be honest....

I would you know.

 

[Saddleworth2]

The current situation and proximity to 1st January seem to have awoken some from a slumber. Yes it was won on lies etc etc but to be fair all of that is ancient history. Quite amusing to see these arguments again on this thread.

What is certain is life will change on 1st Jan and the ramifications, great or small will become obvious quite quickly. It’s then down to every individual to make their own mind up what to do about it and who to vote for next time there is an opportunity.

 

[Saddleworth2]

How do you think it's going so far?

Rubbish.

 

[BobKowalski]

Only relevant if you want to force your opinion on others rather than accept democratically arrived at decisions your post by ommision would suggest labour weren't anti EU.

Every campaign, demonstration, protest, sit in, social media post, letter to the local newspaper is about voicing your opinion and trying to put your opinion and view across.

It‘s given women the vote, equal rights, gay marriage and Brexit to name but a few.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Pretty good, given I’m rooting for Brexit to be an epic shitshow and so far it’s been an epic shitshow. Highlights of this week include:

Brexit INEOS boss promising to build cars in Wales and then doing a last minute switch to France with a ‘soz lads’
More Banks moving assets to the EU.
A UK PM asking to speak to the French President and getting told he’s busy can he call you back? Spoiler. He isn’t.
Capitulating on the law breaking clauses in the IMB and facilitating the transfer of NI to the EU. In retaliation we made EU personnel in NI ‘hot desk’ rather than give them permanent office space. That’ll show ‘em!

There is probably more, but these have been the most fun.

Given that a critisism of voting for brexit is that it is often described as an act of wilful self-harm I find it a bit strange that you would actively wish for the worst possible outcome for the country you live in just so you can be 'right' and describe this as 'fun'. It's a little like a flat earther hoping their ship falls off the edge of earth and into space just to prove their point. I actually hope for the best for both the UK and the EU, but at least you are not afraid to be honest I suppose.

 

[crazyg]

But it was literally proven that it was sold on lies. Do you honestly think that is fine? Do you think we should throw ourselves off the cliff anyway? Why?

100,000 lemmings can't be wrong, can they?

;-)

 

[BobKowalski]

A lot of the problem stems from giving thick people a vote. Surely if just the better educated were allowed one we wouldn't be in this mess and would be assured of a better and more democratic outcome?

The problem lies in asking people to vote on a country’s domestic and foreign policy going forward via a simple question with inadequate and misleading information and on which the majority don’t have a bleeding clue. There was not even a vision or plan for what we wanted if the decision was to scrap the past 40 years, given everyone was told nothing would really change and the sun would always shine.

Currently it’s fucking pissing down and the man in charge is a sack of spuds.

 

[ganganvince]

Rubbish.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

The problem lies in asking people to vote on a country’s domestic and foreign policy going forward via a simple question with inadequate and misleading information and on which the majority don’t have a bleeding clue. There was not even a vision or plan for what we wanted if the decision was to scrap the past 40 years, given everyone was told nothing would really change and the sun would always shine.

Reckless beyond words.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

The problem lies in asking people to vote on a country’s domestic and foreign policy going forward via a simple question with inadequate and misleading information and on which the majority don’t have a bleeding clue. There was not even a vision or plan for what we wanted if the decision was to scrap the past 40 years, given everyone was told nothing would really change and the sun would always shine.

Currently it’s fucking pissing down and the man in charge is a sack of spuds.

Yes, fair enough. But why would you actually want it to get worse rather than better?

 

[Vic]

A lot of the problem stems from giving thick people a vote. Surely if just the better educated were allowed one we wouldn't be in this mess and would be assured of a better and more democratic outcome?

You can be well educated and thick. The government is full of them. Don't forget the Tories were historically opposed to education for the masses and extending the franchise to the educated masses.

I have gone off democracy a bit. After Trump and Brexit the idea of benevolent dictatorship has some appeal. Either that or a system that doesn't give disproportionate power to a minority, and rely on an unelected chamber for checks and balances. Actually, the Italian bureaucrats did ok, and Belgian civil servants managed for ages without a government.

Gosh - how bad does a government have to be before (misquoting Churchill) democracy isn't the worst form of government except all others?

 

[west didsblue]

Given that a critisism of voting for brexit is that it is often described as an act of wilful self-harm I find it a bit strange that you would actively wish for the worst possible outcome for the country you live in just so you can be 'right' and describe this as 'fun'. It's a little like a flat earther hoping their ship falls off the edge of earth and into space just to prove their point. I actually hope for the best for both the UK and the EU, but at least you are not afraid to be honest I suppose.

Hoping for the best is all very well but when it’s very clear that it’s going to be an utter shitshow from day 1 it’s probably better for everyone to realise that it’s a complete clusterfuck as quickly as possible so that hopefully the government will be forced to do something about it. If it’s death by a thousand cuts it will be worse in the long run. So the best outcome is that it’s utterly shit so that everyone realises something needs to be done sooner rather than later.

 

[M18CTID]

Given that a critisism of voting for brexit is that it is often described as an act of wilful self-harm I find it a bit strange that you would actively wish for the worst possible outcome for the country you live in just so you can be 'right' and describe this as 'fun'. It's a little like a flat earther hoping their ship falls off the edge of earth and into space just to prove their point. I actually hope for the best for both the UK and the EU, but at least you are not afraid to be honest I suppose.

Yeah, it's a weird one alright. If the vote didn't go your way, I can understand people being disappointed but why would you then want it to be a disaster as that would surely affect both Leavers and Remainers alike. If it does indeed turn out to be a shit show then Brexit won't discriminate and only cause Leavers hardship. Surely you'd want to be pleasantly surprised and hoping for it to be as big a success as possible.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

Given that a critisism of voting for brexit is that it is often described as an act of wilful self-harm I find it a bit strange that you would actively wish for the worst possible outcome for the country you live in just so you can be 'right' and describe this as 'fun'. It's a little like a flat earther hoping their ship falls off the edge of earth and into space just to prove their point. I actually hope for the best for both the UK and the EU, but at least you are not afraid to be honest I suppose.

I think the more telling argument other than bobs hope for misery so he can say he was right on a football forum

is if he believes brexit is going to be a total shit show and really bad for the uk and it’s citizens and businesses ...

why is it that the major sticking point in the negotiations is that the EU are insisting on us mirroring their own reg and regulations and restricting our state aid and we must have a level playing field Because they don’t want the uk to have a competitive advantage over the eu on its doorstep.

what are the eu so scared of? If we are going to be fucked and a basket case why the need to restrict us? The truth is they don’t want the uk to succeed and fear it will do so hence this sticking point.

anyway I have given up posting on this thread as it’s boring but I do find this paradox interesting.