The Labour Government

[The Future’s Blue!]

They get 12 travel warrants a year, so not sure what this referring to

They don’t.

 

[bluethrunthru]

Does it?

yes - try reading the info on the UK govt post

 

[mosssideblue]

yes - try reading the info on the UK govt post

I read the link and still don’t see anything different to what is normal

 

[Blue Maverick]

Now, as you’ve been so vociferous with your knowledge on this, can you please confirm the regulatory stance from the MoD? And, BTW, I will tell you that you are talking absolute bollox from the start.

Only entitled personnel get railcards, and that’s very few. As for travel warrants, Service Personnel only get them for Duty Travel, where they are on Duty.

Or, have I been Clarkied?

You can buy a rail card for £21 whilst serving and veterans £30 which gets you a third off the price. And the get you home warrants in early years are 4 a year I believe.

 

[mosssideblue]

They don’t.

Having slept on this and being a person who received such military travel warrants in a past life, I think you’re right in that it was after a period of time when 12 warrants were granted.

Fair play to Labour for doing this.

 

[mosssideblue]

Now, as you’ve been so vociferous with your knowledge on this, can you please confirm the regulatory stance from the MoD? And, BTW, I will tell you that you are talking absolute bollox from the start.

Only entitled personnel get railcards, and that’s very few. As for travel warrants, Service Personnel only get them for Duty Travel, where they are on Duty.

Or, have I been Clarkied?

Have the rules changed as, when I was serving, I was getting travel warrants for use by me and my family, even when on shore duty or under training?

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

You can buy a rail card for £21 whilst serving and veterans £30 which gets you a third off the price. And the get you home warrants in early years are 4 a year I believe.

Ah, so the context has suddenly changed from everybody getting freebies to military personnel getting subsidies. And why shouldn’t they get subsidies when they are forced to spend huge periods of time away from home, do you have something against that?

 

[Blue Maverick]

Have the rules changed as, when I was serving, I was getting travel warrants for use by me and my family, even when on shore duty or under training?

Well looking online I was under the same impression as you, various sources claim you still get 4 a year and pay a nominal fee for a rail card.

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

Have the rules changed as, when I was serving, I was getting travel warrants for use by me and my family, even when on shore duty or under training?

The rules changed many years ago, taking away many subsidies to allow serving personnel to return home. And they wonder why recruiting and retention is in the shit!

 

[Blue Maverick]

Ah, so the context has suddenly changed from everybody getting freebies to military personnel getting subsidies. And why shouldn’t they get subsidies when they are forced to spend huge periods of time away from home, do you have something against that?

Absolutely not and they shouldn’t even have to pay for the card, what I’m questioning is the bullshit Labour suddenly care about the military, have a Google of the Ajax fiasco currently on going and tell me they give a shit. I served for 12 years and know exactly how the military are treated, second fucking class until it suits.
I think if you are in uniform you should travel anywhere for free anyway or at least with your ID, I know you can on the metro link in Manchester and that should be extended to veterans.

 

[hampshireblue]

We aren't talking about training people. Remove the welder from a business that welds things then you have no business. You can teach the cleaner to weld, that is true but how long can that business survive generatino no revenue while you train them

Well you brought it up by suggesting people that carry out some roles, and I now quote you:

"but could the cleaners operate the machinery that makes the product the business sells to generate it's revenue. Answer is no".

That suggests that you as a boss had a closed view of what a person is capable of due to the role they are carrying out. It also suggests you weren't open to apprenticeships as you were/are only bothered in having ready made revenue generators in your "very, very successful business".

I note you replied to one of my answers but not the one about some occupations being absolutely crucial to most businesses without being an obvious revenue generator.

Interesting you "cleaned your own office". Why would you not have that cleaned whilst the rest of the workplace was being cleaned? Maybe they weren't of a suitable standard/intellect to clean the boss's office?

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

Absolutely not and they shouldn’t even have to pay for the card, what I’m questioning is the bullshit Labour suddenly care about the military, have a Google of the Ajax fiasco currently on going and tell me they give a shit. I served for 12 years and know exactly how the military are treated, second fucking class until it suits.
I think if you are in uniform you should travel anywhere for free anyway or at least with your ID, I know you can on the metro link in Manchester and that should be extended to veterans.

I apologise if I came across a little strong but the original comment you made was so flippant it created a reaction. Serving personnel can BUY a railcard that gives them a percentage off rail travel, they still have to pay for it. And, apart from the first 12 months of service, where they get a number of subsidised return travel warrants, there is nothing following that period unless you have your own property that you reside in on periods of leave, and that is based on a mileage allowance of 25 pence per mile.

As for the Ajax, it’s been a clusterfuck for many years, and the recent media headlines aren’t new to this government. The difference is that this government has decided to take this head on instead of allowing it to continue in the same vain as previous governments. Our Defence is in shit state where we have no armour, no credible fighting force, and has had little will from the people to secure our country.

Yet, when a government comes in and actively takes control of the situation, as this one is, the first thing people do is cite misinformation so that they can get some form of political capital.

