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BobKowalski said:
From the last crime survey

‘The vast majority of sexual offences do not get solved. In fact, most sexual offences do not even get reported to the police.
The Crime Survey for England and Wales shows 151,000 people - including 144,000 women - were victims of rape or attempted rape in the last year for which these figures are available.
But just 59,000 rapes were actually reported to the police last year.
In the same year, just 1,439 people were actually convicted. This was the lowest number since figures started being released in 2014-15.’ @BBC

To be honest, the threat to women of ‘gender self identification’ would seem to be low on the list of things to worry about. Trans people exist, always have done and if Gareth wants to self identify as Gwen, then who gives a fuck?
Click to expand...
Geraldine, Gemma and all the other women in the women's changing room when Gareth walks in?
 
Fode N The Hole said:
No. I don't support blanket self-id, and have said before that I don't automatically assume that someone declaring they are born in the wrong body is actually truely transgender. Autism and other developmental/psychological issues might be at play. And I have said this before on this forum.

The issue of self-id is a bit of a paradox, as most transexual women want to use cross sex hormones, and to have access to endocrinology services they would have to seen a psychologist/psychiatrist to confirm their feelings are actually symptoms of gender dysphoria.

I don't consider Alex Drummond as transexual or transgender in the sense that he is claiming to be a "transwoman" whilst wearing a full-face beard and having no intention to medically transistion whilst claiming to "queer gender" and deliberately dressing to be "recognised as a transgender" rather than a woman. That is a queer or gender non-conforming identity, not transexual.

I didn’t say it about the other women just Robles. And there is a reason why she has some more masculine features besides her chosen sport, she has polycystic ovary syndrome. Different hormonal levels and which can alter physical features.

Have you bothered to look up the scoreboards?

She finished 13 out of 13, only managed to make 1 lift and had 3 fails in the first category.
Click to expand...
Not sure what most of that means but good post.
 
BobKowalski said:
From the last crime survey

‘The vast majority of sexual offences do not get solved. In fact, most sexual offences do not even get reported to the police.
The Crime Survey for England and Wales shows 151,000 people - including 144,000 women - were victims of rape or attempted rape in the last year for which these figures are available.
But just 59,000 rapes were actually reported to the police last year.
In the same year, just 1,439 people were actually convicted. This was the lowest number since figures started being released in 2014-15.’ @BBC

To be honest, the threat to women of ‘gender self identification’ would seem to be low on the list of things to worry about. Trans people exist, always have done and if Gareth wants to self identify as Gwen, then who gives a fuck?
Click to expand...

Your who gives a fuck comment reminded me of this.....

Roberet Ince is a comedian, he posted a tweet highlighted in blue below from a Twitter account now deleted, along the same kind of lines as you, who gives a fuck when blah, blah, blah

Fode's favourite saddo Graham Linehan asked Ince 20 questions, to which he received no reply, some are specific to Ince but most are general in nature.

Care to have a stab at answering a few of them, or any of them?

