It's Quiet the £250m return

[Tugay One Cup]

Both equally as shit and should be sold

It's all gotten a bit football twittery on here the last couple of years

 

[Tugay One Cup]

I cant take him seriously either, as everything hes said this summer has been bollocks

I'm sure he'll feel crushed by this.

 

[domalino]

I cant take him seriously either, as everything hes said this summer has been bollocks

With transfer stuff and ITKs I always go back to a story Sid Lowe has told a few times on various podcasts where a player he was really good friends with was rumoured to be moving, Sid phoned him up to ask and the guy said 100% no chance of a move, he’s just got settled with the family or bought a new house or something, but the player was certain he wasn’t going anywhere.

So Sid writes an article dismissing the rumours and then a day or 2 later he gets a phone call from his mate at the airport saying he’d been called into the directors office out of the blue and told he was moving to the club they had an offer from or not playing for a year and was on his way to the new club. Sid looks like an idiot, his editors not happy with him, but that’s transfers.


No one knows how these things are going to play out and when a long term poster like Tolmie posts something you just take it as being posted in good faith, but at best an indication of what 1 party wants rather than a guarantee of what is going to happen.

 

[Jwoody19]

I reckon Doku would cost a lot. Still one of the best wingers around for his age. Unique profile as he has the physical traits that simply cannot be taught. The best 1v1 attacker in world football.

However, his deficiencies do hold him back far too much at the moment. He's simply too wasteful in possession. I reckon when he's on the pitch, 35% of our attacks end at Doku. The complete opposite of Grealish, who maybe killed our attacks at a 5% rate. If Doku is going to continuously be our outlet and ball-carrier, he does have to improve.

For me personally, I think he's 100% worth keeping around for the impact he can have off the bench when we need chaos rather than control. And for his potential. Still sky high. But this year will be very telling for his future here. Lets big up the lad.

For me, he has shown no improvement since he joined. He is capable of terrorising his opposite full back but his end product just isn't there. I agree he adds an element of chaos off the bench, but when has that ever been our style under Pep?
City would want their money back for him as he is still young enough but I don't see him as being a long term quality player for us. He is not good enough sadly.

 

[Blue_Lightsaber]

No but Kalvin's available!

 

[Blue tiger]

For me, he has shown no improvement since he joined. He is capable of terrorising his opposite full back but his end product just isn't there. I agree he adds an element of chaos off the bench, but when has that ever been our style under Pep?
City would want their money back for him as he is still young enough but I don't see him as being a long term quality player for us. He is not good enough sadly.

I was watching him in the last game of last season against Fulham, and I remember thinking he'd got every final pass or cross wrong. It was almost a skill in itself.

 

[Jwoody19]

I was watching him in the last game of last season against Fulham, and I remember thinking he'd got every final pass or cross wrong. It was almost a skill in itself.

Liverpool at home too. He bullied Trent all evening but don’t remember him putting one decent ball in.

 

[Dribble]

Facts regarding opinions on football - dont be pedantic

As for the rest of your reply - thanks. its great to actually have a discussion

As i said previously the role he is being asked to play - one of inverted fullback joining into midfield and then also supporting the attack as well as some sort of hybrid 8 or even 10 is not fair on him - you are right...he doesnt have the physical or techincal aspects to his game for him to be able to do all of this at certain points in those positions. In other words he is deficient in ability at times in those areas. For example, when further forward he has limited final pass (he can cross but no through ball as it were) - this is where he gives the ball away as he isnt technically good enough to make that final pass like a David Silva for instance (or the pass before the assist which is what Silva was especially good at). Nor in the final third is he really a goal threat (he scores the odd one or two).

