Champions League with Pep

[FrankSwift1]

Without looking at the records how often have the most successful clubs in the CL actually won it?

Do they average a much higher win rate than once every 10 years?

I was looking at this way. 127 completed top flight seasons in England. Most people will accept that then league winners are the best team that season. Only 13 league and cup doubles. So about 1 in 10 years the best team wins

 

[Rhapsody in Blue]

It’s a complete different mindset in Europe as it’s two-legged. Benitez/Emery have all done great in Europe without doing very well in domestic leagues. Ancelotti probably best example on someone that can handle both. Pep, let’s be honest, didn’t do well in Europe with arguably three of the best teams there has been. It just seems like one of very few flaws. This excites me with Enzo and I think we’ll do well.

 

[jimharri]

Without looking at the records how often have the most successful clubs in the CL actually won it?

Do they average a much higher win rate than once every 10 years?

It's been in existence for 70 seasons (1955/56 was the first season). Real Madrid have won it 15 times, far ahead of any other club. AC Milan with 7, dips and Bayern with 6 and Barca with 5 complete the top 5. Crazy that Madrid have won it better than once every 5 years.

Most titles | History | UEFA Champions League

22 clubs have won the UEFA Champions League/European Cup. Check out the full list, how many titles each side has and who they beat in the final(s).

www.uefa.com

 

[Tommy_Catons_Perm]

City were the first English team to win the Treble as defending league champions.

It doesn't seem right to me that the champions league can won by teams that are not champions. If Arsenal had won it last week it would have a lesser achievement as they were not defending English league champions.

The 2019 final was contested by two teams, Liverpool and Spurs, that had not been champions for a combined 70 years.

City won the perfect champions league, as champions, thrashing Real Madrid and Bayern Munich in the KO stages with a professional 1-0 victory in the final. With the Treble as well it does not get better than that.

 

[Heartofoakes64]

City were the first English team to win the Treble as defending league champions.

It doesn't seem right to me that the champions league can won by teams that are not champions. If Arsenal had won it last week it would have a lesser achievement as they were not defending English league champions.

The 2019 final was contested by two teams, Liverpool and Spurs, that had not been champions for a combined 70 years.

City won the perfect champions league, as champions, thrashing Real Madrid and Bayern Munich in the KO stages with a professional 1-0 victory in the final. With the Treble as well it does not get better than that.

Excellent post

 

[adr2.8i]

im happy with one, its one more than id thought id ever see us win!
i said the same when we won the fa cup, and i said it again when we won the title with the agueroooo moment.

yes we should/could have won it more times but one is still better than 99% of other fans who will never get one.
im eternally grateful for one. :-)

 

[PeterBarnesShorts]

….won it whilst completing the 3 titles on the bounce too!F’kin tremendous achievement that gets ignored like all the rest.

City were the first English team to win the Treble as defending league champions.

It doesn't seem right to me that the champions league can won by teams that are not champions. If Arsenal had won it last week it would have a lesser achievement as they were not defending English league champions.

The 2019 final was contested by two teams, Liverpool and Spurs, that had not been champions for a combined 70 years.

City won the perfect champions league, as champions, thrashing Real Madrid and Bayern Munich in the KO stages with a professional 1-0 victory in the final. With the Treble as well it does not get better than that

 

[DMA's]

Re the game in Porto. I don’t put the blame solely on Pep. I vividly remember the players looking absolutely terrified in the tunnel and thinking to myself oh shit.

It’s rare you win your first final in the champions league. On top of that Rodri wasn’t the player he was today and Gundo had played as a 6 many times before for us.

I just think the players choked that day tbh

 

[LeonardoDaVnci]

The Chelsea one stings because it's the game where Pep completely fucked it IMO. The team and system were perfectly setup and he moved everything to get Sterling into the team.

Even the players by all accounts were baffled when they heard the line up.

In others we were unlucky but that's just knockout football.

For the record, we finished that season with 19 points more than chelsea. I can't get over that nightmare in Porto. Still think Rudiger taking out Kev was the most significant reason we blew it.

After thought. The key thing for me re the team selection was how much of a surprise was it to OUR starting 11 ? Trying to surprise the opposition is one thing but throwing your own team a curve ball would be ridiculous, thats IF Pep did that. You would like to think they had a few sessions with the final 11 to prep it. Maybe one day someone will blab....

 

[Didsbury Dave]

Re the game in Porto. I don’t put the blame solely on Pep. I vividly remember the players looking absolutely terrified in the tunnel and thinking to myself oh shit.

It’s rare you win your first final in the champions league. On top of that Rodri wasn’t the player he was today and Gundo had played as a 6 many times before for us.

I just think the players choked that day tbh

Totally agree with this. Even the way they were blasting balls at each other in the rondo felt nervy. Don't forget we lost Kev too, and didn't have a striker. We had a miles better team than Chelsea and Gundo had done well in a holding role earlier in the season. I was surprised to see the team but trusted Pep and I think it is far too simplistic to blame that defeat on one decision.

 

[Lee the Blue]

is only 1 win in 10 years with pep in the champions league an ok return
or should have we done better?

Possibly but Ill take the one we have got.

Bernardo's exit interview very telling and saw things very similar to Id wager how many Blues view it; In 2021 we were the best team in europe but played a stinker of a final; in 2022 freaky things happended in Madrid to knock us out in a wild SF 2nd leg but again we were arguably the best team in europe; in 2023 we proved we were and won it. In 2024 Bernardo argues again that we were arguably the best team in europe but fluffed the QF with Real. We had the lead and lost it in the Bernabeu, then KDB missed a sitter at 1-1 at our place in the final minutes of normal time in the 2nd leg that wouldve won the tie. Ultimately we lost on pens and Real's celebrations told you they knew how key it was - the winner of that tie was always going to go on and win the tournament and they duly did so.

