The Labour Government

[Chippy_boy]

That sly fucker Burnham has now stepped up to stab his leader in the back.

“Et tu Brute”.

Interesting how he's crawled out of the woodwork. Perhaps different up north but in the country at large, we've not heard a peep out of him since COVID.

 

[BlueHammer85]

Didn’t take long for the vultures to start circling. Not surprised though, Starmer seems incapable of leading the party, let alone the country.

this will be said for every PM.

 

[Vic]

See the useless bastards are now ‘pausing’ the northern powerhouse rail. Burnham will be livid, and rightly so.
So much for cancelling HS2 but ring-fencing £12b for that railway upgrade.

Really got no idea what this shower are up-to and can only imagine a few of them have had thousands on Farage being the next PM!

It was the Tories who supposedly ring-fenced £12bn for Northern Powerhouse Rail from cancelling HS2 (along with spending "Network North" money on repairing potholes in London). Without HS2 building the section into Manchester, the costs all fall on NPR. £12bn would barely cover the tunnel under south Manchester and a station at Piccadilly. Then it's 10 miles of new track to Warrington (crossing the M56 twice, the M6 and the Ship Canal), rebuild Bank Quay station at Warrington, straighten the existing freight route through the old soapworks, then instead of the last government's plan for using existing tracks to Liverpool Lime Street the latest plan is for a new route * with two new stations in east Liverpool and the city centre. *And other than the planned HS2 section, no-one's saying what the route would be, so limiting opposition.

And it would be slower Liverpool-Manchester than the existing route.

 

[johnny crossan]

When, not if now and with Andy openly telling the world many want him as leader it’s clear he has lost many in the PLP after spending years dividing the membership.

Only himself and Reeves to blame.

Burnham is doing a great disservice to Labour - its only chance to beat Farage is under Starmer, with Mascara man and Jezzer at it you wonder if that is what the left want.

 

[Brewster's millions]

Interesting how he's crawled out of the woodwork. Perhaps different up north but in the country at large, we've not heard a peep out of him since COVID.

It’s frankly comical watching it play out.

Burnham’s delusions know no bounds. He got voted into a fabricated, unwanted non-job by 20% of the electorate and he’s subsequently spent eight years messing around with buses and achieved nothing of note.

Purely as a function of the desperate lack of talent in the cabinet - David Lammy is deputy PM after all - his name is forwarded as a potential leadership candidate for some unspecified future date. This leads to Burnham flouncing around like the heir apparent, promising a socialist revolution which people didn’t vote for in the last election, which people don’t actually want and indeed won’t vote for. And all this coming a bloke who effectively withdrew himself from the national political scene years ago because he simply wasn’t wanted.

He’s actually a very good example of why these regional / city mayors need to be abolished, as all they are at the moment are taxpayer funded mouthpieces obsessing on internal Labour Party politics.

 

[maxwellblue]

It’s frankly comical watching it play out.

Burnham’s delusions know no bounds. He got voted into a fabricated, unwanted non-job by 20% of the electorate and he’s subsequently spent eight years messing around with buses and achieved nothing of note.

Purely as a function of the desperate lack of talent in the cabinet - David Lammy is deputy PM after all - his name is forwarded as a potential leadership candidate for some unspecified future date. This leads to Burnham flouncing around like the heir apparent, promising a socialist revolution which people didn’t vote for in the last election, which people don’t actually want and indeed won’t vote for. And all this coming a bloke who effectively withdrew himself from the national political scene years ago because he simply wasn’t wanted.

He’s actually a very good example of why these regional / city mayors need to be abolished, as all they are at the moment are taxpayer funded mouthpieces obsessing on internal Labour Party politics.