When in the middle third (and as Ive previously said about him) - he is good at finding the small spaces and receiving the ball - however its what he does afterwards with it. He cant drive forward with it (like most midfielders we have had in the past in those positions) so he often slows down our forward movement (which i think this year could be even more of a disadvantage as Pep MK 2 has been brought in to help (IMHO) in moving the ball forward quicker. Rico Lewis does not do this).. In the middle third he (despite his abilty to find space and be on the half turn) does lose the ball when pressed - he is poor physically and due to his size, Im afraid to say he is weak and cant shield the ball well. Nor does he possess the technical ability to manipulate the ball to resist that press (Rodri, Bernardo previously, David Sival, Ferna

Defensively (when in position) at fullback he lacks awareness of what is on his outside shoulder/behind him...we see this time and time again. He is poor at the back post (despite his best efforts). Also we have seen that goal that was scored by spurs where he fails to cut out the cross - he goes with the wrong leg and we have seen that last season.

Now I understand there are problems before that that led to the cross and I agree - ive been critical of our lack of cover at left back and said a number of times that Ake (despite being previously a world class pro) is starting to fade badly....Ive also been critical of Dias a lot (and this time it was John Stones slipping/not getting the offside trap correct (the caveat for Stones is that he maybe understandibly rusty). But once the cross comes in, Lewis doesnt deal with it. He is 1 few yds ahead of the attacked when the ball breaks free on the the opposite wing. He is either unaware that Johnson is there or incapable of covering his run - and like I have said we have seen this before.

Is it fair on him - no I agree - he is being asked to do something he is not capable of. It exposed Zabelta when he was asked to do it as well

If we were to revert to not playing the inverted fullbacks is he a good enough right back in a more standard back four - no he isnt in my opinion - again he is a weak tackler and loses physical battles. He cant attack going wide, He gets beaten by wingers going wide of him and outside him. He is also weak at defending balls crossed in at height the the back post....attackers will actually pull onto him and if Richarlason had been half decent he would have scored a one or two more. Again he gets bullied.

Is there are player out there that can play his role - I dont know. Maybe maybe not. If I was a top class DOF Id have a list of players probably. Would I continue with this system of inverting the fullback - no - it doesnt work with the players we have at the moment. Would I keep Rico Lewis at right back in a more traditional role - no I wouldnt, he isnt good enough due to the issues Ive already mentioned (cant defend the back post, no pace so is easily beaten on the outside of him, lack of defensive awareness of particularly his outside shoulder/what is behind him, doesnt have the pace to get across and cover in behind the centre halves when the ball goes in behind them (Khusonov does and we saw it a number of times last year in the games he played in).

In short is Rico good enough for what he is being asked to play - no - very few are but players in the past could have (Ferna, Yaya and others mentioned - will rico ever get to their level -imho not even close to) - is this his fault - no. Pep needs to stop doing it.

Is he a good enough traditional right back - no, because of the issues that are mentioned and we see lots last year and already this year.

So lastly has he got a the possibility of playing in our midfield - No..he is the worst (probably baring Nunes) of all the options we could play IF we were to play him as a more traditional midfielder (whether thats as a 6 an 8 or a 10)...ie if we were to play another fullback and shift him somewhere else or if we were to go to a back 3 for instance.

Solution - for me its Khusonov as a more traditional right back if we arent going to buy anyone. He cant play inverted. He doesnt hae the technical ability to do so. However he is far superior in all defensive areas than Lewis. He stops that first goal vs spurs - we've seen him do it previously. Can he move forward and join the attack - probably not but there are other options to counter this especially when Alt Nouri is fit again or by overloading the midfield more and playing a traditonal back 4 - or even going to a back 3 with Khusonov Stones and one other.

Facts are facts mate. You need to be more lucid & precise before you go making throwaway comments trying to be clever.

So after unpicking your reply, let's cut to the chase. Most of what you've claimed is your personal opinion, which I appreciate you have a right to hold.

Let's start from what we agree with...

1. Neither of us likes Pep's inverted RB system.

2. We agree we don't have anyone better than Rico at the club to play that role.

3. Inspite of your criticisms of Lewis, you can't name one player in world football who can perform that role, or is playing the inverted RB position better than Rico, so we can contrast & compare.

OK, we can settle on those points.

So then who's responsible for the role Rico plays? Rico or his manager? If it's his manager, why are you getting on Rico's back for playing him in that role & not his manager?

In terms of player comparisons, you're comparing world class seasoned professionals at the zenith of their careers against a former EDS player barely out of his teens. Kind of like comparing Foden at 20 to Maradona & saying he's not good enough & never will be!

