It's Quiet the £250m return

Doesn’t help that everyone hates us, especially Prem teams, and no one wants to do us a favour as we are still seen as a team you can take the piss out of with regards transfers.

Akanji for example, happy to drag it out as he probably doesn’t give a shit about going on a loan with buy option, which is patently not what we want. Whichever club taps him up will tell him to sit tight etc.

Cunts the lot of them.

And p.s. before I get a few smart arse replies about specifics, I’m generalising of course.
 
vincent said:
We decided to buy two young CB’s instead. One was loaned out and one can’t get a game.
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I don’t have an issue at all with them two young talents, Reis needs game time though but Khus should be playing imo, frustrating the lad isn’t being given a chance, especially with our high line lacking pace?
 
Dribble said:
Of course people on here quote facts. It's a fact that today is Wednesday in the UK. It's a fact that our No 1 keeper over the last decade has been Ederson. It's a fact that Guardiola is our manager.

When Lewis is selected, what role is he usually selected to play?

When you say "him losing the ball in the attacking third causing counters", surely the solution is to not play Lewis & we'll never lose the ball in the attacking third right?

The fact you're overlooking is Lewis is the only player tasked with covering 4 positions when he plays. When/if an attack breaks down, it's not his job to magically appear in the RB position he's vacated in order to carry out his unique role.

That task falls to the right CB. The No 6 will drop into central defence alongside the left CB, with the left back covering his base. When Lewis has retreated, the No 6 will edge forward to form a shield in front of the defence, the right CB will move back into position & Lewis will move to RB. That is the tactical positional movements of having an inverted RB.

In terms of comparisons, Pep has publicly stated that Nunes doesn't possess the intelligence to play centrally. When selected to play RB, Nunes plays as a traditional over/underlapping RB, but Lewis is usually always tasked with the far more complex inverted RB, which is a totally different defensive discipline.

I get it. You don't rate Lewis, but you don't seem to be able to fundamentally explain exactly why apart from believing "he is not good enough".

You're judging Lewis in the unique role he, & he alone is tasked to play, but I think you're judging him harshly as I guess you don't fully understand what his inverted FB role entails.

OK, if Pep is to persist with the inverted FB role & you don't think Lewis is "good enough", can you give me a list of players who are good enough to play that unique inverted RB role, & also cite examples of them doing it successfully, where Lewis has failed?

We've got until 5pm Monday to identify these better inverted RB's than Lewis & buy them, as they certainly don't exist amongst our current squad.
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Facts regarding opinions on football - dont be pedantic

As for the rest of your reply - thanks. its great to actually have a discussion

As i said previously the role he is being asked to play - one of inverted fullback joining into midfield and then also supporting the attack as well as some sort of hybrid 8 or even 10 is not fair on him - you are right...he doesnt have the physical or techincal aspects to his game for him to be able to do all of this at certain points in those positions. In other words he is deficient in ability at times in those areas. For example, when further forward he has limited final pass (he can cross but no through ball as it were) - this is where he gives the ball away as he isnt technically good enough to make that final pass like a David Silva for instance (or the pass before the assist which is what Silva was especially good at). Nor in the final third is he really a goal threat (he scores the odd one or two).

When in the middle third (and as Ive previously said about him) - he is good at finding the small spaces and receiving the ball - however its what he does afterwards with it. He cant drive forward with it (like most midfielders we have had in the past in those positions) so he often slows down our forward movement (which i think this year could be even more of a disadvantage as Pep MK 2 has been brought in to help (IMHO) in moving the ball forward quicker. Rico Lewis does not do this).. In the middle third he (despite his abilty to find space and be on the half turn) does lose the ball when pressed - he is poor physically and due to his size, Im afraid to say he is weak and cant shield the ball well. Nor does he possess the technical ability to manipulate the ball to resist that press (Rodri, Bernardo previously, David Sival, Ferna

Defensively (when in position) at fullback he lacks awareness of what is on his outside shoulder/behind him...we see this time and time again. He is poor at the back post (despite his best efforts). Also we have seen that goal that was scored by spurs where he fails to cut out the cross - he goes with the wrong leg and we have seen that last season.

Now I understand there are problems before that that led to the cross and I agree - ive been critical of our lack of cover at left back and said a number of times that Ake (despite being previously a world class pro) is starting to fade badly....Ive also been critical of Dias a lot (and this time it was John Stones slipping/not getting the offside trap correct (the caveat for Stones is that he maybe understandibly rusty). But once the cross comes in, Lewis doesnt deal with it. He is 1 few yds ahead of the attacked when the ball breaks free on the the opposite wing. He is either unaware that Johnson is there or incapable of covering his run - and like I have said we have seen this before.