Don't forget the 200 million he wasted on cameras and signage for a 495sq mile clean air zone

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

It was the Tories who supposedly ring-fenced £12bn for Northern Powerhouse Rail from cancelling HS2 (along with spending "Network North" money on repairing potholes in London). Without HS2 building the section into Manchester, the costs all fall on NPR. £12bn would barely cover the tunnel under south Manchester and a station at Piccadilly. Then it's 10 miles of new track to Warrington (crossing the M56 twice, the M6 and the Ship Canal), rebuild Bank Quay station at Warrington, straighten the existing freight route through the old soapworks, then instead of the last government's plan for using existing tracks to Liverpool Lime Street the latest plan is for a new route * with two new stations in east Liverpool and the city centre. *And other than the planned HS2 section, no-one's saying what the route would be, so limiting opposition.

And it would be slower Liverpool-Manchester than the existing route.

View attachment 170427

And yet, the 2 Labour mayors in Manchester and Liverpool are desperate for it to happen.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

It’s frankly comical watching it play out.

Burnham’s delusions know no bounds. He got voted into a fabricated, unwanted non-job by 20% of the electorate and he’s subsequently spent eight years messing around with buses and achieved nothing of note.

Purely as a function of the desperate lack of talent in the cabinet - David Lammy is deputy PM after all - his name is forwarded as a potential leadership candidate for some unspecified future date. This leads to Burnham flouncing around like the heir apparent, promising a socialist revolution which people didn’t vote for in the last election, which people don’t actually want and indeed won’t vote for. And all this coming a bloke who effectively withdrew himself from the national political scene years ago because he simply wasn’t wanted.

He’s actually a very good example of why these regional / city mayors need to be abolished, as all they are at the moment are taxpayer funded mouthpieces obsessing on internal Labour Party politics.

They need to abolish police and crime commissioners first. They have been a disaster.

 

[stonerblue]

The thing that is really going to piss me off if it happens is the abolition of the 2 child benefit cap. Further rewarding the feckless. I know we have a declining birth rate etc but the only people who will really benefit from this are Greggs and McDonalds

Whilst i agree with you on the cap, i don't condone your stereotyping of the recipients.
If you've got 3 kids and are made redundant then you should get benefit for them all.
If you've never worked but have had 3 kids then yes, cap it at 2.

 

[Brewster's millions]

They need to abolish police and crime commissioners first. They have been a disaster.

It all needs to be abolished - PCCs, regional mayors, National Assemblies.

All an expensive folly, and examples of how the UK foolishly became obsessed with devolution just as all the issues which really matter to people were increasingly determined at a national / supranational level.

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

It all needs to be abolished - PCCs, regional mayors, National Assemblies.

All an expensive folly, and examples of how the UK foolishly became obsessed with devolution just as all the issues which really matter to people were increasingly determined at a national / supranational level.

I am not sure centralisation of power works either. Technical advances make it easier to carry out tasks at a local level. We don’t need a huge London-based structure at all. No need for the House of Lords, no need for most lobbying firms, no need for all these new laws which are never actually enforced. Most of the Civil Service functions can be done by AI and digitisation. Our politicians have not got a clue what is going to hit them.

 

[mosssideblue]

I am not sure centralisation of power works either. Technical advances make it easier to carry out tasks at a local level. We don’t need a huge London-based structure at all. No need for the House of Lords, no need for most lobbying firms, no need for all these new laws which are never actually enforced. Most of the Civil Service functions can be done by AI and digitisation. Our politicians have not got a clue what is going to hit them.

If we got rid of HoL, which body would be responsible for HoCs checks and balances?

 

[Kompany Car]

£12bn would barely cover the tunnel under south Manchester and a station at Piccadilly

Nope it would be less than £6Bn for the tunnel and station. For reference the tunnels for HS2 which are designed to operate at 140mph which adds to the complexity, cost around £250m per mile. You dont need more than 6 miles of tunnels so around £1.5Bn would cover the tunnels. Mainline station modifications at Piccadilly and Lyme Street you wouldnt get much change out of £500m for each station. Once you move out of the city, if you still want tunnels a cut and cover design which is much cheaper than bored tunnels could be used.

Plain line electrified railway costs around £2m per single track km so a 2 track railway so roughly 65km (giving a bit of leeway) from Manchester to Liverpool = 65km*4 tracks*£2m = £520m, stick some additional stations in they are about £40m each to design and build (lets say 5 = £200m).