You've compared Rico's No 10 position, final ⅓ passing play to the magician David Silva (too small & flimsy for English football), his No 6 & No 8 play to Fernandinho, Yaya, Plodri (current world's best player) & Bernardo?

Thst high praise indeed for Rico if you have to go to those exhalted levels of playing legends to validate your ultra negative opinion of the kid.

In this respect, let's say I agree. Rico's no Messi on the right, no Ronaldo on the left, or no Pelé through the centre either, & I too would be pleasantly surprised if he ever attained those levels. They seem like rational comparisons too huh?

Rico's been around our first team squad since 2022-23. Again we can agree that opposition players targeted him for brutal treatment knowing that it would knock him off his stride & shake him up.

However, I've noticed something different about him recently. He's seriously bulked up & since the CWC, & I can't recall a player bullying him since, without it being penalised as a clear foul.

Following in his Dad's footsteps, Rico's always practiced Jujitsu, & he's now apparently taken up boxing & more importantly, boxing training. Take a close look at his thighs, calves & his chest area. He's definitely added significant muscle mass, which probably explains why the kid isn't so easy to throw around any longer.

Against Wolves a player clattered him from behind around the halfway line, which was awarded as a foul, & again two players clattered into him as he was shielding the ball as it was dribbling out of play in our area. That should've been given as a foul, not a corner imo, but still... Aside from that, can you cite any instances since the CWC where Rico was physically weak or bullied?

At no point over the first two games of this season, can I recall Lewis being bullied, but have you already made up your mind about a 20 year old, that he'll forever be "Little Lewis" & that he'll never fill out into possibly becoming "Rico the Rock"?

Despite his physical shortcomings, Lewis has the heart of a lion & a football intelligence that belies his years. Says who? Says the best football manager I've ever come across, the former England manager & Nottingham Forest who were reportedly told to fuck off when they recently made a derisory opening £30m bid for a player who you deem to be totally deficient in all aspects of football, & has zero redeeming attributes as a footballer.

So the question is, what have Pep Guardiola, Nunes Espirito Santo, Gareth Southgate & a host of other top flight football managers across England & the European continent missed that you've seen? Is there anything at all that you rate about him?

As for Lewis not being a competant traditional RB, you've not cited an instance of him playing there to comment on. Not one, because it's quite clearly evident that Pep Guardiola has bigger plans for the player, whether you wish to acknowledge it or not.

I get it, you don't rate the guy, but how can you confidently say that Rico Lewis can't now or ever play as a traditional over/underlapping RB, when you can't tell me a time when he has, & what other criticisms you have of the lad playing there?

Tbh mate, it seems like Rico is your modern day replacement for Richard Edgehill. The difference being that Rico's career has barely started, & you can't see ONE redeeming facet to attribute to him.

I seriously can't believe you've cited prime David Silva, Fernandinho, Yaya, Rodri & Bernardo as comparisons to prove your reasonings as to why 20 year old Rico Lewis is shit.

Not ONE of them was ever tasked with playing Pep's inverted RB role. Ask yourself why mate...

 

[Coatigan]

Maybe Hugo is just putting everyone through an endurance test.

 

[bumbleblue]

Maybe Hugo is just putting everyone through an endurance test.

Well it’s certainly testing me!

 

[Cobwebcat]

I’m starting to think, for the first time, we are done.

Maybe Esbrand and Kabore loaned or sold. Maybe Ortega. Nobody wants Kalvin. None of the old guard want to leave and will see their last year out it seems.

As for incomings I think it maybe too late now.

4 days left for new signings.

Strange thing is we had got the average age of our squad right down but then loaned or sold a lot of the younger players we brought in meaning we are back to having the 6th oldest in the PL as it stands right now and even older if Esbrand and Kabore go too.

I hope some of these loaned young signings do well and come back to stay next season.

A weird window all around for me. I don’t know what to make of it yet.

 

[Coatigan]

I’m starting to think, for the first time, we are done.

