Russian invasion of Ukraine

domalino said:
Yes and that fringe have complete control over the house because Kevin McCarthy had to promise them every batshit crazy thing they wanted to get elected speaker.

The MAGA wing will block anything and they'll launch a bunch of idiotic investigations and hearings about where things are going. Also R voter support is only hovering around 50%, and Fox News is staunchly opposed so...not good.


www.ft.com

Republican sceptics question ‘blank cheque’ support for Ukraine

Some US conservatives have pushed back on Kyiv’s appeals as they vow to step up scrutiny next year
www.ft.com www.ft.com

The White House has some discretionary funding but it's going to be a billion here and there.

Plus the impending debt ceiling default is going to dominate US politics for the next few months.
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Not in terms of military supplies to Ukraine it hasn't. A 75% majority breaks and so called control of the house by the speaker. A super majority to stop philibusting too.
 
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metalblue said:
The UK government has got an awful lot right on Ukraine, often unilaterally - we should be proud. We know these 14 C2 tanks are just the start, we will at a minimum replace any loses but I suspect we will signal to sending a couple more squadrons worth by the time the spring arrives.
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The feeling I get from from my friends who still work in military logistics is an awful lot more than 14 in the medium term. Production lines for parts and ammunition are being prepared for reopening (retooling etc).
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
I watched Rise of the Nazis over the Christmas break, which was filmed well before last February, and near the beginning of the first episode one of the historian talking heads said that, without fail, dictators eventually end up completely surrounded by acolytes and yes men, none of whom dare challenge the thoughts and ideals of their leader. And it is this that leads to their eventual downfall. Without fail.

It really struck a cord with me. Putin would not have had anyone telling him that he was taking a huge risk in invading Ukraine. Whilst the west had hitherto been far too effete and supine in dealing with Putin, the response from NATO nations to this invasion was actually foreseeable to anyone stepping back and applying logic.

Just because someone doesn’t retaliate when you hit them five times, doesn’t mean they won’t if you hit them again. Especially if the sixth time is harder than what preceded it.

He has overplayed his hand and completely fucking blown it. His country’s standing has been reduced to an overwhelming extent and its people will be ostracised for decades as a consequence.
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Good post. Got to hold strong with them and let Putin destroy himself
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
I watched Rise of the Nazis over the Christmas break, which was filmed well before last February, and near the beginning of the first episode one of the historian talking heads said that, without fail, dictators eventually end up completely surrounded by acolytes and yes men, none of whom dare challenge the thoughts and ideals of their leader. And it is this that leads to their eventual downfall. Without fail.

It really struck a cord with me. Putin would not have had anyone telling him that he was taking a huge risk in invading Ukraine. Whilst the west had hitherto been far too effete and supine in dealing with Putin, the response from NATO nations to this invasion was actually foreseeable to anyone stepping back and applying logic.

Just because someone doesn’t retaliate when you hit them five times, doesn’t mean they won’t if you hit them again. Especially if the sixth time is harder than what preceded it.

He has overplayed his hand and completely fucking blown it. His country’s standing has been reduced to an overwhelming extent and its people will be ostracised for decades as a consequence.
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Deserved more than a like mate. Excellent post
 
BlueAnorak said:
Not in terms of military supplies to Ukraine it hasn't. A 75% majority breaks and so called control of tge house by tge speaker. A super majority to stop philibusting too.
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The R majority is so small that they need the MAGA wing to vote for every single thing they want to do to pass a republican bill.

The MAGA wing do not want any more going to Ukraine, so the first thing they will do is they will tell McCarthy and his traditional republicans that if they start tabling more support bills for Ukraine, they will boycott votes of other republican policies.

So the R’s will have to choose between advancing their political goals or helping Ukraine and they’ll choose self interest every time.

Not just that, as part of their “negotiations” (blackmail) to get McCarthy elected speaker, he changed the rules of the house so that all it takes is ONE member to call a motion to vacate and trigger vote on removing the speaker.

So if McCarthy ever crosses the MAGA lot, they trigger a vote to remove him, vote with the Democrats to remove him, and then we go back to the situation 2 weeks ago where there’s vote after vote after vote to elect a speaker which they can’t do without the MAGA bloc, and so they have to concede everything to them.