Robin Ince @robinince
Weird that we have an incompetent, malicious, destructive & duplicitous government with incredible power, yet apparently the real dangers are Stonewall & trans people and I'm told a true hero of feminism is someone who has attacked & abused many of my feminist friends.
August 25th 2021
124 Retweets1,163 Likes
20 Questions
  1. Can you define what you mean by ‘trans people’? Do you mean transsexuals? Or do you mean crossdressers like Eddie Izzard? Can you define ‘trans’ without resorting to sex stereotypes?
  2. Do you think adult human females should be able to have a word to define themselves, in the same way all other female mammals have? If so, what do you think that word should be?
  3. When you and your feminist friends say “transwomen are women” do you mean it literally? Many women are losing their livelihoods for stating that they are a different sex to Eddie Izzard. Are these women bigots, in your view?
  4. Can you understand why many women might find terms like ‘bleeders’, ‘mensturators’ and ‘cervix-havers’ offensive and dehumanising? Why do you think men are not subject to these same demeaning labels?
  5. On a similar note, if you believe lesbians can have penises, what word do you propose should be used to describe adult human females who are exclusively attracted to adult human females?
  6. Do you think anyone—male or female— has the right to give away all women’s sex-based rights because some men are asking for them?
  7. If you had a daughter who had transitioned medically, removing her breast tissue and given medication that rendered her infertile, how would you feel if she said— like Keira Bell and Sinead Watson, and many more—that she had made a mistake and wished to detransition?
  8. Do you think females deserve the chance to excel in sport on a level playing field? Did you know that Laurel Hubbard stole the woman’s New Zealand weightlifting record from an indigenous woman? Is that fair?
  9. Do you believe that male-born people should have the right to undress in a space where women and girls are undressing?
  10. When a woman is in an open plan female changing room, how can she tell the difference between a male who identifies as transgender and any other male?
  11. Do you accept a sufficient number of males pose a threat to females to justify single sex spaces? If not, could you explain your answer?
  12. If you replace biological sex with gender identity throughout society, as the basis of separation and categorisation, what safeguarding do you propose to put in place to ensure that it isn’t abused?
  13. Are you concerned that rapid onset gender dysphoria disproportionately affects autistic children? Do you think autistic children should be prescribed the same drug that was used to chemically castrate Alan Turing and is still used on sex offenders and prostate-cancer patients?
  14. Can you name any other oppressed group which would or should celebrate their oppressors identifying into it?
  15. If a female victim of rape does not want to be examined by a male, and she believes his gender identity is irrelevant in this situation, is she a bigot?
  16. If a man claims he is a woman some of the time, like Phillip/Pippa Bunce, does that mean he actually IS a woman during that time?
  17. You know Gia very well. Why do you not respect her enough to answer her question here?
  18. 1630326345222.pngShould women in prison be forced to serve even a second of their time in captivity with criminals who are biologically male?
  19. iven the importance you place on gender identity and trans rights, why do you claim not to understand the issues surrounding it? Wouldn’t it have been prudent, given how important it seems to be to you, to have researched it?
  20. If little boys are taught that enjoying dolls and the colour pink means that their gender identity may not match their sex, what impact do you think this will have on children who would otherwise grow up to be healthy, happy gay adults?
 
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Vic said:
Geraldine, Gemma and all the other women in the women's changing room when Gareth walks in?
Click to expand...

Ironically enough, I know a "Georgina" a nurse from the Philippines who was complimented on physique in the changing rooms of swimming pool in a London hotel by mothers in there. I found this quite amusing at the time, "if only they knew".

Which brings me to something I forgot to talk in my response to Fumble earlier...

There are lots of Filipino nurses in the UK, and this includes some transsexual women (who can't legally change their gender in their home country) but can elect to use their chosen female name(s) on their workplace nametags despite being known as their male name for legal purposes.

And then of course we have individuals who might have legally changed gender in another country and be known as female on their passports and other documents. How do we treat these people? We have no way of knowing short of intensive physical examination/ sharing of medical records with other agencies/ declaration of previous name on DBS clearance.
 
The perfect fumble said:
Your who gives a fuck comment reminded me of this.....

Roberet Ince is a comedian, he posted a tweet highlighted in blue below from a Twitter account now deleted, along the same kind of lines as you, who gives a fuck when blah, blah, blah

Fode's favourite saddo Graham Linehan asked Ince 20 questions, to which he received no reply, some are specific to Ince but most are general in nature.

Care to have a stab at answering a few of them, or any of them?

