Middle East Conflict | Netanyahu orders strikes on Gaza (p1161)

[vmsuhail]

The problem is the part where you say "I suspect the Palestinians would accept this" because who today are the Palestinians and who is the key Palestinian authority on acceptance of such a thing?

The Palestinians don't have an authority that can be negotiated with so it doesn't really matter who wants what.

Meanwhile the west can isolate Netanyahu, it can sanction Netanyahu and the Israeli people could even vote out Netanyahu. What can be done about Hamas if Hamas (supported by Iran) chooses to continue to fight regardless?

There is Palestinian Authority who "partially" governs the West Bank, and they're reasonable and can be negotiated with. Guess what, Israel wouldn't allow PA to govern Gaza.

 

[robbieh]

The problem is the part where you say "I suspect the Palestinians would accept this" because who today are the Palestinians and who is the key Palestinian authority on acceptance of such a thing?

The Palestinians don't have an authority that can be negotiated with so it doesn't really matter who wants what.

Meanwhile the west can isolate Netanyahu, it can sanction Netanyahu and the Israeli people could even vote out Netanyahu. What can be done about Hamas if Hamas (supported by Iran) chooses to continue to fight regardless?

I'd suggest looking at the maps that @mancity2012_eamo posted above to understand why there has been armed resistance since the birth of Israel.
Israel has never been a good faith actor in all this. Duplicity has been the name of the game.
Having said that Hamas have accepted the idea of a 2 state solution based on 67 borders.
Looking above you can see why Israel cannot do this as the West Bank is littered with settler communities.
It's a myth you seem to believe that it is Hamas holding this up. The reality is that the Zionist project from the get go was to have the lot.

 

[BlueAnorak]

According to the press I see Iran is signaling to Trump to get a ceasefire now with nuclear talks resumed.
With their air defence totally destroyed, I would think Iran would have to give up fissle materials for that to happen at the moment.

 

[inbetween]

I'd suggest looking at the maps that @mancity2012_eamo posted above to understand why there has been armed resistance since the birth of Israel.
Israel has never been a good faith actor in all this. Duplicity has been the name of the game.
Having said that Hamas have accepted the idea of a 2 state solution based on 67 borders.
Looking above you can see why Israel cannot do this as the West Bank is littered with settler communities.
It's a myth you seem to believe that it is Hamas holding this up. The reality is that the Zionist project from the get go was to have the lot.

Yeah and I understand that but nothing is going to change as it is and the west isn't going to change its stance much whilst Israel is actually being attacked. I don't agree with anything that Israel is doing by the way, it's abhorrent but we have to recognise that Israel has to exist and that's the starting point.

Everybody else though is playing a different tune so Israel has continued to justify its excuses alongside a vacuum space to basically do whatever it wants. Nothing precipitated this more than 7/10 and the west was hardly going to go against Israel defending itself although obviously they've gone far beyond that now.

Going back to the original post I replied to. It just isn't true that Israel is the bad guy whilst everybody else was living peacefully. Today many of these countries are nasty places to live and they're run by nasty people where the existence of Israel is irrelevant to that. You see Turkey for example attacking Israel vocally on the issue but Turkey had no problem bringing war upon the Kurds. There are so many examples of hypocrisy.

There is therefore no benefit to supporting anybody, the right side of peace is one where they all coexist in some form of settled states. Israel obviously doesn't want that but right now I don't see the other side demanding it either. Meanwhile we in the west have clearly chosen a side just as much as China and Russia have chosen a side.

 

[tel aviv city]

According to the press I see Iran is signaling to Trump to get a ceasefire now with nuclear talks resumed.
With their air defence totally destroyed, I would think Iran would have to give up fissle materials for that to happen at the moment.

This is definitely a historic moment —


if it’s real and not just another Iranian ploy before a nighttime attack on Israel.


A regime that openly threatens to destroy an entire people must fall, and the allies would be right to bring Iran to the negotiating table.


The big question is: can they be stopped from developing nuclear weapons?

 

[Gobshiight]

A regime that openly threatens to destroy an entire people must fall

Now there's a thought...

