PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

"The law can't touch us because we made City sign something in a rulebook, or they had to fuck off. "You signed it City" We write the rules, we get to say if someone has broke them or not and whether we've proven it by English law or not. It's just football, who needs actual courts for that eh? Not like thousands of livelihoods are at stake. Not like there's corruption and vested interested in football or anything like that"

Jesus, it gets worse the more I think on it. That can't be right.
 
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No1 was Colin bell said:
Here’s hoping for the same. Balls are back, fight back begins. All the giddy media walkers and other clubs fans seem to be missing the key word in all this. “If” proven. Gonna be one hell of an atmosphere come Sunday.
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That constant IF essentially males it all pretty much meaningless bollocks.

As in...IF it was them, then potentially they would be relegated and expelled too.

...or would they??
 
Pingu the Penguin said:
That’s not quite right either. Right about JR not being directly applicable, but not right that the court can’t have a supervisory role and look into procedural elements of the decision making. The Fallon case is the one to look at. Essentially the HC would step into a JR style role. If they didn’t see evidence in PL decisions that the high standards needed to assert fraud/deliberate bad faith CAS did (see projectrivers previous post on that) then the HC could effectively make them. The court won’t be the final decision maker, they’d send it back to the PL. But the steer would be v clear.

Just my take as an (ex) lawyer with a bit of experience in this.

Oh, and Panncik represented Fallon ;-)
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That clause about disputes being subject to the English courts: does that mean City could go to the court to dispute anything the Panel or the PL came up with, but the PL couldn't go to the court if they didn't like what the Panel said?
 
dronefromsector7G said:
The club will know this yet their statement still seemed to exude confidence
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To be fair we couldn't say much else could we? It's a bit like var looking at one of our many penalties not given. We can see it's a penalty, the pundits can see it's a penalty, the hacks the next day reporting on the game say it was a penalty but guess what, var don't give it.
 
5 Hit Gibbon said:
Don't panic, we have got Lord Pannick on the case!
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What good is having the best lawyers and the best case, if they don't have to listen to any of it because they run the whole thing?

edit: oh, didn't realise that was sarcasm on first reading. Time to log off soon. :)
 
I would be gobsmacked if we cannot find recourse in the English or European courts. The premier league must answer to the law of the land otherwise they could destroy any club anytime. Maybe it’s a naive viewpoint but that seems incredible. What the point hiring lawyers to fight an unwinnable case?

It’s their league and their rules but if said rules are being manipulated and unfairly applied against a member and that member has no way to defend itself!

I personally think the amount of charges thrown at us is a tactic to get us to come to the table and take a deal. The league comes out clean and self regulated and city take their medicine which will allow the red clubs to take advantage. Our good character will once again be destroyed. It’s the price we play for playing a game this is rigged.
 
Iassel said:
I mean on paper you could see it that way, but the arbitration panel are unlikely to end up being manned by the intern, the coffee boy and a paralegal knocking about….

These will be decorated people with significant reputations and who are not going to make a ruling based upon what the PL want.

Of course that doesn’t mean a win is any more or less likely, simply it’s not likely to be the kangaroo court some understandably fear.
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Yeah, decorated with arsenal season cards, from what I read …
 
projectriver said:
Financial gain from who? Do you think Spaces makes any money? Or I get paid for occasional podcasts? I wrote one piece for Mail Online 18 months ago (pretty much proven correct) and donated the entire fee. Not done a single paid piece other than that ever. A bit of a silly suggestion. Maybe consider that it is my genuine view that IF these charges are proven because they are such serious allegations, they will throw the book at us. Because it is and they will. That is not to say they will be proven
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I doubt they will strip City of any titles if they find City guilty for a number of reasons, and whatever they do will set a precedent for any future case against any club. So they will have to be careful. There are all sorts of financial and technical issues such a move would create.