Robin Ince @robinince
Weird that we have an incompetent, malicious, destructive & duplicitous government with incredible power, yet apparently the real dangers are Stonewall & trans people and I'm told a true hero of feminism is someone who has attacked & abused many of my feminist friends.
August 25th 2021
124 Retweets1,163 Likes
20 Questions
  1. Can you define what you mean by ‘trans people’? Do you mean transsexuals? Or do you mean crossdressers like Eddie Izzard? Can you define ‘trans’ without resorting to sex stereotypes?
  2. Do you think adult human females should be able to have a word to define themselves, in the same way all other female mammals have? If so, what do you think that word should be?
  3. When you and your feminist friends say “transwomen are women” do you mean it literally? Many women are losing their livelihoods for stating that they are a different sex to Eddie Izzard. Are these women bigots, in your view?
  4. Can you understand why many women might find terms like ‘bleeders’, ‘mensturators’ and ‘cervix-havers’ offensive and dehumanising? Why do you think men are not subject to these same demeaning labels?
  5. On a similar note, if you believe lesbians can have penises, what word do you propose should be used to describe adult human females who are exclusively attracted to adult human females?
  6. Do you think anyone—male or female— has the right to give away all women’s sex-based rights because some men are asking for them?
  7. If you had a daughter who had transitioned medically, removing her breast tissue and given medication that rendered her infertile, how would you feel if she said— like Keira Bell and Sinead Watson, and many more—that she had made a mistake and wished to detransition?
  8. Do you think females deserve the chance to excel in sport on a level playing field? Did you know that Laurel Hubbard stole the woman’s New Zealand weightlifting record from an indigenous woman? Is that fair?
  9. Do you believe that male-born people should have the right to undress in a space where women and girls are undressing?
  10. When a woman is in an open plan female changing room, how can she tell the difference between a male who identifies as transgender and any other male?
  11. Do you accept a sufficient number of males pose a threat to females to justify single sex spaces? If not, could you explain your answer?
  12. If you replace biological sex with gender identity throughout society, as the basis of separation and categorisation, what safeguarding do you propose to put in place to ensure that it isn’t abused?
  13. Are you concerned that rapid onset gender dysphoria disproportionately affects autistic children? Do you think autistic children should be prescribed the same drug that was used to chemically castrate Alan Turing and is still used on sex offenders and prostate-cancer patients?
  14. Can you name any other oppressed group which would or should celebrate their oppressors identifying into it?
  15. If a female victim of rape does not want to be examined by a male, and she believes his gender identity is irrelevant in this situation, is she a bigot?
  16. If a man claims he is a woman some of the time, like Phillip/Pippa Bunce, does that mean he actually IS a woman during that time?
  17. You know Gia very well. Why do you not respect her enough to answer her question here?
  18. View attachment 25470Should women in prison be forced to serve even a second of their time in captivity with criminals who are biologically male?
  19. iven the importance you place on gender identity and trans rights, why do you claim not to understand the issues surrounding it? Wouldn’t it have been prudent, given how important it seems to be to you, to have researched it?
  20. If little boys are taught that enjoying dolls and the colour pink means that their gender identity may not match their sex, what impact do you think this will have on children who would otherwise grow up to be healthy, happy gay adults?
Click to expand...

Okay, I'll give it a stab.

1. No.
2. What word does a female wombat use to define themselves?
3. Many women? Is Eddie Izzard trans? Thought he was a bloke who liked crossdressing. Could be wrong, though.
4. Offensive terms are offensive terms and shouldn't be tolerated.
5. Wild stab at this one. Lesbian?
6. Who are they giving away their rights to? Will women no longer enjoy these rights if they apply to a trans woman?
7. I would commiserate with them. Heartless not to. I would also say the opposite to those who have transitioned and are happy they have done so. I have no idea on the respective split in figures between the two camps.
8. White privilege eh? It's a fucker. I have no idea how it is dealt with. Women have higher testosterone through various conditions. Do we ban them? Always thought they handled the case of the south African runner Semenya unfairly. Perhaps there should be third category of sex. On a side point I did enjoy the mixed races in the Olympic swimming and track rely.
9. My changing room where I go swimming is unisex. I mean, come on.
10. I’d wonder why she was going around checking out gentalia so closely.
11. I would support safe spaces for people. I'd also leave it based on knowledge and choice of the individuals in question. The inference is all trans women are solely there to either perv or abuse women. How much of that is reality or just ill informed perception?
12. Biological sex is no guarantee of behaviour by one group versus the other group. Gender ID isn’t quite me waking up this morning and deciding I want to be called Loretta. Treat people based on their merits. If a trans woman is being badly abused - as they are often are, then I see no issue in them in a woman support shelter.

I am posting this now...the rest shortly.
 
BobKowalski said:
From the last crime survey

‘The vast majority of sexual offences do not get solved. In fact, most sexual offences do not even get reported to the police.
The Crime Survey for England and Wales shows 151,000 people - including 144,000 women - were victims of rape or attempted rape in the last year for which these figures are available.
But just 59,000 rapes were actually reported to the police last year.
In the same year, just 1,439 people were actually convicted. This was the lowest number since figures started being released in 2014-15.’ @BBC

To be honest, the threat to women of ‘gender self identification’ would seem to be low on the list of things to worry about. Trans people exist, always have done and if Gareth wants to self identify as Gwen, then who gives a fuck?
Click to expand...

So 90,000+ mere accusations then, I think it's reasonable to go off the number of those convicted from 59,000 actual reports to get a true picture in society. The rest is supposition. I think we have bigger problems than 1,500 incidents 2bh.
 
The perfect fumble said:
Your who gives a fuck comment reminded me of this.....

