Antoine Semenyo | Prefers to join City - Ornstein (p73)

Marmoush hasn't played because Haaland is incredible and this season Doku has emerged as a top player. The space for Marmoush has disappeared. I've felt all season that we need to work out how to get more out of Marmoush but if Semenyo signs it will look even more difficult for him.

I find some of the comments about Savinho and Bobb disappointing. Semenyo is a better right sided player in this moment but he's 25 years old. These players are at different stages in their development. What would Semenyo have looked like at 21?
 
Marvin. said:
I find some of the comments about Savinho and Bobb disappointing. Semenyo is a better right sided player in this moment but he's 25 years old. These players are at different stages in their development. What would Semenyo have looked like at 21?
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That’s not really the point, though, is it?

What does City need TODAY, and, at Savinho & Bobb’s age, are they playing well enough to make a difference to the team and the outcomes of games? Sadly, if the answer is “No!” and they want First Team football, then they (and the club) have a choice to make.

Often, it’s not the club that wants to lose a young talent, but the talent that wants to lose the club!

And, on this, I agree with Pep…if you want to leave, no problem! Just have your Agent bring the club a deal they can agree to and you can leave. Pep doesn’t need to convince ANYONE to stay, nor should he!

City are not a “developmental” team, but a DEVELOPED team, which means a player of 19-22 yo needs to have his shit together and be able to perform on the biggest stage or they might need to go away and learn that skill…either on a season long loan or two, or (if they or the club prefer) a transfer at a reasonable fee.

It’s all well and good seeing that a player MIGHT come good in a year or two, but with a 25 man squad, which is really a 16-17 man team with about 10-11 peripheral bench warmers, if your status starts to affect the number and make up of that squad, you NEED to be a trusted producer, per Pep.
 
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ChicagoBlue said:
That’s not really the point, though, is it?

What does City need TODAY, and, at Savinho & Bobb’s age, are they playing well enough to make a difference to the team and the outcomes of games? Sadly, if the answer is “No!” and they want First Team football, then they (and the club) have a choice to make.

Often, it’s not the club that wants to lose a young talent, but the talent that wants to lose the club!

And, on this, I agree with Pep…if you want to leave, no problem! Just have your Agent bring the club a deal they can agree to and you can leave. Pep doesn’t need to convince ANYONE to stay, nor should he!
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I will say it another way then: Semenyo is a leading player, whereas Bobb and Savinho are potential. I think this comment is relevant to some peoples remarks on Bobb and Savinho.
 
Marvin. said:
Marmoush hasn't played because Haaland is incredible and this season Doku has emerged as a top player. The space for Marmoush has disappeared. I've felt all season that we need to work out how to get more out of Marmoush but if Semenyo signs it will look even more difficult for him.

I find some of the comments about Savinho and Bobb disappointing. Semenyo is a better right sided player in this moment but he's 25 years old. These players are at different stages in their development. What would Semenyo have looked like at 21?
Click to expand...
What was Foden like at 20 what was NOR like ?
They have been given a chance and not taken it
Unfortunately that’s what competitive sport is all about
 
Marvin. said:
Marmoush hasn't played because Haaland is incredible and this season Doku has emerged as a top player. The space for Marmoush has disappeared. I've felt all season that we need to work out how to get more out of Marmoush but if Semenyo signs it will look even more difficult for him.

I find some of the comments about Savinho and Bobb disappointing. Semenyo is a better right sided player in this moment but he's 25 years old. These players are at different stages in their development. What would Semenyo have looked like at 21?
Click to expand...
Then Semenyo will play ,if he is the better player and who guarantees that Savinho will be better than he is atm at 25 years old? Nobody knows. He will be back starting games if he makes that huge leap.
 
Marvin. said:
I will say it another way then: Semenyo is a leading player, whereas Bobb and Savinho are potential. I think this comment is relevant to some peoples remarks on Bobb and Savinho.
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What do we now need at City ? We’ve regressed due to various reasons and need to have leading players who make a difference now
Otherwise how long before the likes of Haaland Foden and Gvardiol want to leave
 
Marvin. said:
I will say it another way then: Semenyo is a leading player, whereas Bobb and Savinho are potential. I think this comment is relevant to some peoples remarks on Bobb and Savinho.
Click to expand...
Indeed. I agree and it illustrates my point.

Age is pretty much irrelevant in the 18-32 range, because if you’re good enough, you’re old enough. However, we tend to use it to talk about “potential” into a player’s 20s, by which time he should both be showing his quality AND fully understanding his development track with the club.

Alas, at the top, top clubs, there’s only room for a few “potential” players in the First Team squad, and their place is warming the bench with the occasional cameo where they need to stake their claim. Divine is currently one player that City seem to be having a good look at with the team at the moment, to see if his ability, plus his size and strength, can make the step up in speed of thought and game tempo.

