Rugby League Ashes 2025: England v Australia Kangaroos

[Manc in London]

Paul Sulthorpe and Garry Schofield were up there with any Aussie half-backs.

Danny McGuire was never picked for England and Great Britain anywhere near enough. He wasn’t even picked for the 2013 World Cup squad and was barely picked for 2008 World Cup games. But he was a big game player, winning the Harry Sunderland twice (both after he stopped getting picked for England), and scorer of 276 tries in his career including 39 one seasons, as a half-back… he only played 19 games for England and GB in a 21 year career.

But outside that, there aren’t many. Like you say, the Aussies have numerous names like that. Even Andrew Johns only played for Australia 26 times in a 21 year career. Some never even picked.

As for the pack, McMeeken was class in Saturday, the back row of Knowles, Pearce-Paul and Watkins all played well n’all. But it’s a far cry from the quality of depth we had in the 00s: Morley, Newton, Peacock, Fielden, A.Farrell, McDermott, Anderson… then the 10s: S.Burgess, Roby, Graham, Westwood, Ellis, O’Loughlin, G.Burgess, Hill…

Paul Sculthorpe (played only as a half back because our halves were shit but he was a very good loose forward) and Schofield as good as Andrew Johns, Alfie Langer, Darren Lockyer, Jonathan Thurston, Ricky Stuart, Cooper Cronk and Brad Fittler (played loose forward too but nowhere near as much as Sculthorpe)? Not a chance. Not even in the same stratosphere.

As for Danny McGuire haha

I watched a lot of junior rugby in Australia, such as Newtown, Wombats, Redfearn and the Dolphins. There were players at that level who would be professionals in the SL. The players did not have the physicality to play at the top level as most were still young but the skill levels and intelligence was often better than SL level.

Look at Jackson Hastings. Superstar at Salford who won Man of Steel. He could only make 5 starts last year for an average team.

I missed Ellis when talking about forwards. He was very good. I think our forwards are okay. Certainly not a massive gap between them and the Aussies. I don't think there has been a chasm in the quality of forwards since the 80s.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Paul Sculthorpe (played only as a half back because our halves were shit but he was a very good loose forward) and Schofield as good as Andrew Johns, Alfie Langer, Darren Lockyer, Jonathan Thurston, Ricky Stuart, Cooper Cronk and Brad Fittler (played loose forward too but nowhere near as much as Sculthorpe)? Not a chance. Not even in the same stratosphere.

As for Danny McGuire haha

I watched a lot of junior rugby in Australia, such as Newtown, Wombats, Redfearn and the Dolphins. There were players at that level who would be professionals in the SL. The players did not have the physicality to play at the top level as most were still young but the skill levels and intelligence was often better than SL level.

Look at Jackson Hastings. Superstar at Salford who won Man of Steel. He could only make 5 starts last year for an average team.

I missed Ellis when talking about forwards. He was very good. I think our forwards are okay. Certainly not a massive gap between them and the Aussies. I don't think there has been a chasm in the quality of forwards since the 80s.

True what you say about Jackson Hastings. It's also true that he's one of the worst players to ever play for Great Britain, Certainly, not as good as Danny Mags.

I recall our media was obsessed with saying Lockyer was a defensive liability for the Aussies. That wasn't reflected in test matches or the State of Origin performances..

 

[.db.]

Great try, England. Let’s lift it now!

 

[.db.]

Well, we’ve hung in there at 8-12.

Australia haven’t played particularly well in any first half in this series. It’s been the 15 mins after half time we’ve lost every game so far.

Don’t let them sit down at half time, keep them on their feet and send them out on the pitch early for a mini-warm up.

 

[.db.]

We did okay in spells across the three tests, increasingly more impact in their 20 in each of the games. But it was just never enough.

At 8-12 we were on their line for ten minutes going for it and we just couldn’t break them down.

But they have 3 times the cap, 3 times the player pool and they won 0-3.

No disgrace. It’s all about making the game bigger and better in this country now and we need the NRL to get on board.

 

[bluemoon32]

Ends 8-30 to Australia, huge huge gulf between the sides

 

[Manc in London]

True what you say about Jackson Hastings. It's also true that he's one of the worst players to ever play for Great Britain, Certainly, not as good as Danny Mags.

I recall our media was obsessed with saying Lockyer was a defensive liability for the Aussies. That wasn't reflected in test matches or the State of Origin performances..

Two of the best pound for pound tacklers I have watched over the last 40 years were Andrew Johns and Allan Langer. Very few players who were not very good defensively had long careers in the NFL/ARL/NSWRL, even if they were half backs.

Salford signed the worst Aussie defender I have ever watched: Paul Carige. Absolute garbage.

 

[Stephen230]

Three comfortable but not embarrassing defeats was probably about as good as England could have realistically hoped for.

You don't need to be an expert to see there's clearly a huge gulf between the sides. Fortunate for England and probably Super League that the Aussies never really clicked in to gear and showed their full capabilities.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Two of the best pound for pound tacklers I have watched over the last 40 years were Andrew Johns and Allan Langer. Very few players who were not very good defensively had long careers in the NFL/ARL/NSWRL, even if they were half backs.

Salford signed the worst Aussie defender I have ever watched: Paul Carige. Absolute garbage.

I remember a forward called Cross who signed for Leeds. He was like the proverbial Italian tank. Four reverse gears. Somehow we managed to offload him to Wigan, but I think they had an injury crisis.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Three comfortable but not embarrassing defeats was probably about as good as England could have realistically hoped for.

You don't need to be an expert to see there's clearly a huge gulf between the sides. Fortunate for England and probably Super League that the Aussies never really clicked in to gear and showed their full capabilities.

There’s a huge gulf but the third test performance (bar the last 10 mins when we’d given up) might have been enough to win the first test match. A lot of ifs and buts of course.

 

[Stephen230]

Just as an aside, that Aussie try that the on field ref disallowed for off side was a bit strange. The video ref was shown one replay, where the scorer wasn't even in the picture and then quickly decided that as there's no other angles, he'll have to stick with the on field decision. You telling me there wasn't a single camera on the cricket side stand? Or even behind the posts? Bizarre.