Andy Burnham | Manchester Mayor

mancityvstoke said:
He's definitely not the king of the North though mate.

When I see my council tax bill and what he costs me I feel sick.
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I never said he was, tbf, he does have his problems, enough that I don't feel like putting the signs/cameras is fair, given the position he was in.

I don't know if he's a solution to Starmer, but we are zombie walking into a Reform shithole as things stand, personally I'd prefer Becky Long-Bailey to stand again, she ran Starmer close last time but she's probs too left for anyone over the age of 45, IDK.
 
Very well connected friend of mine just emailed me as follows - pretty bleak
"Our country is facing make or break in Makerfield. Andy boy has great political courage but the test he has been set is fearsome. The wc have given up listening and in their understandable despair at democratic politics are susceptible to simplistic cruel solutions on the basis of give reform a go as it cant get any worse. But it can.
Riots in London tomorrow or will most of the violent racists be in the chelsea end?
The end of days."
 
Tiattos_Waterbottle said:
I never said he was, tbf, he does have his problems, enough that I don't feel like putting the signs/cameras is fair, given the position he was in.

I don't know if he's a solution to Starmer, but we are zombie walking into a Reform shithole as things stand, personally I'd prefer Becky Long-Bailey to stand again, she ran Starmer close last time but she's probs too left for anyone over the age of 45, IDK.
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agreed ...reform council is a horrible option.
 
Tiattos_Waterbottle said:
"My argument is that local authorities were manoeuvred into a position where they had no choice. Our 10 [local authorities] were given a legal direction to clean up the air by 2024 and, like Birmingham, like Bradford, like Portsmouth, they looked at the evidence and the only way they could do it that quickly was by using charges.

"So you are technically right to say the government didn't explicitly say you've got to do it via charges, but they effectively did because of the deadline that they imposed on people. I am conceding to you, the way you put your question is technically right, but I think it's duplicitous of central government to leave local authorities taking all of the blame."

Reading comprehension not your strong suit, or is this pedantry?
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It was a Tory pattern for local authorities. Tell them something must be done, then oppose whatever ideas councils came up with for the "something". Low traffic neighbourhoods was a classic - give councils money to implement them but then have the local Tories lead the "waste of money" / "no 15 minute cities" cries.

Or telling councils they had to collect food waste, and separate other recycling streams, then have Sunak go public against having 7 different bins.
 
Vic said:
It was a Tory pattern for local authorities. Tell them something must be done, then oppose whatever ideas councils came up with for the "something". Low traffic neighbourhoods was a classic - give councils money to implement them but then have the local Tories lead the "waste of money" / "no 15 minute cities" cries.

Or telling councils they had to collect food waste, and separate other recycling streams, then have Sunak go public against having 7 different bins.
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I see that an admission from the man himself whilst still trying to shift some of the blame isn't enough for you.

It was obviously so deviously cunning a plan that it could only have been thought up by the blue teams Minister for cunning plans, the right honourable Professor Baldrick of Cunning Fox University ! ;-)
 
HypnoticBlue said:
Don’t want Burnham anywhere near PM, as he’ll support the new old toilet circus tent.
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I've heard a lot about this guy even though I'm 12000 miles away and I know little about UK politics. But I believe he was a good mayor.
Did he sort out picadilly gardens as mayor of Manchester? Was that in his remit?
I still have a soft spot for the gardens as I lost my virginity there on a bench at about 4am after a night at the magic village.
 
Bill Walker said:
I've heard a lot about this guy even though I'm 12000 miles away and I know little about UK politics. But I believe he was a good mayor.
Did he sort out picadilly gardens as mayor of Manchester? Was that in his remit?
I still have a soft spot for the gardens as I lost my virginity there on a bench at about 4am after a night at the magic village.
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No mate, just your bog standard professional, career politician, who despite losing the his bid to be the red team leader a couple of times, is now seen as the new red rosette Messiah.
 
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Bill Walker said:
I've heard a lot about this guy even though I'm 12000 miles away and I know little about UK politics. But I believe he was a good mayor.
Did he sort out picadilly gardens as mayor of Manchester? Was that in his remit?
I still have a soft spot for the gardens as I lost my virginity there on a bench at about 4am after a night at the magic village.
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I remember that night fondly too.

Flying to the other side of the world without even buying me breakfast stung a little though.
 
MouldensChippy said:
I see that an admission from the man himself whilst still trying to shift some of the blame isn't enough for you.

It was obviously so deviously cunning a plan that it could only have been thought up by the blue teams Minister for cunning plans, the right honourable Professor Baldrick of Cunning Fox University ! ;-)
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I think you're confusing the MEN headline with the reality - as I carefully explained.

I'll try again. Tory in Government says "Do this"; Labour Council does it; Tory councillor says "Don't do it".
 
Vic said:
I think you're confusing the MEN headline with the reality - as I carefully explained.

I'll try again. Tory in Government says "Do this"; Labour Council does it; Tory councillor says "Don't do it".
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And you believe that rather than the fact that Andy Burnham admitted that it was his plan after many months of pressure.

Funny thing is, you'd have zero problem accepting it if it was a member of the blue team making the admission.

I also remeber you carefully explaining that a red team council buying commercial property for 50 million, then selling it in distress for 30 million weren't in fact making a 20 million pound loss of taxpayer funds, but a 20 million profit !

