Middle East Conflict | Netanyahu orders strikes on Gaza (p1161)

blueish swede said:
Lots on here do! -They think that over 2 million Palestinians should continue to live under a despotic terrorist regime in Gaza.
That they should continue to live without democracy.
That thye should continue to live without the right to free speech.
That they should live without a functioning civil or criminal judicial system.
That they should continue to be denied access to reasonable health services or education.
That women in Palestine should not be allowed to travel without permission from the man who owns them.
That they should contiue to live under an entirely corrupt economic regime where money is syphoned off to the bank accounts of terrorist leaders living the life of luxury abroad.
That they should be victims of continuous harassment and subject to capricius punishment, torture and even exececution for disobeying their terrorist masters whims.
That they should continue to owe their existence to the charity of strangers and be barred from making any sort of future for themselves or their families.

Can you imagine these posters expressing the same views about peoole who were forced to live under Hamas' mates Daesh 4 years ago? "Oh the Yazidis just need to suck it up and get on with it."
Click to expand...

That's some strawman you have constructed there.

Absolute crackers.

I suppose UN secretary general believes that too?
 
halfcenturyup said:
It isn't genocide, of course. If it is anything, it looks more like a potential ethnic cleansing.

But Hamas aren't an existential threat to Israel either, no matter what their rhetoric is. So there is a lot of bullshit spoken on both sides. As in any conflict.
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Genocide is an internationally recognized crime where acts are committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group. These acts fall into five categories:

  1. Killing members of the group (Palestinian civilians)
  2. Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group (Open prison of Gaza strip)
  3. Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part (cutting fuel, power, water .. and forcing them out of their homes to migrate)
  4. Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group
  5. Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group
www.ushmm.org

What is Genocide? - United States Holocaust Memorial Museum​

Genocide as a term did not exist before 1944. Learn about its origins and legal definition.
www.ushmm.org

Perhaps you only see killing millions as genocide.
 
arbabarshad said:
Genocide is an internationally recognized crime where acts are committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group. These acts fall into five categories:

  1. Killing members of the group (Palestinian civilians)
  2. Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group (Open prison of Gaza strip)
  3. Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part (cutting fuel, power, water .. and forcing them out of their homes to migrate)
  4. Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group
  5. Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group
www.ushmm.org

What is Genocide? - United States Holocaust Memorial Museum​

Genocide as a term did not exist before 1944. Learn about its origins and legal definition.
www.ushmm.org

Perhaps you only see killing millions as genocide.
Click to expand...
Or perhaps it needs to be more than 1400
 
arbabarshad said:
Genocide is an internationally recognized crime where acts are committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group. These acts fall into five categories:

  1. Killing members of the group (Palestinian civilians)
  2. Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group (Open prison of Gaza strip)
  3. Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part (cutting fuel, power, water .. and forcing them out of their homes to migrate)
  4. Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group
  5. Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group
www.ushmm.org

What is Genocide? - United States Holocaust Memorial Museum​

Genocide as a term did not exist before 1944. Learn about its origins and legal definition.
www.ushmm.org

Perhaps you only see killing millions as genocide.
Click to expand...
As I said before, the palestinian population has quintupled in the last 50 years. I'm not sure your interpretation of that really holds water.
 
arbabarshad said:
Genocide is an internationally recognized crime where acts are committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group. These acts fall into five categories:

  1. Killing members of the group (Palestinian civilians)
  2. Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group (Open prison of Gaza strip)
  3. Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part (cutting fuel, power, water .. and forcing them out of their homes to migrate)
  4. Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group
  5. Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group
www.ushmm.org

What is Genocide? - United States Holocaust Memorial Museum​

Genocide as a term did not exist before 1944. Learn about its origins and legal definition.
www.ushmm.org

Perhaps you only see killing millions as genocide.
Click to expand...
The Gaza Strip may be an open prison, but the prison guards wear the uniform of Hamas.
 