Roberet Ince is a comedian, he posted a tweet highlighted in blue below from a Twitter account now deleted, along the same kind of lines as you, who gives a fuck when blah, blah, blah

Fode's favourite saddo Graham Linehan asked Ince 20 questions, to which he received no reply, some are specific to Ince but most are general in nature.

Care to have a stab at answering a few of them, or any of them?

Robin Ince @robinince
Weird that we have an incompetent, malicious, destructive & duplicitous government with incredible power, yet apparently the real dangers are Stonewall & trans people and I'm told a true hero of feminism is someone who has attacked & abused many of my feminist friends.
August 25th 2021
124 Retweets1,163 Likes
20 Questions
  1. Can you define what you mean by ‘trans people’? Do you mean transsexuals? Or do you mean crossdressers like Eddie Izzard? Can you define ‘trans’ without resorting to sex stereotypes?
  2. Do you think adult human females should be able to have a word to define themselves, in the same way all other female mammals have? If so, what do you think that word should be?
  3. When you and your feminist friends say “transwomen are women” do you mean it literally? Many women are losing their livelihoods for stating that they are a different sex to Eddie Izzard. Are these women bigots, in your view?
  4. Can you understand why many women might find terms like ‘bleeders’, ‘mensturators’ and ‘cervix-havers’ offensive and dehumanising? Why do you think men are not subject to these same demeaning labels?
  5. On a similar note, if you believe lesbians can have penises, what word do you propose should be used to describe adult human females who are exclusively attracted to adult human females?
  6. Do you think anyone—male or female— has the right to give away all women’s sex-based rights because some men are asking for them?
  7. If you had a daughter who had transitioned medically, removing her breast tissue and given medication that rendered her infertile, how would you feel if she said— like Keira Bell and Sinead Watson, and many more—that she had made a mistake and wished to detransition?
  8. Do you think females deserve the chance to excel in sport on a level playing field? Did you know that Laurel Hubbard stole the woman’s New Zealand weightlifting record from an indigenous woman? Is that fair?
  9. Do you believe that male-born people should have the right to undress in a space where women and girls are undressing?
  10. When a woman is in an open plan female changing room, how can she tell the difference between a male who identifies as transgender and any other male?
  11. Do you accept a sufficient number of males pose a threat to females to justify single sex spaces? If not, could you explain your answer?
  12. If you replace biological sex with gender identity throughout society, as the basis of separation and categorisation, what safeguarding do you propose to put in place to ensure that it isn’t abused?
  13. Are you concerned that rapid onset gender dysphoria disproportionately affects autistic children? Do you think autistic children should be prescribed the same drug that was used to chemically castrate Alan Turing and is still used on sex offenders and prostate-cancer patients?
  14. Can you name any other oppressed group which would or should celebrate their oppressors identifying into it?
  15. If a female victim of rape does not want to be examined by a male, and she believes his gender identity is irrelevant in this situation, is she a bigot?
  16. If a man claims he is a woman some of the time, like Phillip/Pippa Bunce, does that mean he actually IS a woman during that time?
  17. You know Gia very well. Why do you not respect her enough to answer her question here?
  18. View attachment 25470Should women in prison be forced to serve even a second of their time in captivity with criminals who are biologically male?
  19. iven the importance you place on gender identity and trans rights, why do you claim not to understand the issues surrounding it? Wouldn’t it have been prudent, given how important it seems to be to you, to have researched it?
  20. If little boys are taught that enjoying dolls and the colour pink means that their gender identity may not match their sex, what impact do you think this will have on children who would otherwise grow up to be healthy, happy gay adults?
Click to expand...

13. Is autism a byproduct of gender dysphoria? You are straying into medical fields that I am not qualified to answer.
14. What is this? Oppressed Groups Top Trumps? Jeez.
15. The woman is allowed the right to be comfortable with who she is examined by. If a woman is raped by a man then a reflexive action towards the person examining her is understandable. A little sensitivity to the situation can never go amiss. We are really scraping the ‘what if’ barrel with this one.
16. I refer you to my initial answer. Who fucking cares.
17. I don’t know Gia :)
18. Like male prison guards?
19. Not really. Kind of live and let live is my attitude.
20. Not a bloody clue. I‘m sure someone, somewhere is doing research on this and will probably find making little boys play with dolls other than Action Man will end in fruitless tears.
 
