The Conservative Party

bluethrunthru said:
The difficulty for them would be how many NEW Tory MP's were elected? Of of that small group how many are known or have obvious talent? They need a Cleverley or someone to keep the seat warm so they can identify a new "talent"
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There were just over 20, so likely slim pickings.
 
BrianW said:
What they fail to understand is that for the average person (not millionaires) a tax cut gives a piddling amount. Not worth it if your public services are shredded as a consequence.
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The problem is the entirety of this comes down to the something for nothing brigade. We all want better public services but the fact is we aren't prepared to pay for it. Labour had to promise not to raise taxes in this election and now they're pretty much screwed because of that promise.

They've promised to raise taxes on the rich but that isn't going to work. The rich already pay a considerable amount of tax and growth is in the pits. It isn't going to raise enough without damaging the economy. The cost of borrowing at the moment is also high and inflation is a risk so there's very little room for manoeuvre if general taxation remains a red line.

The only fair option is for mass tax rises to better reflect how things work in Europe. However, you can increase people's taxes instantly but you can't build new GP's, schools and hospitals instantly. Unfortunately the lifecycle of a Parliament reflects this and I think it's going to be the biggest problem for Starmer.

Starmer needs to move extremely quickly if he's going to make an impact. If he spends 2 years wasting time deciding policy then unfortunately the next election won't go like it did last week. People will just revert to the past which is to vote for themselves, low taxes, less immigration blah blah.
 
bluethrunthru said:
Bakers meltdown is complete - he has changed his X bio to something bat shit crazy

x.com

x.com x.com
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Ha Ha.. "The Right Honourable" doesn't really fit all that well before the "Batshit Crazy Merciless Avenging Saviour of the Conservative Party and Scourge of the Brexit Non-Believers" or whatever instantly forgettable shite he has put on his profile.

Is it any wonder that with such deluded fucking Cosplay pricks like him in the Cabinet that the Country barely functions any more?

He has gone full Lawrence Fox, his ego has been pricked and he has try to prove that he is still relevant.
 
inbetween said:
The problem is the entirety of this comes down to the something for nothing brigade. We all want better public services but the fact is we aren't prepared to pay for it. Labour had to promise not to raise taxes in this election and now they're pretty much screwed because of that promise.

They've promised to raise taxes on the rich but that isn't going to work. The rich already pay a considerable amount of tax and growth is in the pits. It isn't going to raise enough without damaging the economy. The cost of borrowing at the moment is also high and inflation is a risk so there's very little room for manoeuvre if general taxation remains a red line.

The only fair option is for mass tax rises to better reflect how things work in Europe. However, you can increase people's taxes instantly but you can't build new GP's, schools and hospitals instantly. Unfortunately the lifecycle of a Parliament reflects this and I think it's going to be the biggest problem for Starmer.

Starmer needs to move extremely quickly if he's going to make an impact. If he spends 2 years wasting time deciding policy then unfortunately the next election won't go like it did last week. People will just revert to the past which is to vote for themselves, low taxes, less immigration blah blah.
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They have only promised not to raise some taxes, unfortunately the general public are obsessed with certain taxes.
 
west didsblue said:
What they need and what they will do is unlikely to coincide in the near future. At least not until a lot of the old duffers who make up much of the party membership die off.
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They have really backed themselves into a corner, or more accurately a dead-end.

Hopefully after such a beating they will now focus on fighting among themselves over the ownership of the rotting corpse of the once mighty Conservative Party, and by the time they have finished eating themselves they will also be finished as a force in the country.

Among the young and the under 50's their brand is poison. We know that people have long memories as the Tories have traded on the "Winter of Discontent" and the economic problems of the 70's for nearly half a century, and Jeremy Corbyn the bogeyman has been used for 15 years when they are struggling for an argument. Liz Truss and Partygate and Johnson's lies and Sunak's uselessness will echo down the years in the same way
 
Eebo said:
They have really backed themselves into a corner, or more accurately a dead-end.

Hopefully after such a beating they will now focus on fighting among themselves over the ownership of the rotting corpse of the once mighty Conservative Party, and by the time they have finished eating themselves they will also be finished as a force in the country.

Among the young and the under 50's their brand is poison. We know that people have long memories as the Tories have traded on the "Winter of Discontent" and the economic problems of the 70's for nearly half a century, and Jeremy Corbyn the bogeyman has been used for 15 years when they are struggling for an argument. Liz Truss and Partygate and Johnson's lies and Sunak's uselessness will echo down the years in the same way
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They have been poison for us old cunts too pal. Many years of poisonous shit from them.



 
mancityvstoke said:
They have been poison for us old cunts too pal. Many years of poisonous shit from them.



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Agreed, I'm a FOC too!

Remember both of them records coming out and I remember the start of Thatcherism and am absolutely delighted to have lived to see the day when the consequences of what she began have come back to hopefully kill them. Just wish it hadn't taken so long.
 
Eebo said:
Agreed, I'm a FOC too!

Remember both of them records coming out and I remember the start of Thatcherism and am absolutely delighted to have lived to see the day when the consequences of what she began have come back to hopefully kill them. Just wish it hadn't taken so long.
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We did try at the time...... suss laws helped to fire up our passion.
 
law74 said:
Just seen anendangered species, one of the last remaining self-servatives MP's on BBC1.
They are still convinced that the electorate are in favour of tax cuts, while public services are unable to cope with what they receive now.
They have, I suppose, 5 years to wake up, but my hunch is that they will move even further in the wrong direction
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History tells us they will, and history tells us they shouldn’t.

In 1979 labour went to the left with the appointment of Michael Foot. It lost badly in 1983. The appointment of Neil Kinnock was a step back to the centre, but not enough of a step. The appointment of John Smith and then Tony Blair restored Labour’s electoral credibility.

In 1997 the tories lurched to the right, with the appointment of Ian Duncan Smith and then Michael Howard who were both given electoral hidings. They became electable only with the appointment of David Cameron, who even then did not win an outright majority until 2015.

Meanwhile Labour lurched left and then further left with Miliband first and then Jeremy Corbyn. And, once more, upon returning to the centre ground they became electable again.

I imagine the tories will lurch to the right, possibly under Kemi Badenoch, Piti Patel or Suella Benjamin. And I imagine they will lose the next election. Time will tell whether they will learn from history or simply repeat it.
 
Worsleyweb said:
Yes i do - he will pm within 9 years
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There is no way in hell that Farage is going to wait out 5 years let alone 9.

MP's are also subjected to further scrutiny because they have to declare financial interests and that kind of thing. I highly doubt that he wants some of his money making deals to be put out there on public record...
 
Eccles Blue said:
Thank goodness I’ll probably be dead by then. Just hope that my grandchildren and great-grandchildren have the sense to fight against them.
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He will never be PM of this country, don't worry.

And I'm sure you'll still be alive and kicking in the distant future!
 
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