Suella Braverman - sacked as Home Secretary (p394)

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BayernMan said:
Is this obtuseness deliberate? The Home Secretary has described asylum seekers with disgusting language which many people including Holocaust survivors have also found worrying because it reminds them of rhetoric used in the past. Yet here you are getting in a twist trying to claim Lineker is the one who is being careless with his words.

Okay let me ask this. If the government specifically the Home Secretary didn’t use the inflammatory rhetoric to describe asylum seekers would Lineker have spoken out as he did?
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Two wrongs don't make a right though. Not sure which quotes you are referring to re Braverman so I can't comment but it's pretty clear to anyone with an IQ in double figures what Lineker was trying to unsubtly say. If he wasn't trying to compare the situation / language of asylum seekers / refugees to Nazi Germany what was he doing? And surely if the language was the same, not having a debate about that, is he implying that modern day Britain is trying to commit genocide like the Nazis?
 
BayernMan said:
Is this obtuseness deliberate? The Home Secretary has described asylum seekers with disgusting language which many people including Holocaust survivors have also found worrying because it reminds them of rhetoric used in the past. Yet here you are getting in a twist trying to claim Lineker is the one who is being careless with his words.

Okay let me ask this. If the government specifically the Home Secretary didn’t use the inflammatory rhetoric to describe asylum seekers would Lineker have spoken out as he did?
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I'll put the question again as you've went off track,do you accept that Lineker was not so subtlety referencing the Nazis.
 
Eds said:
Two wrongs don't make a right though. Not sure which quotes you are referring to re Braverman so I can't comment but it's pretty clear to anyone with an IQ in double figures what Lineker was trying to unsubtly say. If he wasn't trying to compare the situation / language of asylum seekers / refugees to Nazi Germany what was he doing? And surely if the language was the same, not having a debate about that, is he implying that modern day Britain is trying to commit genocide like the Nazis?
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Okay let me ask you this as well.

If the government specifically the Home Secretary didn’t use the inflammatory rhetoric to describe asylum seekers would Lineker have spoken out as he did?

By the way we are talking about an arguably draconian legislation which is condemned by MPs and all human rights organisations.
 
bluethrunthru said:
its also been condemned in a statement by the Board of British Deputies of Jews - maybe her husband can have a word with them

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Checkmate.


They really tried to push the "I know a Jewish person and they think it's very insensitive to compare..." line. It's been in every article, despite the fact this whole topic was brought up by Joan Salter confronting the Home Secretary about her langauge reminding her of her experience in 1930's Germany.

So for a big Jewish organisation to lend their voice to the condemnation really kicks that whole dishonest argument into touch.
 
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rabby said:
I'll put the question again as you've went off track,do you accept that Lineker was not so subtlety referencing the Nazis.
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Nope, I won’t answer until you answer me if Lineker’s comments would happen if the Home Secretary didn’t make hers.

FYI we are talking about him commenting on a legislation which is condemned by MPs and all human rights organisations. This is not a trick question.
 
Something kind of interesting that people might not realise is that Lineker's production company Goalhanger creates 3 of the top 10 most listened to podcasts in the UK. Battlefield Ukraine is 17th and another, Empire, is about 40th but growing rapidly.

These podcasts - The Rest is History, The Rest is Politics, and Leading are pulling in millions of listeners several times a week and are quite political. Alistair Campbell and Rory Stewart are very critical of ERG and Johnson/Braverman and so are most of the people they interview on Leading.

So he's not just the bloke of MOTD, he's sitting on a little political & history media consortium. I suspect this is why they're making this such a big deal.



Incidentally I thoroughly recommend TRIH and Empire especially as they're brilliant well researched podcasts.
 
rabby said:
You do have a issue with it tho,hence why you're not letting it go.
It was Lineker's hyperbole that was my original point.
You attempting to widen the argument doesn't change anything,he chose a bad comparison to draw attention to his tweet,if you disagree with this fine,but I would suggest you're the one becoming a bit obsessive about this.
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Says the man who dragged the life and career of Joachim von Ribbentrop into a tweet from Lineker.

Priceless.
 
Eds said:
Two wrongs don't make a right though. Not sure which quotes you are referring to re Braverman so I can't comment but it's pretty clear to anyone with an IQ in double figures what Lineker was trying to unsubtly say. If he wasn't trying to compare the situation / language of asylum seekers / refugees to Nazi Germany what was he doing? And surely if the language was the same, not having a debate about that, is he implying that modern day Britain is trying to commit genocide like the Nazis?
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No he wasn’t implying that at all.He said exactly what he thought, he wasn’t the only one that thought that quite a few including a fair few in here have compared what the tories are doing with their asylum policies and messages to early thirties Germany, doesn’t mean anyone thinks they are suddenly going to commit genocide. It also doesn’t mean the dangerous illegal policies and demonising language shouldn’t be exposed.
Could he have used other comparisons, maybe but it doesn’t make the comparison wrong just because the Nazis in Germany went on to commit great atrocities doesn’t make the comparison of language wrong and it doesn’t mean anyone expects the UK to be commiting genocide.
If we don’t want to talk about Nazis though , what should the breaking of international law and demonising a minority be compared to ? I’m open to suggestions. Trumps a good start I’d guess.
 
BayernMan said:
Okay let me ask you this as well.

If the government specifically the Home Secretary didn’t use the inflammatory rhetoric to describe asylum seekers would Lineker have spoken out as he did?

By the way we are talking about an arguably draconian legislation which is condemned by MPs and all human rights organisations.
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As I said I don't know the quotes Lineker was responding to and quite honestly why would anyone in today's world compare anything to the Holocaust. Nothing would ever come close to it so your question is pretty facile
 
Eds said:
… And surely if the language was the same, not having a debate about that, is he implying that modern day Britain is trying to commit genocide like the Nazis?
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I guess the first step on the path to genocide is isolate a group by identifying them as different, alien, and not quite human. You then remove their rights, imprison without trial and then eliminate them.

The Govt stated that refugees arriving by boats would not, for example, be covered by anti-slavery protections. This separates them from other groups. They are in the Govts eyes not worthy of protection under our laws. Perhaps they are not quite human enough?

So, you tell me where we are?
 
Eds said:
As I said I don't know the quotes Lineker was responding to and quite honestly why would anyone in today's world compare anything to the Holocaust. Nothing would ever come close to it so your question is pretty facile
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Okay. I hoped maybe you would look up the quotes Suella said. I mean it’s all over this thread your commenting on. Nevertheless, when you get a chance listen or read the rhetoric the Home Secretary is using and then please do come back and answer my question.
 
BayernMan said:
Nope, I won’t answer until you answer me if Lineker’s comments would happen if the Home Secretary didn’t make hers.

FYI we are talking about him commenting on a legislation which is condemned by MPs and all human rights organisations. This is not a trick questio
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BobKowalski said:
Says the man who dragged the life and career of Joachim von Ribbentrop into a tweet from Lineker.

Priceless.
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BobKowalski said:
Says the man who dragged the life and career of Joachim von Ribbentrop into a tweet from Lineker.

Priceless.
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You looked him up didn't you ; )
 
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