Now the arguments from the Israeli terrorism backers have changed from "need to wipe out hamas as they are a terrorist group" to "Hamas are the government of Palestine so need to continue genocide of Palestinians".

Israel is a terrorist state for its actions right now.
 
100,000 protestors and the deputy editor of the Jewish Chronivle felt safe enough to be at the march and be interviewed about it live on TV. This can’t be right because I’ve read on here that it was a violent march of terrorists and their supporters, through Londinistan. Oh yes there were 2 arrests ffs.

There were peace marches across the rest of Britain.

Yes these Hamas cunts should free all the hostages and there should be a cease
 
Vic said:
I was taught to "cite your sources". I suppose I could just have said "Arab opposition to Zionism was understandable" but that might not have gone down well with those who think anti-Zionism was down to antisemitism (or think "Zionist" is an insult). So it seemed better to justify an argument by citing a Zionist who could see a problem that many others at the time (or since) could not.

I could have '"cut and paste" Ahad Ha'am's hopes of finding common cause with the Arabs (descendents of Shem like the Jews) or just linked to his full article (behind an academic paywall). He did go on to support setting up a Jewish homeland in Palestine (not necessarily a Jewish state) but perhaps I won't bother risking any actual quotes.

Essentially, I'm trying to see both sides. And "they started it" is just too simplistic.
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robbieh said:
I've been surprised by the lack of activity by Hezbollah who usually like to get involved. Initially I thought maybe the US had told Iran to but out. Now I'm not so sure. It might be Hamas who've told them to keep their powder dry. Why?
Well Egypt, Jordan , Saudi and the UAE have been on pretty good terms with Israel. What Hamas really need is support from these Sunni Moslem states. Hamas know they have Iran's backing but were Shiite Hezbollah to get involved the 4 countries listed above may revert to their normal neutral stance.
Only a theory.
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Hezbollah have some serious fire power. However they are treading a fine line in Lebanon as they are very deeply entrenched in Lebanese politics and society. They know if they provoke Israel too much there will be a strong response.
 
arbabarshad said:
Now the arguments from the Israeli terrorism backers have changed from "need to wipe out hamas as they are a terrorist group" to "Hamas are the government of Palestine so need to continue genocide of Palestinians".

Israel is a terrorist state for its actions right now.
Click to expand...
Difficult to take you seriously when your strongest criticism of Hamas in this thread was that you said just once that you “don’t condone what they did” but as soon as Israel responded you have repeatedly called them a terrorist state committing genocide.
 
How can anyone justify the Israeli government’s actions right now?

Thousands of completely innocent children are being killed. Millions of innocent people living through hell.

A truly horrific situation.
 
west didsblue said:
Difficult to take you seriously when your strongest criticism of Hamas in this thread was that you said just once that you “don’t condone what they did” but as soon as Israel responded you have repeatedly called them a terrorist state committing genocide.
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Hamas killing civillians is just as bad as Israel killing civillians. One innocent life lost is one too many, Israeli or palestinian.
 
west didsblue said:
Difficult to take you seriously when your strongest criticism of Hamas in this thread was that you said just once that you “don’t condone what they did” but as soon as Israel responded you have repeatedly called them a terrorist state committing genocide.
Click to expand...
This Israeli government are just as bad as Hamas.
 
MCFC_ Phil said:
Hezbollah have some serious fire power. However they are treading a fine line in Lebanon as they are very deeply entrenched in Lebanese politics and society. They know if they provoke Israel too much there will be a strong response.
Click to expand...

They're also mindful that Lebanon can't afford the reconstruction costs that would be needed after a long war with Israel.

The Lebanese economy is a basket case right now and there it isn't perceived that benefactors from other Arab states would be willing to pay for it instead.

So they don't want to get involved if they can avoid it. A proper ground invasion into Gaza might push them to getting involved if they see that Israel wouldn't be able to fight on both fronts and the war would end quickly.
 
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