 

[The blue phantom]

How have a terriost state like Israel got Nuclear weopens should be the question. It beggars belief that these absolute fuckin genocidal maniacs have them.

 

[BobKowalski]

This is definitely a historic moment —


if it’s real and not just another Iranian ploy before a nighttime attack on Israel.


A regime that openly threatens to destroy an entire people must fall, and the allies would be right to bring Iran to the negotiating table.


The big question is: can they be stopped from developing nuclear weapons?

I would avoid that line of argument if I were you. Just a thought.

 

[tel aviv city]

Now there's a thought...

It’s not just interesting — it’s a fact.


There is only one nation that openly declares:


“Our weapons are meant to wipe Israel off the map.”

And this isn’t a terrorist organization like Hamas,

nor is it Hezbollah

this is the head of the snake

This is the threat that worries all the Gulf states —and the entire world.

 

[The blue phantom]

I would avoid that line of argument if I were you. Just a thought.

This is a poster who was putting pictures of himself with the IDF wearing his City top during the 500 a night slaughtering.

 

[Gobshiight]

It’s not just interesting — it’s a fact.


There is only one nation that openly declares:


“Our weapons are meant to wipe Israel off the map.”

And this isn’t a terrorist organization like Hamas,

nor is it Hezbollah

this is the head of the snake

This is the threat that worries all the Gulf states —and the entire world.

Think you missed the irony in my comment

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

It’s not just interesting — it’s a fact.


There is only one nation that openly declares:


“Our weapons are meant to wipe Israel off the map.”

And this isn’t a terrorist organization like Hamas,

nor is it Hezbollah

this is the head of the snake

This is the threat that worries all the Gulf states —and the entire world.

One train of thought might be, they’re cunts, but at least they’re open about it.
I don’t believe a word out of Israel while the free press isn’t allowed in.
Suffice to say though, I can make a subjective guess based on the evidence before my eyes in the news I choose as to exactly what the current regime’s intentions are.

I’m guessing no less cuntish, but they act so virtuous.

 

[Palerider]

It’s not just interesting — it’s a fact.


There is only one nation that openly declares:


“Our weapons are meant to wipe Israel off the map.”

And this isn’t a terrorist organization like Hamas,

nor is it Hezbollah

this is the head of the snake

This is the threat that worries all the Gulf states —and the entire world.

Would you accept a two state solution? Many of us believe it is the ONLY way out of this never ending war but, of course, it needs the support of the vast majority on each side.

 

[Snape]

Would you accept a two state solution? Many of us believe it is the ONLY way out of this never ending war but, of course, it needs the support of the vast majority on each side.

A two state solution based on the 1967 borders which is what all neighbouring Arab states request with East Jerusalem as the Palestinian capital will never happen, as Israel views the entire city as its indivisible capital. Unless either side shifts its long-standing position, which seems politically impossible, this core issue will continue to block any progress.

 

[supercity88]

Would you accept a two state solution? Many of us believe it is the ONLY way out of this never ending war but, of course, it needs the support of the vast majority on each side.

The trouble is, the Hamas attacks have helped Israel go on the attack and look to wipe out all current threats to its existence. Over time a number of countries that initially went to war with Israel have subsequently backed down and the region has stabilised. They might not recognise Israel but they don't go to war with them. Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Iraq for example.

For the US, and the wider Western World Israel is a brilliant strategic ally in an historically volatile region. Does the US want Iran to have nuclear weapons? No chance. Does it want to go to war? No chance. So let Israel do the dirty work and bring stability to the region for us.

The only reason we're sitting back letting Israel do whatever the fuck it wants is because they don't pose a threat to us. If successful in their goal they bring peace to the region by controlling it. That's much better to the west than a two-state solution that a) Israel will never support under their current regime and b) will probably still see fairly regular fighting and war break out.

 

[Kompany Car]

Know many Arabs do you or have evidence to back up that claim?

Possibly one of the most ignorant posts I’ve had the displeasure of reading on this thread and there’s been a fair few of them from the brainwashed hasbara trolls.