That is assuming that not tabling more aid to Ukraine was not a part of the secret negotiations to get McCarthy elected 2 weeks ago, which it could easily have been given Gaetz and MTG were laughing about how they were scratching their heads to think of more things for McCarthy to promise them in return for their votes.


So sorry to say this, but they are in control, not Kevin McCarthy and the “normal” republicans.
 
BlueAnorak said:
The feeling I get from from my friends who still work in military logistics is an awful lot more than 14 in the medium term. Production lines for parts and ammunition are being prepared for reopening (retooling etc).
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There was a former senior British army tanker on news the other day advocating for us emptying the sheds and giving everything we’ve got to Ukraine. He said these tanks were built to fight the Russians and doing absolutely no good stuck here. He made a compelling case.
 
domalino said:
That’s not what I mean by control of the house. You’re thinking too literally.

The R majority is so small that they need the MAGA wing to vote for every single thing they want to do. For example - elect a speaker.

The MAGA wing do not want any more going to Ukraine, so they will tell McCarthy and his traditional republicans that if they start tabling more support bills for Ukraine, they will boycott votes of other republican policies.

Not just that, as part of their “negotiations” (blackmail) to get McCarthy elected speaker, he changed the rules of the house so that all it takes is ONE member to call a motion to vacate and trigger vote on removing the speaker.

So if McCarthy ever crosses the MAGA lot, they force a vote to remove him, vote with the Democrats to remove him, and then we go back to 2 weeks ago where there’s vote after vote after vote to elect a speaker which they can’t do without the MAGA bloc.


So sorry to say this, but they are in control, not Kevin McCarthy and the “normal” republicans.
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There’s a difference to being in control and holding the balance of power but I (sadly) can’t fault your reasoning. Perhaps even more reason for Germany to step up.
 
After almost a year of this shit you’d be thinking any right-minded person would be weighing up how it’s been going so far. The fact it’s being going like dogshit for the Russians and is still carrying on shows that Putin is far from being of sound mind and is, as we all suspected, actually a ****.
 
domalino said:
The R majority is so small that they need the MAGA wing to vote for every single thing they want to do to pass a republican bill.

The MAGA wing do not want any more going to Ukraine, so the first thing they will do is they will tell McCarthy and his traditional republicans that if they start tabling more support bills for Ukraine, they will boycott votes of other republican policies.

So the R’s will have to choose between advancing their political goals or helping Ukraine and they’ll choose self interest every time.

Not just that, as part of their “negotiations” (blackmail) to get McCarthy elected speaker, he changed the rules of the house so that all it takes is ONE member to call a motion to vacate and trigger vote on removing the speaker.

So if McCarthy ever crosses the MAGA lot, they trigger a vote to remove him, vote with the Democrats to remove him, and then we go back to the situation 2 weeks ago where there’s vote after vote after vote to elect a speaker which they can’t do without the MAGA bloc, and so they have to concede everything to them.

That is assuming that not tabling more aid to Ukraine was not a part of the secret negotiations to get McCarthy elected 2 weeks ago, which it could easily have been given Gaetz and MTG were laughing about how they were scratching their heads to think of more things for McCarthy to promise them in return for their votes.


So sorry to say this, but they are in control, not Kevin McCarthy and the “normal” republicans.
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Not sure that the R’s can do anything significant. Even if they pass a bill restricting support to Ukraine it won’t go through the senate or get signed off by Biden, and Biden will continue to provide support by Executive Order.
 
domalino said:
The R majority is so small that they need the MAGA wing to vote for every single thing they want to do to pass a republican bill.

The MAGA wing do not want any more going to Ukraine, so the first thing they will do is they will tell McCarthy and his traditional republicans that if they start tabling more support bills for Ukraine, they will boycott votes of other republican policies.

So the R’s will have to choose between advancing their political goals or helping Ukraine and they’ll choose self interest every time.

Not just that, as part of their “negotiations” (blackmail) to get McCarthy elected speaker, he changed the rules of the house so that all it takes is ONE member to call a motion to vacate and trigger vote on removing the speaker.