 

[Blue Maverick]

I apologise if I came across a little strong but the original comment you made was so flippant it created a reaction. Serving personnel can BUY a railcard that gives them a percentage off rail travel, they still have to pay for it. And, apart from the first 12 months of service, where they get a number of subsidised return travel warrants, there is nothing following that period unless you have your own property that you reside in on periods of leave, and that is based on a mileage allowance of 25 pence per mile.

As for the Ajax, it’s been a clusterfuck for many years, and the recent media headlines aren’t new to this government. The difference is that this government has decided to take this head on instead of allowing it to continue in the same vain as previous governments. Our Defence is in shit state where we have no armour, no credible fighting force, and has had little will from the people to secure our country.

Yet, when a government comes in and actively takes control of the situation, as this one is, the first thing people do is cite misinformation so that they can get some form of political capital.

No problem mate I think we are all on the same side, I loved my military time but we were always treated like shit until we were needed, that’s by all governments, we didn’t get decent money until after gulf war 1 when suddenly we were needed then we got a 10% rise after, funny that isn’t it. Then nothing but cutbacks until you guessed it Gulf war 2 then Afghan when suddenly the miltary are in the spot light. All governments have cut them to the bone, supplied shit gear and accommodation is whoeful, no wonder people join and leave in shortly after.

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

No problem mate I think we are all on the same side, I loved my military time but we were always treated like shit until we were needed, that’s by all governments, we didn’t get decent money until after gulf war 1 when suddenly we were needed then we got a 10% rise after, funny that isn’t it. Then nothing but cutbacks until you guessed it Gulf war 2 then Afghan when suddenly the miltary are in the spot light. All governments have cut them to the bone, supplied shit gear and accommodation is whoeful, no wonder people join and leave in shortly after.

That's why this Labour Government have awarded them a pay rise of 10.5% since last July (little reported ) However accommodation charges have also increased.

 

[west didsblue]

I ran my own very, very successful business for 40 years so I'm quite confident that I am clued up enough to comment how businesses work. Have you ever run a business ?

As I said all roles are important to the running of any business but my answer was to which role was the most important.

Remove those that do the invoicing, wages, cleaning etc. Those that produce the product that generates the revenue could still send out the invoices, do the wages, clean the office and workshop. It might make the day longer but it would still get done.

Keep those that do the invoices, do the wages and clean the office and get rid of the revenue producers and those left have nothing to invoice, no wages to pay, apart from their own but there won't be any money to pay them as nothing is being produced and sold.

Yes, three.

I have also worked for a very large manufacturing organisation and know how vital it is to have employees that do all the jobs that would distract a revenue earner from earning revenue. They were as valuable to the organisation as anyone operating a machine even if their costs were covered in overheads which is a proportion of the sale price of equipment or a proportion of the hourly rate charged by the company for the services of revenue earners.

 

[Blue Maverick]

That's why this Labour Government have awarded them a pay rise of 10.5% since last July (little reported ) However accommodation charges have also increased.

Don’t forget the shite pay as you dine tat Labour introduced!

 

[mosssideblue]

Yes, three.

I have also worked for a very large manufacturing organisation and know how vital it is to have employees that do all the jobs that would distract a revenue earner from earning revenue. They were as valuable to the organisation as anyone operating a machine even if their costs were covered in overheads which is a proportion of the sale price of equipment or a proportion of the hourly rate charged by the company for the services of revenue earners.

Wasting your time mate. He thinks he’s the only one to run a business so he must be right

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

Don’t forget the shite pay as you dine tat Labour introduced!

Not meaning to have a pop again but it wasn’t Labour, it was the Armed Forces who introduced it. And, to get away from politics, it was a requirement following complaints about the old system, where people were paying for food that they didn’t eat, ie. when away for weekends.

That’s why those who were left in camp over the weekend got steak Fridays with the full works, they were spending somebody else’s money ;-)

 

[maxwellblue]

Wasting your time mate. He thinks he’s the only one to run a business so he must be right

Where have I ever said that ? You're just making things up now.

 

[maxwellblue]

Well you brought it up by suggesting people that carry out some roles, and I now quote you:

"but could the cleaners operate the machinery that makes the product the business sells to generate it's revenue. Answer is no".

That suggests that you as a boss had a closed view of what a person is capable of due to the role they are carrying out. It also suggests you weren't open to apprenticeships as you were/are only bothered in having ready made revenue generators in your "very, very successful business".

I note you replied to one of my answers but not the one about some occupations being absolutely crucial to most businesses without being an obvious revenue generator.

Interesting you "cleaned your own office". Why would you not have that cleaned whilst the rest of the workplace was being cleaned? Maybe they weren't of a suitable standard/intellect to clean the boss's office?

Look back at my original post yesterday. I agreed that all employers play a role within a business. All I said was that those who generate the revenue for that business are the most important. Without them there is no revenue and therefore no business. Not hard is it.
You are totally wrong about my view on apprenticeships. I started my working life as an apprentice and value every one of those 4 years and still use things learnt during that time today. I have over the years taken on numerous apprentices, some of which have gone on to run their own businesses.

I'm sure there are instances of roles being critical without necessarily being a revenue generator, however my comment was aimed in a more general way. I would be interested in what you think these roles are.

Why should I not clean my office, I helped to tidy the stores and workshop as did the rest of staff.