Middle East Conflict

Gobshiight said:
Not sure the people of East Timor would agree with that
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Fair point. I suppose it's his record after leaving office that makes him something of an outlier, but as noted by @BayernMan that is not a particularly high bar.

Fortunately for him Western sponsored mass slaughter in tiny strips of land with potentially lucrative off shore gas fields wasn't live streamed back in the 70's.
 
Postman Pep said:
Fair point. I suppose it's his record after leaving office that makes him something of an outlier, but as noted by @BayernMan that is not a particularly high bar.

Fortunately for him Western sponsored mass slaughter in tiny strips of land with potentially lucrative off shore gas fields wasn't live streamed back in the 70's.
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It's still pretty staggering to hear an Ex President come down on Israel like Carter did. Knowing 90% of Congress is corrupted by Aipac money.
 
The blue phantom said:
It's still pretty staggering to hear an Ex President come down on Israel like Carter did. Knowing 90% of Congress is corrupted by Aipac money.
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Again I don't want to be the party pooper and it not a slight on Carter but ....


v

The same organisations get to post their eulogies and no doub
 
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Babies dying of hypothermia and families living in water logged tents. Israel isn't a despotic regime, as a democracy this is what the majority of the people of Israel want for their neighbours.
 
The blue phantom said:
I really hope one day this vile Evil Isreali regime and everyone involved with it are dealt with. Murdering bastards
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It goes beyond that. For as long as Zionism lives in the land of Palestine there will never be peace. If the Israelis were to get rid of this evil idea of racial supremacy themselves, peace would not only be achievable, it would be an inevitability. Inter cultural, inter ethnic marriage would be common rather than forbidden as it currently is.

But they never will.

After the Rwanda genocide it became necessary for Hutus and Tutsis to become one,not in the sense that they merged as the Hausa-Fulani of Nigeria, but in that it became taboo for people to ask which tribe you are and for you to tell them.

Forgiveness and acceptance was the only way forward, it wasn't possible to send every butcher to prison and achieve natural justice. Those butchers still walk among the survivors and the relatives of the victims.

That solution simply isn't possible. The two cultures and ethnicities live next to each other but fully apart. The twin cities of Besźel and Ul Qoma.

The solution was used once before. In the Potsdam convention. I have come to realise it must be used again, I hope it is a peaceful process.
 
No sign of Dr. Hussam Abu Safiya yet it seems. The israelis are probably raping and beating him to death like they did with Doctor Adnan Al-Bursh
 
I spend far too much of my time these days watching interviews on YouTube.
Call it research call it fact finding, whatever. It doesn’t matter. I’m not going to post any up here because I think it’s noticeable that nobody is trying to defend what’s happening.
I fully accept that there are contributors in here of Jewish heritage whether you call that secular or of deeply rooted Judaism. No matter. I was brought up Catholic, Christian, whatever, but see the lot as a millstone around our necks as humans that was never ever designed for any other purpose other than to control the masses.
It’s not something that should be governing the 21st century.

Israel in my mind was a bad idea from the start.
It is a European solution to a European Jewish problem.
That in itself sounds anti-Semitic, doesn’t it?
And don’t get me started on that guilt trip of anti-semitism which seems to be a coverall response to truth they don’t like to hear.
Look up the Oxford Dictionary meaning of Semitic and Anti-Semitic and tell me when the Arab world were dropped from the Semitic part.

The trouble with where this is going is that Zionism by its nature is forcing an accelerated demise of Israel. Can you have an illusion of the only democracy in the Middle East that can only be permanently maintained by military superiority?
If you are Jewish and living there, is that what you want?
Where is there ever going to be security or normality in that.
Seriously? Unless like your Evangelical Christian backers in the west, you are looking forward to the end of days, or some such.

How was it ever defendable that someone of Jewish persuasion born in New York, has more right to live in Jerusalem than an Arab born in Jerusalem.
Not only a right to go there, but forcibly taking the home’s of said Arabs.

This has been going on since 1917 with western backing. Militias were funded and started settling in the 1920’s.

My biggest disappointment is the silence of the European nations.
The US and the UK? Never expected any more from them, to be honest.
But the EU nations have been complicit with their silence.

Israel doesn’t exist without Western backing.
Western backing is trying to justify the unjustifiable in my book.
Read that any way you want, but it doesn’t mean I don’t believe a version other than this of Israel could exist.

I have no time for Zionism however.
 
mancity2012_eamo said:
I spend far too much of my time these days watching interviews on YouTube.
Call it research call it fact finding, whatever. It doesn’t matter. I’m not going to post any up here because I think it’s noticeable that nobody is trying to defend what’s happening.
I fully accept that there are contributors in here of Jewish heritage whether you call that secular or of deeply rooted Judaism. No matter. I was brought up Catholic, Christian, whatever, but see the lot as a millstone around our necks as humans that was never ever designed for any other purpose other than to control the masses.
It’s not something that should be governing the 21st century.

Israel in my mind was a bad idea from the start.
It is a European solution to a European Jewish problem.
That in itself sounds anti-Semitic, doesn’t it?
And don’t get me started on that guilt trip of anti-semitism which seems to be a coverall response to truth they don’t like to hear.
Look up the Oxford Dictionary meaning of Semitic and Anti-Semitic and tell me when the Arab world were dropped from the Semitic part.

The trouble with where this is going is that Zionism by its nature is forcing an accelerated demise of Israel. Can you have an illusion of the only democracy in the Middle East that can only be permanently maintained by military superiority?
If you are Jewish and living there, is that what you want?
Where is there ever going to be security or normality in that.
Seriously? Unless like your Evangelical Christian backers in the west, you are looking forward to the end of days, or some such.

How was it ever defendable that someone of Jewish persuasion born in New York, has more right to live in Jerusalem than an Arab born in Jerusalem.
Not only a right to go there, but forcibly taking the home’s of said Arabs.

This has been going on since 1917 with western backing. Militias were funded and started settling in the 1920’s.

My biggest disappointment is the silence of the European nations.
The US and the UK? Never expected any more from them, to be honest.
But the EU nations have been complicit with their silence.

Israel doesn’t exist without Western backing.
Western backing is trying to justify the unjustifiable in my book.
Read that any way you want, but it doesn’t mean I don’t believe a version other than this of Israel could exist.

I have no time for Zionism however.
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Interesting post. Here's some of my thoughts.

Historically there seems to be a general acceptance (from reasonable historians) that both sets of people have a right to the land. Classing one group as the immigrants or, as Suella Braverman would say 'invaders', just does not hold.

I totally agree Israel, a western thinking population, is in the wrong place but where else could they have settled after being murdered in their millions in Russia and 'civilised' Europe? Also remember it was not just the German Nazis who hated the Jews. There were millions of collaborators in conquered France, Netherlands etc who were quite happy to point out Jews who needed to be gassed.

The number of Jews living in muslim/Arab countries is minimal. Surely that tells it's own story?

It's war, and in war the victors usually kill more people than the losers. In war attrocities happen every single day. That's what war is, killing people. But if the Palestinians had the weaponry that the Israelis have then this war would be over now with millions of Jews dead. You may disagree with that statement but it is at the heart of why people (and western governments) sympathise with the Israeli side, it's the lesser evil in a war of evil intent.

Hopefully a satisfactory compromise will be found but a compromise requires reasonable people who can accept not 'winning' and that appears to be beyond many in this conflict.
 
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