Maybe Esbrand and Kabore loaned or sold. Maybe Ortega. Nobody wants Kalvin. None of the old guard want to leave and will see their last year out it seems.

As for incomings I think it maybe too late now.

4 days left for incomings.

Strange thing is we had got the average age of our squad right down but then loaned or sold a lot of younger players meaning we are back to having the 6th oldest in the PL as it stands right now and even older if Esbrand and Kabore go too.

I hope some of these loaned young signings do well and come back to stay next season.

A weird window all around for me. I don’t know what to make of it yet.

Why do you think 4 days left is not enough time?

 

[Le Havre Oswald]

No but Kalvin's available!

Lined up for the Esports team

 

[pavelsrnicek]

I’m starting to think, for the first time, we are done.

Maybe Esbrand and Kabore loaned or sold. Maybe Ortega. Nobody wants Kalvin. None of the old guard want to leave and will see their last year out it seems.

As for incomings I think it maybe too late now.

4 days left for new signings.

Strange thing is we had got the average age of our squad right down but then loaned or sold a lot of the younger players we brought in meaning we are back to having the 6th oldest in the PL as it stands right now and even older if Esbrand and Kabore go too.

I hope some of these loaned young signings do well and come back to stay next season.

A weird window all around for me. I don’t know what to make of it yet.

We still have too many foreign players so Ortega and Akanji are pretty likely to leave.

The Ederson/ Donnarumma saga is perplexing as Ederson appears to want out but has no suitors outside of Galatasaray who seem to be unable to complete any deals.

 

[Joekmcfc]

View attachment 167702

The list of right backs we could have had is actually shockingly poor when you look.

Does anyone here want any of these players?

crazy we didn’t go for wesley franca for 20 mil, even if he’s not gonna be next walker hes 21 and already much better right back than we currently have. Popped up with a goal on his roma debut too. how haven’t we addressed this issue? madness. Rico lewis is not cut out for this level if he continues to play we’re gonna be in for a long season. same said about bernardo, and gundogan and even gonzalez probably. Fingers crossed for some of our concerns to be resolved over the next few days..

 

[Cobwebcat]

Why do you think 4 days left is not enough time?

Just a feeling from watching so many transfer windows in the past. It’s not so much the 4 days in isolation it’s more the 4 days left and, from the little we know, nothing seems close to being finalised. Of course there could be some last minute deals, particularly with Viana, but it’s getting less likely as the time ticks by. Yesterday I would have still said yes but I’m no now..too many moving parts.

 

[richards30]

I’m starting to think, for the first time, we are done.

Maybe Esbrand and Kabore loaned or sold. Maybe Ortega. Nobody wants Kalvin. None of the old guard want to leave and will see their last year out it seems.

As for incomings I think it maybe too late now.

4 days left for new signings.

Strange thing is we had got the average age of our squad right down but then loaned or sold a lot of the younger players we brought in meaning we are back to having the 6th oldest in the PL as it stands right now and even older if Esbrand and Kabore go too.

I hope some of these loaned young signings do well and come back to stay next season.

A weird window all around for me. I don’t know what to make of it yet.

I think we have a couple of things lined up but it’s a domino effect on things.

 

[Coatigan]

I think we have a couple of things lined up but it’s a domino effect on things.

This ^

 

[Cobwebcat]

I think we have a couple of things lined up but it’s a domino effect on things.

I agree but those pieces don't look like falling in time now for me…it’s seems too messy. I hope I’m wrong.

 

[Coatigan]

Just a feeling from watching so many transfer windows in the past. It’s not so much the 4 days in isolation it’s more the 4 days left and, from the little we know, nothing seems close to being finalised. Of course there could be some last minute deals, particularly with Viana, but it’s getting less likely as the time ticks by. Yesterday I would have still said yes but I’m no now..too many moving parts.

We have seen other clubs as well as ourselves pull together moves within a day, with little prior reporting going on. No reason to think the same can't happen agaim, particularly on the moves mooted the last few weeks.

I mean, I don't think we'll suddenly sign a right back out of nowhere having not been linked with a single one all summer. Think it looks like the club just aren't pursuing that this window. But the moves that seem on the cards may well yet happen.