So if McCarthy ever crosses the MAGA lot, they trigger a vote to remove him, vote with the Democrats to remove him, and then we go back to the situation 2 weeks ago where there’s vote after vote after vote to elect a speaker which they can’t do without the MAGA bloc, and so they have to concede everything to them.

That is assuming that not tabling more aid to Ukraine was not a part of the secret negotiations to get McCarthy elected 2 weeks ago, which it could easily have been given Gaetz and MTG were laughing about how they were scratching their heads to think of more things for McCarthy to promise them in return for their votes.


So sorry to say this, but they are in control, not Kevin McCarthy and the “normal” republicans.
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Not going to happen with defence spending on Ukraine. 60% of the Republican House members are old style Republicans and many of these are pushing for LOTS MORE spending on Ukraine. They dwarf MAGA nunbers.
 
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JOGAMIGMOG said:
After almost a year of this shit you’d be thinking any right-minded person would be weighing up how it’s been going so far. The fact it’s being going like dogshit for the Russians and is still carrying on shows that Putin is far from being of sound mind and is, as we all suspected, actually a ****.
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I don't think it's a case sound mind. I think he's very sound of mind, even if he is inside a communication 'bubble' of sorts.

It's more a case of it didn't go as initially planned, and has now turned to a brutal war of attrition. Keep killing the enemy forces whatever the cost, destroy the countries infrastructure, regardless of outside public opinion and eventually they will prevail.

Add to that, "I'm one of the most powerful men in the world, I'll be ruthless to achieve what I want and to back down would be to lose face and that WILL NOT be an option".

........and as a result, this war and the slaughter will continue until either Russia prevails, or Ukraine loses the support of its benefactors.

It's difficult to imagine after what's gone on so far, that either side will sit at a negotiating table and concede the regions in the east and so the death and destruction continues.
 
Slipper One said:
........and as a result, this war and the slaughter will continue until either Russia prevails, or Ukraine loses the support of its benefactors.
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Or so many young Russians end up dead in the fields of Ukraine that the Russians storm the Kremlin, beat Putin to death and drag his corpse through the streets of Moscow.

Or the Russian economy collapses to such an extent that the Russians storm the Kremlin, beat Putin to death and drag his corpse through the streets of Moscow.

Or China finally gets sick of being shown up by their association with Putin, slaps him down and tells him to stop. Hopefully this scenario also involves him being beaten to death and his corpse being dragged through the streets of Moscow.

You seem well bought into the Almighty Russia propaganda though so I'll let you off.
 
BlueAnorak said:
Not going to happen with defence spending on Ukraine. 60% of the Republican House members are old style Republicans and many of these are pushing for LOTS MORE spending on Ukraine. They dwarf MAGA nunbers.
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It really feels like you didn't read my comment at all. It does not matter what 60% of republican house members think. IT. DOES. NOT. MATTER.

I could not have explained more clearly how these half a dozen or so members are holding the rest of the party hostage more than I did in the previous comment.
 
domalino said:
It really feels like you didn't read my comment at all. It does not matter what 60% of republican house members think. IT. DOES. NOT. MATTER.

I could not have explained more clearly how these half a dozen or so members are holding the rest of the party hostage more than I did in the previous comment.
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Unfortunately this is true. What's happening in American politics now is a disgrace. (Trump)
 
Irwell said:
Or so many young Russians end up dead in the fields of Ukraine that the Russians storm the Kremlin, beat Putin to death and drag his corpse through the streets of Moscow.

Or the Russian economy collapses to such an extent that the Russians storm the Kremlin, beat Putin to death and drag his corpse through the streets of Moscow.

Or China finally gets sick of being shown up by their association with Putin, slaps him down and tells him to stop. Hopefully this scenario also involves him being beaten to death and his corpse being dragged through the streets of Moscow.

You seem well bought into the Almighty Russia propaganda though so I'll let you off.
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Far, far from that...........but thankyou for the reprieve, I appreciate your generosity.
I just take what I consider a realistic view to the situation

Russians storm the Kremlin, beat Putin to death and drag his corpse through the streets of Moscow.
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A mighty fine thought and one shared by many, but just who is going to do that?
I don't see an awful lot of serious protestation or any strong organizations showing signs of achieving that.

If he is to be removed, I can only see it coming from within and I'm sure he has all of those bases covered for the foreseeable future.
 
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