Still well within the £6Bn and still plenty of fat for all the consents, land purchase etc.

That said the rate at which we sanction the construction of such projects, inflation would probably make the £6Bn become £12Bn by the time its started.

 

[Earlyriser]

Whilst i agree with you on the cap, i don't condone your stereotyping of the recipients.
If you've got 3 kids and are made redundant then you should get benefit for them all.
If you've never worked but have had 3 kids then yes, cap it at 2.

In respect of those who are made redundant or who suffer a life changing/incapacitating injury I totally agree.

 

[Chippy_boy]

It’s frankly comical watching it play out.

Burnham’s delusions know no bounds. He got voted into a fabricated, unwanted non-job by 20% of the electorate and he’s subsequently spent eight years messing around with buses and achieved nothing of note.

Purely as a function of the desperate lack of talent in the cabinet - David Lammy is deputy PM after all - his name is forwarded as a potential leadership candidate for some unspecified future date. This leads to Burnham flouncing around like the heir apparent, promising a socialist revolution which people didn’t vote for in the last election, which people don’t actually want and indeed won’t vote for. And all this coming a bloke who effectively withdrew himself from the national political scene years ago because he simply wasn’t wanted.

He’s actually a very good example of why these regional / city mayors need to be abolished, as all they are at the moment are taxpayer funded mouthpieces obsessing on internal Labour Party politics.

And his financial acumen extends to saying we should stop worrying about the bond markets!!??!

He wants to spend more whilst ignoring the fact that it is the bond markets who would need to lend the government the money.

I shudder to think what would happen to the 10-year and 30-year bond yields, were such a loon to become PM. Our borrowing costs would go even more bananas, leading to even less money for public services and higher taxes still.

He's just a muppet really.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Whilst i agree with you on the cap, i don't condone your stereotyping of the recipients.
If you've got 3 kids and are made redundant then you should get benefit for them all.
If you've never worked but have had 3 kids then yes, cap it at 2.

Broadly I would agree with this. But I would just add, why doesn't the government do something creative like giving tax breaks for having kids? We need a growing domestic population for many reasons, so encouraging Brits to have kids is good in principle. But there are incentives you can provide that don't simply rely on handouts that potentially can reward the feckless. How about rewarding hard work? Free childcare for families with both parents working full time, for example?

 

[John John]

I don't wanna pay for......what a stupid, lame argument that is. Extend it out to child benefit, libraries etc and you soon realise how crazy even having that thought is.

I don't want to extend it anywhere. If you have contributed you are allowed to claim it and use it . End of

 

[maxwellblue]

We should ask people like you to pay extra tax because you are happy to spend it on people who have contributed nothing. Then people like me should be allowed to pay less tax because I don't agree it is spent on asylum seekers who are living in hotels with spending money and 3 meals a day as well as free dental and medical care. Can you afford to pay for it because I can't . Billions a year on chancers whose first act is to destroy their documents because a lot of them are from countries with no problems. We have enough lazy fuckers in the UK without importing them

Totally agree and I don't think you are in the minority with those thoughts

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

Interesting how he's crawled out of the woodwork. Perhaps different up north but in the country at large, we've not heard a peep out of him since COVID.

Why would you expect to hear from the mayor of Manchester, in the country at large?

 

[John John]

Im not going round in circles while you give me examples of well to do pensioners. The state pension only is not a lot of money to live on. That is my view so anyone going on about the triple lock can do one until the state pension is more in line with other decent paying countries.
That is where I stand and where I will stay, if anyone wants to come up with ideas of how to take a bit more off the wealthy then fair enough.

@Blue Maverick rightly states defining what a well to do pensioner is ain't easy. For some reason a few posters seem to have a downer on the temerity of old folk to not be living off bread and water and daring not to pop their clogs for our benefit. :-)

I was speaking to some people from Sweden and I asked what is the average pension there. The reply was depends what you have contributed . I said what is the average . I was astounded when they said about 4,000 Euros a month.
Can that be true? The best pension . Luxmenburg 6500Euro a month