If these “players with potential” can’t do it over the course of a season or two, or feel like they deserve more opportunities to play, then they’re usually shipped out. Clubs appear willing to pay for both their clear football development at City and the knowledge that the player must be level-headed enough to have been given the chance to be at City in the first place.
 
Sheikh rattle and roll said:
What do we now need at City ? We’ve regressed due to various reasons and need to have leading players who make a difference now
Otherwise how long before the likes of Haaland Foden and Gvardiol want to lea
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I am not sure where you are coming from because we are 10 points up on the PL position we were in this time last season. Most blues I know are very confident at the moment. You don't seem to be. Get Rodri back to his former self and we can win titles. Semenyo makes that even more likely.
 
Marvin. said:
I am not sure where you are coming from because we are 10 points up on the PL position we were in this time last season. Most blues I know are very confident at the moment. You don't seem to be. Get Rodri back to his former self and we can win titles. Semenyo makes that even more likely.
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I am very confident check out my title prediction I’ve always said we win it
I’m now sure Bobb is the new messiah some believe he is
We need goals from the wings like we had with Sterling Mahrez and Sane
 
Marvin. said:
I am not sure where you are coming from because we are 10 points up on the PL position we were in this time last season. Most blues I know are very confident at the moment. You don't seem to be. Get Rodri back to his former self and we can win titles. Semenyo makes that even more likely.
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To compare last year is farcical that was a perfect storm and you know it
How we doing compared with the seasons we won it ? Perhaps compare us with the 100 point year ?
 
ChicagoBlue said:
Indeed. I agree and it illustrates my point.

Age is pretty much irrelevant in the 18-32 range, because if you’re good enough, you’re old enough. However, we tend to use it to talk about “potential” into a player’s 20s, by which time he should both be showing his quality AND fully understanding his development track with the club.

Alas, at the top, top clubs, there’s only room for a few “potential” players in the First Team squad, and their place is warming the bench with the occasional cameo where they need to stake their claim. Divine is currently one player that City seem to be having a good look at with the team at the moment, to see if his ability, plus his size and strength, can make the step up in speed of thought and game tempo.

If these “players with potential” can’t do it over the course of a season or two, or feel like they deserve more opportunities to play, then they’re usually shipped out. Clubs appear willing to pay for both their clear football development at City and the knowledge that the player must be level-headed enough to have been given the chance to be at City in the first place.
Click to expand...
PSG and Barca have a handful of remarkable young stars but when you are building a team you can't always buy a superstar, sometime you identify players who you think will be there in 1-2 years. That seems to have worked in the case of Doku but in Savinho's case, he hasn't progressed yet.
 
Marvin. said:
Marmoush hasn't played because Haaland is incredible and this season Doku has emerged as a top player. The space for Marmoush has disappeared. I've felt all season that we need to work out how to get more out of Marmoush but if Semenyo signs it will look even more difficult for him.

I find some of the comments about Savinho and Bobb disappointing. Semenyo is a better right sided player in this moment but he's 25 years old. These players are at different stages in their development. What would Semenyo have looked like at 21?
Click to expand...
Wasnt Semenyo playing for Bristol City at 21.

You look at the goals Marmoush has scored against Newcastle, Chelsea & to a lesser extent Brighton, hes had space to run into. He has struggled when playing on the last line of defence & timing the his run to beat the offside. He has been unlucky with the timing of his injury because Doku has gone up a level & Foden is back to his best in what used to be called inside forward on the left.

I see him more as a 2nd striker playing off Haaland & hopefully after Afcon he gets more game time as we'll be playing every 3 days
 
Marvin. said:
PSG and Barca have a handful of remarkable young stars but when you are building a team you can't always buy a superstar, sometime you identify players who you think will be there in 1-2 years. That seems to have worked in the case of Doku but in Savinho's case, he hasn't progressed yet.
Click to expand...
Where do I say you always need a superstar ?
In fact I would suggest that Seymenyo isn’t a superstar ( he’s not Rodrygo or Vinny) he is an improvement and one I feel we need
The difference is in this league players don’t seem to want to wait for their time
Bobb and Savinho have had a taste of first team football so obviously want minutes which we can’t guarantee if Semenyo comes in
 
Sheikh rattle and roll said:
Where do I say you always need a superstar ?
In fact I would suggest that Seymenyo isn’t a superstar ( he’s not Rodrygo or Vinny) he is an improvement and one I feel we need
The difference is in this league players don’t seem to want to wait for their time
Bobb and Savinho have had a taste of first team football so obviously want minutes which we can’t guarantee if Semenyo comes in
Click to expand...
funny idea of a superstar
 
Marvin. said:
PSG and Barca have a handful of remarkable young stars but when you are building a team you can't always buy a superstar, sometime you identify players who you think will be there in 1-2 years. That seems to have worked in the case of Doku but in Savinho's case, he hasn't progressed yet.
Click to expand...
Barca also have their B team, which helps to keep hold of some of the late developing kids.
 
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