PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

StillBluessinceHydeRoad said:
I think we are all thrashing around in the dark at the moment. We don't know what the precise charges are though the club and its legal team do, one presumes. Thanks to the corrected version of the "rap sheet" Colin, Stefan and others have been able to give us a pretty clear idea of what they are, and they are serious to say the least. There does appear to be considerable overlap with the charges brought by UEFA but this time there is apparently no time barring. On the other hand, contrary to popular belief City were not cleared by CAS "on a technicality" but because there was no evidence at all produced which showed we had committed any of the "offences" alleged. It is hard to see what evidence the PL has which can substantiate the PL claims, especially when considered in the light of our audited accounts and testimony before CAS.

This is my personal summary of the "state of play" at the moment. I should be grateful if bluemooners could correct or fill out my version.
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Whilst I agree no-one on here has a scooby, it's not really true to say that if our audited accounts are OK, then we haven't broken PL rules.

First, the PL were quite sneaky in NOT adopting the usual IAS24 accounting standards on Related Parties, instead defining "Associated Parties", with subtly different definitions and the ability for the PL to interpret (misinterpret) things differently.

Also, we could very possibly be guilty of not complying with all the requests for info, which would be a breach, albeit one they would have difficulty in sanctioning us with more than a slap on the wrist and minor fine, IMO.
 
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Chippy_boy said:
Whilst I agree no-one on here has a scooby, it's not really true to say that if our audited accounts are OK, then we haven't broken PL rules.

First, the PL were quite sneaky in NOT adopting the usual IAS24 accounting standards on Related Parties, instead defining "Associated Parties", with subtly different definitions and the ability for the PL to interpret (misinterpret) things differently.

Also, we could very possibly be guilty of not complying with all the requests for info, which would be a breach, albeit one they would have difficulty in sanctioning us with more than a slap on the wrist and minor fine, IMO.
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Those Associated Party rules were waved thru after the period of time we are accused of wrongdoing - so I don’t think they can be used against us. Those rules were swiftly introduced to impact Newcastle…. There’s a theme here…. Our auditors are happy there are no related parties and in any event UEFA thought the Etihad deal was fair value.
 
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nmc said:
Those Associated Party rules were waved thru after the period of time we are accused of wrongdoing - so I don’t think they can be used against us. Those rules were swiftly introduced to impact Newcastle…. There’s a theme here…. Our auditors are happy there are no related parties and in any event UEFA thought the Etihad deal was fair value.
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We currently receive £67.5 million from Etihad per year for stadium and shirt sponsor. Madrid receive £60 million from Emirates just for being on the shirt, Arsenal get £40 million from Emirates for shirt and stadium naming rights.

Madrid go deep into the Champions league and are one of the most famous clubs on the planet. However they don’t have the pull of the premier league, no one is interested in La Liga which is why it is shown on ITV 4 these days.

Arsenal before this season have not been big hitters in the Premier League with their last win nearly 20 years ago. City on the other hand have won 7 league titles since 2012, you can understand why Etihad still want to be associated with our rise and pay accordingly to be on our shirt and across the stadium, campus and all the other teams in the City football group.
 
Newman Noggs said:
Forget any idea of any criminal sanctions even if they do manage to stitch us up. I've been involved in fraud investigation and litigation, civil and criminal, on behalf of government for 40 years and there's not a prosecuting authority that would touch this with a barge-pole.
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I think what people are getting at, if the say we have done certain things it would amount to criminal action, and all the consequences of that, I happen to think they will try to wiggle out of the whole shit show, no doubt under tremendous government pressure but in my opinion the whole thing has been a muck rake from the start, just trying to sully the club
 
nmc said:
Those Associated Party rules were waved thru after the period of time we are accused of wrongdoing - so I don’t think they can be used against us. Those rules were swiftly introduced to impact Newcastle…. There’s a theme here…. Our auditors are happy there are no related parties and in any event UEFA thought the Etihad deal was fair value.
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Interesting to know, thanks.
 
StillBluessinceHydeRoad said:
I don't think we need to worry about "a kangaroo court". The commission has to be independent and I have every reason to believe that the professional integrity of its members will far outweigh any other consideration. If it does not and the commission delivers a perverse judgement City will then have a right of appeal. This would also be the case in the event of a disproportionate punishment. But City's plea is not one for leniency but that the charges are baseless and there is no case to answer.
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The PL has its own investigative set up and has clearly failed after four long years to find anything to punish us for.

That should be the end of the matter.

But no, now we have some f**king star chamber with no terms of reference, no members, no authority, no right of appeal, no modus operandi.....in short....nowt.

So forget about Arsenal supporting lawyers, the real issue is the legitimacy of this nascent kangaroo court.

I gather we've taken this matter up with our lawyers. It wouldn't surprise me if this "independent panel" never meets let alone pass judgement, and if it does meet we're under no obligation to cooperate, or even to recognise its legitimacy what with it being "independent" like.

The process is the punishment here.
 
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Reading this thread and the variety of opinions about our chances can make your brain go fuzzy.

Does anyone else (those not ITK about this shit) feel like this after reading everything everyone's said;

The PL charges are effectively the same as the UEFA charges, they're accusing us of deceiving the PL about where and who we get our sponsorship/funding from. They're calling our owners liars and that they've directly funded the club themselves, breaking PL's FFP.