I'm still happy that you're not my accountant after that !
 
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Bill Walker said:
I've heard a lot about this guy even though I'm 12000 miles away and I know little about UK politics. But I believe he was a good mayor.
Did he sort out picadilly gardens as mayor of Manchester? Was that in his remit?
I still have a soft spot for the gardens as I lost my virginity there on a bench at about 4am after a night at the magic village.
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I dont know if you are aware of Britain's blue plaque. They stick it on the wall of John Lennons house or similar so tourists can spot it and gaup at it.

You have one on a bench in Piccadilly Gardens.
 
MouldensChippy said:
And you believe that rather than the fact that Andy Burnham admitted that it was his plan after many months of pressure.

Funny thing is, you'd have zero problem accepting it if it was a member of the blue team making the admission.

I also remeber you carefully explaining that a red team council buying commercial property for 50 million, then selling it in distress for 30 million weren't in fact making a 20 million pound loss of taxpayer funds, but a 20 million profit !

I'm still happy that you're not my accountant after that !
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I checked. You misunderstood then and still misunderstand even though I explained.

Ah, I see where you've misunderstood. As I said earlier, the council sold the property for what they paid for it.

The 50m/30m difference is between what they borrowed and what they repaid to the lender. (Another council borrowed £25m and only repaid £10.5m.)

That discount is exactly because the government wants to relend the money. They either had another 40 years getting 2% on a £50m loan (£40m interest) - or getting 5% on £30m (£60m). The extra half million a year interest can also be lent out. As I said, I don't know the exact figure but that's the principle behind it.


So, again: the higher the current interest rate, the bigger the discount the government (the Public Works Loan Board) will give to redeem the loan. As interest rates start dropping, it might make sense to sell an investment property and get the maximum discount (which I gather is actually paid over ten years not as a lump sum). So (not necessarily true of all such investments) a council could have paid £50m for a property, taken several years rent (making money even after interest payments), then sold it at £40m because Truss killed the market, but only had to repay £30m of the £50m loan. Still £10m "up".

The real issue is that despite Eric Pickles saying councils should be more commercially-minded to make up for the Coalition's cuts in central grants, and the government providing the money for such deals, it was still money "at risk". The government has now changed the rules so councils can't "borrow to invest" (but can if it helps regeneration).

See Spelthorne Council for really reckless "borrowing to invest" with very little scrutiny and due diligence. Even the "regeneration" loans can go badly - e.g. Luton Council borrowing £180m for improvements at Luton airport, just before Covid hit.
 
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heslops barnet said:
Burnham doesn't have to give up his Mayoral seat to stand so he has nothing to lose…….
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His position surely can't be tenable if he does lose though?

He was willing to drop GM like a stone to fulfil his own ambitions... Then he's expecting to waltz back in as if nothing has happened and have the support of the people he should be representing?

Can't see it myself.
 
Bill Walker said:
I've heard a lot about this guy even though I'm 12000 miles away and I know little about UK politics. But I believe he was a good mayor.
Did he sort out picadilly gardens as mayor of Manchester? Was that in his remit?
I still have a soft spot for the gardens as I lost my virginity there on a bench at about 4am after a night at the magic village.
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He's not the Mayor of Manchester.

A bright new chapter for Piccadilly Gardens | 2025 | Manchester City Council

A bright new chapter for Piccadilly Gardens - A Council plan to significantly improve the appearance of Piccadilly Gardens and people’s experience of the prominent city centre space has been unveiled.
www.manchester.gov.uk www.manchester.gov.uk
 
Vic said:
I checked. You misunderstood then and still misunderstand even though I explained.

Ah, I see where you've misunderstood. As I said earlier, the council sold the property for what they paid for it.

The 50m/30m difference is between what they borrowed and what they repaid to the lender. (Another council borrowed £25m and only repaid £10.5m.)

That discount is exactly because the government wants to relend the money. They either had another 40 years getting 2% on a £50m loan (£40m interest) - or getting 5% on £30m (£60m). The extra half million a year interest can also be lent out. As I said, I don't know the exact figure but that's the principle behind it.


So, again: the higher the current interest rate, the bigger the discount the government (the Public Works Loan Board) will give to redeem the loan. As interest rates start dropping, it might make sense to sell an investment property and get the maximum discount (which I gather is actually paid over ten years not as a lump sum). So (not necessarily true of all such investments) a council could have paid £50m for a property, taken several years rent (making money even after interest payments), then sold it at £40m because Truss killed the market, but only had to repay £30m of the £50m loan. Still £10m "up".
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You talk some crap when it comes to the red team.... You don't even want to believe the words from Andy's own mouth. :-)

I'm also sure that you must be related to Rooney somewhere in your history with that hard on you have for f**king over pensioners. Still supremely happy that you're not my accountant, you have more excuses than an innocent Scouser.
 
MouldensChippy said:
You talk some crap when it comes to the red team.... You don't even want to believe the words from Andy's own mouth. :-)

I'm also sure that you must be related to Rooney somewhere in your history with that hard on you have for f**king over pensioners. Still supremely happy that you're not my accountant, you have more excuses than an innocent Scouser.
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I'll try not to respond in kind, but abuse is no excuse for failing to understand.
 
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