The Conservative Party

Ifwecouldjust....... said:
As I said .... its between those that care and those that dont.
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Risk and reward. Cost and benefit. Amongst other objections, well meaning revolutions often go very wrong. And the 'cleanest' war is usually far worse for the innocent and vulnerable, than an unsatisfactory peace.
 
PannickAtTheDisco said:
No, I'm applying the fundamentals of human existence.
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The tribal collective that existed for millenia would disagree. Humanity has become selfish and individualistic because of capitalism and materialism.

Assuming somebody has to be at the top and will fight tooth and nail to get there has simply not always been the case. The tribal system that allowed humanity to thrive was altruistic, humans are social animals who do best when they co-operate, that is why Communism is the perfect system for humanity to thrive and evolve, capitalism destroys the co-operative nature of humanity and individualism thrives. When individualism thrives inequality grows and selfishness and materialism take over.
 
Rascal said:
The tribal collective that existed for millenia would disagree. Humanity has become selfish and individualistic because of capitalism and materialism.

Assuming somebody has to be at the top and will fight tooth and nail to get there has simply not always been the case. The tribal system that allowed humanity to thrive was altruistic, humans are social animals who do best when they co-operate, that is why Communism is the perfect system for humanity to thrive and evolve, capitalism destroys the co-operative nature of humanity and individualism thrives. When individualism thrives inequality grows and selfishness and materialism take over.
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And they still had structures through elders, defined roles, mating, hunting, foraging etc. Co-operation accompanies structure and hierarchy, it doesn't replace it.
 
PannickAtTheDisco said:
And they still had structures through elders, defined roles, mating, hunting, foraging etc. Co-operation accompanies structure and hierarchy, it doesn't replace it.
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You are still assuming Hierarchy exists in Communism, that clown Peterson makes the same assumptions when he attempts to talk about Marxism.

They were cooperatives with defined roles just as a commune would but they would be decided by democracy not by dictatorship.

Move away from seeing the authoritarian dictatorship that the Macarthyites pushed and look at collectives as a structure where cooperation for the common good takes precendence over individual outcomes.
 
Rascal said:
You are still assuming Hierarchy exists in Communism, that clown Peterson makes the same assumptions when he attempts to talk about Marxism.

They were cooperatives with defined roles just as a commune would but they would be decided by democracy not by dictatorship.

Move away from seeing the authoritarian dictatorship that the Macarthyites pushed and look at collectives as a structure where cooperation for the common good takes precendence over individual outcomes.
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I don't need to consider whether communism as a theoretical principle needa a hierarchy. If communism wishes to exist in a practical sense it has to incorporate a hierarchical structure and that is where it then turns authoritarian and fails. Whether you call it the committee, parliament, tribal council or just straight dictatorship, ultimately politics is played, power is exerted, alliances are formed, rivalries are emboldened and altruistic, objective decision-making fall off the radar and self-preservation kicks in.
 


I hope this is bollocks. Then again with Patel having a fetish for it I wouldn’t be surprised.
 
mat said:


I hope this is bollocks. Then again with Patel having a fetish for it I wouldn’t be surprised.
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She'd be better off seeing whether any of those 1246 pages of agreement make any reference to that sort of thing scuppering the deal with the EU

www.reuters.com

Death penalty in Turkey would mean end to EU accession talks - Juncker

The European Union should continue accession negotiations with Turkey but a reintroduction of the death penalty would clearly put an end to the process, European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker said on Wednesday.
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com

 
mat said:


I hope this is bollocks. Then again with Patel having a fetish for it I wouldn’t be surprised.
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I doubt the story tbf, it could be true that she has asled, but when she spouted sitte about it last time there were enough in her party that didn't have the stomach for it's return.

Wouldn't put it past her though to try
 
urban genie said:
I doubt the story tbf, it could be true that she has asled, but when she spouted sitte about it last time there were enough in her party that didn't have the stomach for it's return.

Wouldn't put it past her though to try
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as they lurch ever more to the right to secure a base they end up getting more and more extreme thoughts. A number of them are uber R/W and will float anything to see how it plays out. This will paly out well with the anit-forriner brigade, Colonel Hufton-Tufton rtd and angry of Biggleswade. They will then see how they can use it o their advantage. It may never be intended for deployment for a number of reasons but it will stoke the fire in some bellies.
 
bluethrunthru said:
as they lurch ever more to the right to secure a base they end up getting more and more extreme thoughts. A number of them are uber R/W and will float anything to see how it plays out. This will paly out well with the anit-forriner brigade, Colonel Hufton-Tufton rtd and angry of Biggleswade. They will then see how they can use it o their advantage. It may never be intended for deployment for a number of reasons but it will stoke the fire in some bellies.
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She's got one **** reeled in. Hopkins next I reckon.
 
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