1)
Look at the Aguero moment, that is a peice of IP gold, voted the best Premier League moment ever. If they strip City of the title that year, that footage becomes worthless. Should the Premier League re-pay Sky and all the other broadcasters that have bought rights and made programmes featuring that footage? Obviously each programme made by Sky and many more celebrating the seasons when City won would need editing and possibly a repayment of royalties. What about the FIFA video game (FIFA 12, FIFA 14) and any IP payment made, are there clauses in these contracts? So the ripple effect on the value of IP could be very relevant.

2)
If City were stripped of a league title: does the team that finished second win the league; do you delete City's results and redraw the table; think of another way; or does no one win it? How does this affect European qualification and relegation in the relevant seasons? Who can claim losses and off whom?

3)
Should prize money for where you finished in the league be redistributed once you've decided how to reorganise the final standings?

4)
What about bets lost and bets paid out by the bookmakers? How are these resolved?

5)
Does the West Ham - Sheffield United incident set any sort of precedent. West Ham stayed up at the expense of the Blades by fielding ineligible players. West Ham didn't lose their Premier League place despite effectively cheating. There must be reasons documented why West Ham were not relegated, which would be a precedent.

6)
Results and titles have never to my knowledge been overturned in English football for any reason. If City were stripped, would this set a precedent for other historic cases to emerge? Such as the Louis Edwards slush fund ie how did a tin pot club like Manchester United who had not won a trophy for 50 years get Duncan Edwards from under Wolves noses and the nephew of Newcastle's legendary Jackie Milburn, ie Bobby Charlton, away from Newcastle United? Are Manchester United's titles in the 50s and 60s in jeopardy?

7)
Arbitration is set out in Section X of the EPL handbook and it states it is governed by the Arbitration Act 1996. Section 66-71 of this act give City the right of appeal in court for a variety of reasons, on points of law, if they've been treated unfairly etc. So any punishment could theoretically be overturned if it's not been determined in a fair, fit and proper manner, without basis etc.

Hopefully, City can prove their case, but even if they lose, I think this is all being sensationalised to sell papers (or content, click bait etc). I can't see any punishment being that harsh, 10-20 points and a fine, ie one season damaged.

Also would the owners of clubs like Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth and many others risk personal retribution in any form from our owners or fans if they voted to expel City from the Premier League? It would cost Mansour and Co millions, and I'm sure as noble as they are publicly, they can wield the axe if they choose to on anyone or any business. Would any of these owners want to be punched by a City fan at any point in their life in the future? I know these are less savoury points to raise, but they exist nonetheless.
 
josepparseiola said:
Yesterday night I was in touch with one of the chefs at the grounds brother in law (can’t reveal much more) he told me that his brother in-law overheard some of the players speaking about the charges and the severity of the issue,he then said one of the senior players then made a remark saying it’s worse then we think and that a “4 year investigation means they already know” he believes that some of the players are aware of the charges and have become complacent.Some are even considering their futures especially the senior starting players.Do take this with a pinch of salt this was only heard from a family member during a dinner.
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Thanks for the intel mate … really good of you to share I’ll repay the good deed .
My sisters boyfriend is a vet he looks after farms etc he knows a bloke who spreads shit for an actual living he sells horse shit , one of his clients runs a very reputable horse racing stable he’s got a horse running in Aprils grand National .Would you like to know the name ? Or shall I leave it to others to give it you ?
 
argyle said:
PL deal with PL stuff and clubs will abide by the rulings, apparently in the rules that all clubs signed up to.

Shit.
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The Prem are trying to tell us 'We're going to screw you over in our kangaroo court and not allow you a right to natural justice'. It's 2023 and the Prem are behaving like it's the 1970s. Our lawyers will be pulling out all the stops to get this into the courts.
 
Iassel said:
I mean on paper you could see it that way, but the arbitration panel are unlikely to end up being manned by the intern, the coffee boy and a paralegal knocking about….

These will be decorated people with significant reputations and who are not going to make a ruling based upon what the PL want.

Of course that doesn’t mean a win is any more or less likely, simply it’s not likely to be the kangaroo court some understandably fear.
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I'm sure they will be very knowledgable people but it will be people on the PL's payroll in some way? That's a conflict of interest.
 
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