Is it fair on him - no I agree - he is being asked to do something he is not capable of. It exposed Zabelta when he was asked to do it as well

If we were to revert to not playing the inverted fullbacks is he a good enough right back in a more standard back four - no he isnt in my opinion - again he is a weak tackler and loses physical battles. He cant attack going wide, He gets beaten by wingers going wide of him and outside him. He is also weak at defending balls crossed in at height the the back post....attackers will actually pull onto him and if Richarlason had been half decent he would have scored a one or two more. Again he gets bullied.

Is there are player out there that can play his role - I dont know. Maybe maybe not. If I was a top class DOF Id have a list of players probably. Would I continue with this system of inverting the fullback - no - it doesnt work with the players we have at the moment. Would I keep Rico Lewis at right back in a more traditional role - no I wouldnt, he isnt good enough due to the issues Ive already mentioned (cant defend the back post, no pace so is easily beaten on the outside of him, lack of defensive awareness of particularly his outside shoulder/what is behind him, doesnt have the pace to get across and cover in behind the centre halves when the ball goes in behind them (Khusonov does and we saw it a number of times last year in the games he played in).

In short is Rico good enough for what he is being asked to play - no - very few are but players in the past could have (Ferna, Yaya and others mentioned - will rico ever get to their level -imho not even close to) - is this his fault - no. Pep needs to stop doing it.

Is he a good enough traditional right back - no, because of the issues that are mentioned and we see lots last year and already this year.

So lastly has he got a the possibility of playing in our midfield - No..he is the worst (probably baring Nunes) of all the options we could play IF we were to play him as a more traditional midfielder (whether thats as a 6 an 8 or a 10)...ie if we were to play another fullback and shift him somewhere else or if we were to go to a back 3 for instance.

Solution - for me its Khusonov as a more traditional right back if we arent going to buy anyone. He cant play inverted. He doesnt hae the technical ability to do so. However he is far superior in all defensive areas than Lewis. He stops that first goal vs spurs - we've seen him do it previously. Can he move forward and join the attack - probably not but there are other options to counter this especially when Alt Nouri is fit again or by overloading the midfield more and playing a traditonal back 4 - or even going to a back 3 with Khusonov Stones and one other.
 
richards30 said:
But I don’t see how that changes next year either mate? Left back and right back with priorities from January weren’t they? Left back sorted and that was arguably stronger than the right side? We started fantastically in the summer window with 3 excellent signings but it just hasn’t fixed arguably our biggest issue?
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Next year we'll have more spare slots and there might be better options available, maybe even Livramento. Like we have many time in previous year it's better to wait for the right player not any player. See united for how that works out.
 
vincent said:
We decided to buy two young CB’s instead. One was loaned out and one can’t get a game.
Click to expand...
Are we quite sure that was ‘instead’? I suspect we thought we’d be able to ease Stones and Ake out this summer, but their Lazarlike recoveries, coupled with their own and the refusal of others to budge have hampered our ability to sign alternatives.
 
mancityscot said:
Chelsea getting big transfer fees for players they actively want rid of surely needs investigating.
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Just the 25m loss on their latest sale. How do they keep getting away with it!

About to loan out their 37m striker for a pittance as well.

Someone investigate them!
 
Next summer could be a big one.

Ederson out of contract
Gundo out of contract
Stones out of contract
Bernardo out of contract
Ortega out of contract
Ake one year left
Akanji one year left
Kovacic one year left
 
Gumzy97 said:
Next summer could be a big one.

Ederson out of contract
Gundo out of contract
Stones out of contract
Bernardo out of contract
Ortega out of contract
Ake one year left
Akanji one year left
Kovacic one year left
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There's still a chance that half of them will be gone in the next four days. All will be gone by September next year, I'd imagine.
 
simon23 said:
Facts regarding opinions on football - dont be pedantic

As for the rest of your reply - thanks. its great to actually have a discussion

As i said previously the role he is being asked to play - one of inverted fullback joining into midfield and then also supporting the attack as well as some sort of hybrid 8 or even 10 is not fair on him - you are right...he doesnt have the physical or techincal aspects to his game for him to be able to do all of this at certain points in those positions. In other words he is deficient in ability at times in those areas. For example, when further forward he has limited final pass (he can cross but no through ball as it were) - this is where he gives the ball away as he isnt technically good enough to make that final pass like a David Silva for instance (or the pass before the assist which is what Silva was especially good at). Nor in the final third is he really a goal threat (he scores the odd one or two).