I think this is a case of lumping the population of a country with its leadership.

It may be true that some politicians in Jordan and Egypt for instance still see the Palestinian State as a threat. This probably stems from the 70s, in the days of the PLO, where they assassinated a Jordanian prime minister on the streets of Cairo. I dont think however that can be extrapolated to mean the population of the countries in modern day, never mind the wider arab world.

 

[tel aviv city]

This is a poster who was putting pictures of himself with the IDF wearing his City top during the 500 a night slaughtering.

This is a poster who was putting pictures of himself with the IDF wearing his City top during the 500 a night slaughtering.

Would you accept a two state solution? Many of us believe it is the ONLY way out of this never ending war but, of course, it needs the support of the vast majority on each side.

Like many of my friends, I believe in the existence of two peoples.
The Palestinian people are currently held hostage.
The solution must begin with the removal of Hamas, which is, of course, operated by Iran —

followed by mediation and the creation of a buffer zone that neither side enter

The Palestinian people used to work and live in Israel,
but they gave in to terror and crossed every human boundary and moral value on October 7th.

 

[Vic]

Yeah and I understand that but nothing is going to change as it is and the west isn't going to change its stance much whilst Israel is actually being attacked. I don't agree with anything that Israel is doing by the way, it's abhorrent but we have to recognise that Israel has to exist and that's the starting point.

Everybody else though is playing a different tune so Israel has continued to justify its excuses alongside a vacuum space to basically do whatever it wants. Nothing precipitated this more than 7/10 and the west was hardly going to go against Israel defending itself although obviously they've gone far beyond that now.

Going back to the original post I replied to. It just isn't true that Israel is the bad guy whilst everybody else was living peacefully. Today many of these countries are nasty places to live and they're run by nasty people where the existence of Israel is irrelevant to that. You see Turkey for example attacking Israel vocally on the issue but Turkey had no problem bringing war upon the Kurds. There are so many examples of hypocrisy.

There is therefore no benefit to supporting anybody, the right side of peace is one where they all coexist in some form of settled states. Israel obviously doesn't want that but right now I don't see the other side demanding it either. Meanwhile we in the west have clearly chosen a side just as much as China and Russia have chosen a side.

..."whilst Israel is actually being attacked...."?

Israel is attacking TV studios. Is there a nuclear facility underneath?

And everyone was living peaceably in Palestine - Muslims, Christians, Jews - before Zionism. Partly because they were essentially the same race.

 

[r.soleofsalford]

I know quite a few Arabs, however I don't know any Israelis or Jews. I do know how some of them feel regarding the Palestinians and it certainly isn't what you think. You really should stop getting all of your information from The Guardian, it's brainwashed you and the other Israeli/Jew hating trolls on here.

I personally am not against Israelis or Jews what I am against are arse holes like the Netanyahu and the Likud Party in general.

What Hamas every one of them that took part should be butchered.

What Netanyahu has done he should also be butchered with every twat that has voted with him in the systematic destruction of the Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank.

What the Israeli government has done is disgrace. I find it unbelievable that having gone through the holocaust that the Jews would want others through the same senseless slaughter of innocents.

Like many of my friends, I believe in the existence of two peoples.
The Palestinian people are currently held hostage.
The solution must begin with the removal of Hamas, which is, of course, operated by Iran —

followed by mediation and the creation of a buffer zone that neither side enter

The Palestinian people used to work and live in Israel,
but they gave in to terror and crossed every human boundary and moral value on October 7th.

Didn’t some Israelis systematically steal the lands of the Palestinians which had been owned by the same family for hundreds of years.

 

[BlueTG]

Like many of my friends, I believe in the existence of two peoples.
The Palestinian people are currently held hostage.
The solution must begin with the removal of Hamas, which is, of course, operated by Iran —

followed by mediation and the creation of a buffer zone that neither side enter

The Palestinian people used to work and live in Israel,
but they gave in to terror and crossed every human boundary and moral value on October 7th.

The one that Netanyahu supported their rise to power?