HS2 - Cancel it now

[Fred_Quimby]

For the cost if HS2 you can:-

Replace every piece of track.

Renew every piece of rolling stock.

You would then have comfortable trains that ran on time.

 

[dickie davies]

Will be just another commuting route to London. Mega billions to transport 15,000 people per hour (1,100 per train, 14 trains per hour).
All in a minimum 10+ years time when the need to travel will likely be reduced anyway.

Building HS3 first, the Trans Pennines route, would have made more sense. Bringing that route up to 21st century standards now would provide more value to the North.
Getting from Piccadilly to Euston in an hour is useless if it still takes an hour or more at each end.

These trains, with the possible exception of the "rush hour commuter" won't be full
There's already lots of capacity on existing trains

 

[BlueAnorak]

What I fail to understand is how construction companies continue to massively under estimate costs on major infrastructure projects and yet they continue to get away with it.
East coast electrification, HS1, UK aircraft carriers, Crossrail, HS2 - the list goes on and on and on.
Now, I know the Government always choses the cheapest tender but the winning tenders are barely 1/3 of the final cost.
More importantly, why doesn't the government correct the tendering process?

 

[PannickAtTheDisco]

most of those are on the generous end, so I think we can see the problem isn't how to get to London quickly, more how to get anywhere bleeding else at anywhere approaching car speeds...

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Brum to Bristol is dreadful but CrossCountry pretty much have a monopoly and it takes at least half an hour longer than it should.

I agree with Transpennine but as you say i think the links between Brum/Nottingham/Derby/Leicester/Lincoln etc. need improving and speeding but crucially as well Manchester to Sheffield and Leeds to Sheffield, that central north/south belt is sorely lacking investment

I should also add that the fact I can’t get a train back to Brum after a night game is outrageous. The last train goes before 10pm. Back from London ain’t much better - as the last decent train is at 11pm, meaning I’ve sometimes got to drive to Luton Airport Parkway and get the train from there as they run all night to there from St Pancras, if I’m even half expecting to finish late.

 

[PannickAtTheDisco]

I should also add that the fact I can’t get a train back to Brum after a night game is outrageous. The last train goes before 10pm. Back from London ain’t much better - as the last decent train is at 11pm, meaning I’ve sometimes got to drive to Luton Airport Parkway and get the train from there as they run all night to there from St Pancras, if I’m even half expecting to finish late.

the only god send for transpennine is it does run late, and start early to take early airport bound commuters.

and we have some new trains, although for some reason with said trains the journey time to Manc is now 10/20 minutes slower.

 

[bluethrunthru]

most of those are on the generous end, so I think we can see the problem isn't how to get to London quickly, more how to get anywhere bleeding else at anywhere approaching car speeds...

And the end result those journey times will be 10 minutes and it will still be quicker to get a bus from Leeds to fucking Bradford or from Edinburgh to Glasgow.

 

[Blue Til Death]

This project should be renamed H2S, it's a poison chalice that's for sure .....!

 

[Aguero_Element]

with 86billion....


buy some more missles or fighter yets? if you think our problems in this country are to do with funding, you are completely naive.

 

[Fred_Quimby]

What I fail to understand is how construction companies continue to massively under estimate costs on major infrastructure projects and yet they continue to get away with it.
East coast electrification, HS1, UK aircraft carriers, Crossrail, HS2 - the list goes on and on and on.
Now, I know the Government always choses the cheapest tender but the winning tenders are barely 1/3 of the final cost.
More importantly, why doesn't the government correct the tendering process?

In a previous life I worked in Military research. I asked the guys I worked with why projects always overran and cost more than estimated. His reply was that contractors always underbid knowing that we would make mistakes and then ask for changes and then the contractors would screw us knowing that it would cost to much to cancel/pull out.