When in the middle third (and as Ive previously said about him) - he is good at finding the small spaces and receiving the ball - however its what he does afterwards with it. He cant drive forward with it (like most midfielders we have had in the past in those positions) so he often slows down our forward movement (which i think this year could be even more of a disadvantage as Pep MK 2 has been brought in to help (IMHO) in moving the ball forward quicker. Rico Lewis does not do this).. In the middle third he (despite his abilty to find space and be on the half turn) does lose the ball when pressed - he is poor physically and due to his size, Im afraid to say he is weak and cant shield the ball well. Nor does he possess the technical ability to manipulate the ball to resist that press (Rodri, Bernardo previously, David Sival, Ferna

Defensively (when in position) at fullback he lacks awareness of what is on his outside shoulder/behind him...we see this time and time again. He is poor at the back post (despite his best efforts). Also we have seen that goal that was scored by spurs where he fails to cut out the cross - he goes with the wrong leg and we have seen that last season.

Now I understand there are problems before that that led to the cross and I agree - ive been critical of our lack of cover at left back and said a number of times that Ake (despite being previously a world class pro) is starting to fade badly....Ive also been critical of Dias a lot (and this time it was John Stones slipping/not getting the offside trap correct (the caveat for Stones is that he maybe understandibly rusty). But once the cross comes in, Lewis doesnt deal with it. He is 1 few yds ahead of the attacked when the ball breaks free on the the opposite wing. He is either unaware that Johnson is there or incapable of covering his run - and like I have said we have seen this before.

Is it fair on him - no I agree - he is being asked to do something he is not capable of. It exposed Zabelta when he was asked to do it as well

If we were to revert to not playing the inverted fullbacks is he a good enough right back in a more standard back four - no he isnt in my opinion - again he is a weak tackler and loses physical battles. He cant attack going wide, He gets beaten by wingers going wide of him and outside him. He is also weak at defending balls crossed in at height the the back post....attackers will actually pull onto him and if Richarlason had been half decent he would have scored a one or two more. Again he gets bullied.

Is there are player out there that can play his role - I dont know. Maybe maybe not. If I was a top class DOF Id have a list of players probably. Would I continue with this system of inverting the fullback - no - it doesnt work with the players we have at the moment. Would I keep Rico Lewis at right back in a more traditional role - no I wouldnt, he isnt good enough due to the issues Ive already mentioned (cant defend the back post, no pace so is easily beaten on the outside of him, lack of defensive awareness of particularly his outside shoulder/what is behind him, doesnt have the pace to get across and cover in behind the centre halves when the ball goes in behind them (Khusonov does and we saw it a number of times last year in the games he played in).

In short is Rico good enough for what he is being asked to play - no - very few are but players in the past could have (Ferna, Yaya and others mentioned - will rico ever get to their level -imho not even close to) - is this his fault - no. Pep needs to stop doing it.

Is he a good enough traditional right back - no, because of the issues that are mentioned and we see lots last year and already this year.

So lastly has he got a the possibility of playing in our midfield - No..he is the worst (probably baring Nunes) of all the options we could play IF we were to play him as a more traditional midfielder (whether thats as a 6 an 8 or a 10)...ie if we were to play another fullback and shift him somewhere else or if we were to go to a back 3 for instance.

Solution - for me its Khusonov as a more traditional right back if we arent going to buy anyone. He cant play inverted. He doesnt hae the technical ability to do so. However he is far superior in all defensive areas than Lewis. He stops that first goal vs spurs - we've seen him do it previously. Can he move forward and join the attack - probably not but there are other options to counter this especially when Alt Nouri is fit again or by overloading the midfield more and playing a traditonal back 4 - or even going to a back 3 with Khusonov Stones and one other.
Click to expand...
Fuck me I thought War & Peace was long ...
 
richards30 said:
I do find it frustrating that since January and the summer we still couldn’t identify a right back?!
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Pep wants them to invert to dominate midfield. If all they're doing is running up the wing on the overlap hes happy with Nunes for that.

Doesn't help the position is occupied by 2 Pep projects.

But what right back has actually moved this summer that would improve our starting 11 in tactics we play (so not frimpong)?
 
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