We've said this is bullshit and can prove, but it's not going to criminal court, it's an independent adjudication in which we'll win because we've done nothing wrong, but it doesn't matter because we'll lose overall because the red clubs like Arse, Dippers and Scum will have influenced them to find us guilty and we can't appeal so even though we've done nothing wrong the result will be guilty and there's nothing we can do about it???

If anyone disagrees... this is how the thread reads, guys!
 
KS55 said:
Correct but there is no single word available that correctly describes the accusation of breaking of regs. All on here know what I mean.
“Accusation of rule Infraction” is closest.
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Alleged rule breaches is the thing. Wording in the PL statement.
 
The perfect fumble said:
The PL has its own investigative set up and has clearly failed after four long years to find anything to punish us for.

That should be the end of the matter.

But no, now we have some f**king star chamber with no terms of reference, no members, no authority, no right of appeal, no modus operandi.....in short....nowt.

So forget about Arsenal supporting lawyers, the real issue is the legitimacy of this nascent Kangaroo court.

I gather we've taken this matter up with our lawyers. It wouldn't surprise me if this "independent panel" never meets let alone passes judgement, and if it does meet we're under no compulsion to cooperate, or even to recognise its legitimacy what with it being "independent" like.

The process is the punishment here.
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IIRC it's an "independent" (not really) commission after which we can appeal to an "independent" (not really) appeal body after which there is a right of appeal on narrow grounds to an actually independent tribunal (each party chooses one member and the two choose a third). So there is some recourse. I would imagine our lawyers are gearing up the grounds for the appeals even as we are presenting to the commission.

I think.

Would be happy to be put right.
 
Metal Biker said:
Reading this thread and the variety of opinions about our chances can make your brain go fuzzy.

Does anyone else (those not ITK about this shit) feel like this after reading everything everyone's said;

The PL charges are effectively the same as the UEFA charges, they're accusing us of deceiving the PL about where and who we get our sponsorship/funding from. They're calling our owners liars and that they've directly funded the club themselves, breaking PL's FFP.

We've said this is bullshit and can prove, but it's not going to criminal court, it's an independent adjudication in which we'll win because we've done nothing wrong, but it doesn't matter because we'll lose overall because the red clubs like Arse, Dippers and Scum will have influenced them to find us guilty and we can't appeal so even though we've done nothing wrong the result will be guilty and there's nothing we can do about it???

If anyone disagrees... this is how the thread reads, guys!
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That's not my take on it. This video below summarises it quite well according the itks.

It's based/borrowed from content from a few experts in here.

 
I have been thinking about all the opposition fans that whine on about City. Calling us cheats. Saying our success is tarnished etc etc. I call these goons 'The Emotionals' and I have come up with the following that seems to describe them quite well. I admit it, I have too much time on my hands right now, but I am seeking employment.

Entitled
Moronic
Obnoxious
Trophy seeking
Ill informed
Opinionated
Nostalgic
Afflicted
Libelous
Simplistic

The Emotionals...aka as fans of Liverpool, Man Utd, Assnel and Spurs etc
 
Gorton_Tubster said:
That's not my take on it. This video below summarises it quite well according the itks.

It's based/borrowed from content from a few experts in here.

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I didn't ask for *your* take, I wondered anyone else reading this thread felt the same way.

Because all i'm reading on here is we've done nothing wrong, but are going to get screwed either way by the independent investigation and can do nothing about the verdict.
 
Gorton_Tubster said:
That's not my take on it. This video below summarises it quite well according the itks.

It's based/borrowed from content from a few experts in here.

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Gave up watching after 90 secs. Language used, "will city get away with" and "severe allegations" did not suggest an impartial assessment
 
Metal Biker said:
I didn't ask for *your* take, I wondered anyone else reading this thread felt the same way.

Because all i'm reading on here is we've done nothing wrong, but are going to get screwed either way by the independent investigation and can do nothing about the verdict.
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You can look at this sequence of events from a few perspectives and no one on this site can provide a definitive answer but I think it’s fair to assume that City have quite clearly been targeted and no other PL club has been scrutinised or investigated to the degree we have - ultimately that will become an issue for the prosecution I.e. They can’t hold us to higher standards than other clubs. They should be mindful that anything they find us guilty of - it is likely other clubs will have done similar. This whole case is clearly motivated as a vengeful act by some or all of the hateful eight and I think we can assume that they don’t have definite evidence of wrongdoing - partly because Gill and Parry would have certainly leaked such info to their lackeys in the media by now and the PL would not have adopted the spaghetti at the wall approach of 100+ charges, if they knew specifics. I did think that part of this was motivated by the clubs in red trying to resist an independent regulator but, if that were the case it’s backfired because they are presently making a definitive case for a regulator with their obvious incompetence. Ultimately no one knows how this will play out but this case looks big on bravado, low on content and would be doomed to failure in the legal system, the arrogance of Levy, Gill et al might have convinced a few that they can push this over the line in their internal PL process but the wider legal process still needs to be respected and any KC or senior legal figure isn’t going to want to be associated with this case which increasingly looks and smells what it is…. A vengeful cartel taking out its frustration on a rival who has seized their ball and won’t give it back. As a few posters have said… if City really had filed 9 years of dodgy, manipulated and inaccurate accounts… the HMRC would have raided the club by now and they seem wholly unbothered by this politically motivated nonsense.
 
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