PannickAtTheDisco said:
So 90,000+ mere accusations then, I think it's reasonable to go off the number of those convicted from 59,000 actual reports to get a true picture in society. The rest is supposition. I think we have bigger problems than 1,500 incidents 2bh.
Click to expand...

Your casual dismissal of rape and sexual assault is noted.

But trans women are the problem apparently.
 
The perfect fumble said:
For you the existence of every problem on the planet is your go to nothing to see card for gender ideology.

It wasn't particularly interesting in your first who gives a fuck post, It's tiresome and repetitive
Click to expand...

I think gender ideology or whatever the fuck you want to call it is not the problem for women with 144,000 sexual assaults, a third acted on and around 1,500 resulting in conviction.

To me the anti-trans lobby seems to be a solution in search of a problem.
 
BobKowalski said:
I think gender ideology or whatever the fuck you want to call it is not the problem for women with 144,000 sexual assaults, a third acted on and around 1,500 resulting in conviction.

To me the anti-trans lobby seems to be a solution in search of a problem.
Click to expand...

144,000 accusations, a third with enough evidence and basis in fact that they actually could report it and 1,500 actually proven to be true.

We can all dress it to suit a narrative we want and end up with our own view of the world. Some of us just choose to take facts whereas others like yourself want to extrapolate another 142,500 guilty verdicts to suit your narrative. See right through you.

I guess Mendy is guilty without a conviction to, he'll be deemed a rapist regardless for the rest of his life whilst the accusers will see no recourse if they don't prove it. How long did Evans have to go away before he got justice? Career severely impeded and name tarnished forever. But to you, even your own are guilty based on an allegation so let's hang them at the gallows.
 
The perfect fumble said:
More grist to the mill...


Click to expand...


An oddball on Tik Cok?

Who cares? People of all sexual orientations and gender expression get to pick who they want to date and have sex with. Is it transphobic? No. Most gay men aren't into transmen. People can have a sexual preference by ethnicity, I don't think it is racist.

It can sometimes be a case of people defining their wants and desires by their labels, e.g. "I'm gay so I can't possible get with that bloke who has a vagina, despite me salivating over his well-defined muscles and facial hair up until the point I found he was born female bodied". Rather than their wants and desires defining their label.

www.theguardian.com

What happens when your partner comes out as trans?

Five people who stayed close talk about navigating a seismic shift in their relationship, plus their partners on how it was for them
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

This sad individual needs to grow up and find someone receptive to their advances or open minded/flexible to "try new things".

This book that they were talking about is written by a transman. looks like a a semi-autobiographical children's book to me rather than pervasive gender propaganda.

EDIT

for some reason forum software isn't letting me paste the direct link so I have posted it as plain text

I'm Not a Girl: A Transgender Story
 
Fode N The Hole said:
An oddball on Tik Cok?

Who cares? People of all sexual orientations and gender expression get to pick who they want to date and have sex with. Is it transphobic? No. Most gay men aren't into transmen. People can have a sexual preference by ethnicity, I don't think it is racist.

It can sometimes be a case of people defining their wants and desires by their labels, e.g. "I'm gay so I can't possible get with that bloke who has a vagina, despite me salivating over his well-defined muscles and facial hair up until the point I found he was born female bodied". Rather than their wants and desires defining their label.

www.theguardian.com

What happens when your partner comes out as trans?

Five people who stayed close talk about navigating a seismic shift in their relationship, plus their partners on how it was for them
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

This sad individual needs to grow up and find someone receptive to their advances or open minded/flexible to "try new things".

This book that they were talking about is written by a transman. looks like a a semi-autobiographical children's book to me rather than pervasive gender propaganda.

EDIT

for some reason forum software isn't letting me paste the direct link so I have posted it as plain text

I'm Not a Girl: A Transgender Story
Click to expand...

This is not the thread or even the forum to discuss this topic, truth is we talk past each other and we're both guilty of it.

I can't engage with you because I do not acknowledge the language you use. In order to debate I would have to accept that trans women are women and trans men are men and I don't.

When I ask BobKowalski

  1. Do you think adult human females should be able to have a word to define themselves, in the same way all other female mammals have? If so, what do you think that word should be?
And his answer is....

What word does a female wombat use to define themselves?

There really isn't much point in taking it any further.

I remember in a post of yours a while back you said something along the lines that I came across as a bitter old man.

So my advice would be hang about a bit and you'll have a clear run to truly fuck it up, it's the gift every generation passes to the next.
 
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