As Bernardo again pointed out, the ounces of luck or balls bouncing your way that you need often went our way in the Premier League between 2018-2024, whereas in the CL they largely went against us. In the period 2020/21 to 2023/24 I felt we were the best team in Europe and possibly shouldve won more than 1 CL but it is what it is - weve had our wildest dreams exceeded so it feels churlish to moan about it.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

Possibly but Ill take the one we have got.

Bernardo's exit interview very telling and saw things very similar to Id wager how many Blues view it; In 2021 we were the best team in europe but played a stinker of a final; in 2022 freaky things happended in Madrid to knock us out in a wild SF 2nd leg but again we were arguably the best team in europe; in 2023 we proved we were and won it. In 2024 Bernardo argues again that we were arguably the best team in europe but fluffed the QF with Real. We had the lead and lost it in the Bernabeu, then KDB missed a sitter at 1-1 at our place in the final minutes of normal time in the 2nd leg that wouldve won the tie. Ultimately we lost on pens and Real's celebrations told you they knew how key it was - the winner of that tie was always going to go on and win the tournament and they duly did so.

As Bernardo again pointed out, the ounces of luck or balls bouncing your way that you need often went our way in the Premier League between 2018-2024, whereas in the CL they largely went against us. In the period 2020/21 to 2023/24 I felt we were the best team in Europe and possibly shouldve won more than 1 CL but it is what it is - weve had our wildest dreams exceeded so it feels churlish to moan about it.

I haven't seen the Bernado interview but I agree with every point there. I actually think we were the best team in Europe from the centurian's season until the 4 in a row team.

 

[Bez]

is only 1 win in 10 years with pep in the champions league an ok return
or should have we done better?

Good question. There's a lot of luck involved for the team that eventually wins it. Lots of good teams in the Chumps League effectively cancel each other out so all it takes is one ref decision for or against or a lucky deflection and this can be the difference to winning or going out. Pep's tactics always vulnerable to a smash and grab/counter attack and we've come unstuck because of this in specific games e.g. Lyon. That said, 2 finals and a semi final in 10 years is very good going when you consider how good the opposition teams are, particularly once you get to the QF stage.

 

[Alfie Budd]

It's a competition with a huge amount of variables and notoriously difficult to get yourselves over the line.

Bayern Munich is a good example. Undoubtedly one of the European elite and perennial contenders for the CL. In the last 13 seasons (first three of those with Pep in charge) they've won one CL and not reached another final. During that time they've exited at the semi final stage on six occasions and five times in the quarter finals. They've been consistently excellent but have had the misfortune to run into a truly exceptional team more than once and not have the rub of the green a few other times.

If every single thing fails to fall into place, you're not winning the CL. I'm delighted that we've managed to do it once.

 

[levets]

Re the game in Porto. I don’t put the blame solely on Pep. I vividly remember the players looking absolutely terrified in the tunnel and thinking to myself oh shit.

It’s rare you win your first final in the champions league. On top of that Rodri wasn’t the player he was today and Gundo had played as a 6 many times before for us.

I just think the players choked that day tbh

A fuck up for their goal. Foden had a great chance and should have scored. We should have had a penalty chasing the game when James hand balled a shot. Mahrez volleyed wide and high in the last minute when he should have scored. We should have won!

 

[bluegaz13]

Being really honest I think we did underachieve in the Champions league and some of that was undoubtedly strange team or formation selection…..however 20 trophies overall is not to be sniffed at and I wouldn’t swap any one premiership win for a champions league win.

The Chelsea final is the obvious one when Pep shoehorned Sterling into the starting line up at the expense of Rodri……and this seasons line up in Madrid, although even if we had got through that round, we were never good enough to win
the tournament.

I really thought we would dominate the competition after the win in Istanbul but we were probably not ruthless enough in replacing some of the legends a season earlier.

 

[i kne albert davy]

is only 1 win in 10 years with pep in the champions league an ok return
or should have we done better?

It felt pretty good that night in Istanbul.

 

[hilts]

From 1992 - 2014 Bacon won 2 times in 22 years*. Took him 7 years to win it, took Pep the same. That is a comparable like for like, so I'll go along with it.


*Both absolute shite performances - they were outplayed for 90 mins v Bayern and the woodwork saved them. And John fucking Terry gave them the 2nd win.

And in fairness the piss can got grief for being average in Europe, it took the silly twat an age to realise 4 4 2 English ball wouldn't be cutting it. And you're right they were battered by bayern and Terry missed that opportunity.

Saying another manager struggled in Europe doesnt really make any difference to how Pep did though.

 

[Corky]

Re the game in Porto. I don’t put the blame solely on Pep. I vividly remember the players looking absolutely terrified in the tunnel and thinking to myself oh shit.

It’s rare you win your first final in the champions league. On top of that Rodri wasn’t the player he was today and Gundo had played as a 6 many times before for us.

I just think the players choked that day tbh

Not it isn't.

It is 45.4%. Before the Liverpool v Spurs final it was 52.6%

Nothing suggests there is a significant disadvantage playing a first final. Tuchel's Chelsea beat City 3 times in 2 months, strange choices every game for City.

 

[SWP COME HOME!!]

that Chelsea final still haunts me especially how nothing remained of that Chelsea side even by 2023 let alone today. most of that Chelsea squad was bought 2019 onwards. while we slowly built towards our CL trophy and took Pep the 7th season to win it Tuchel took over in January and delivered in 5 months.

we are absolute due to somehow win CL when there are 5-6 better sides out there but somehow with lucky draw we get to final and maybe playing worse but nick the win. rarely happens to us as we always seem to draw Real who knows how to beat us even if they have a bad season.
so odd as I only recall facing Bayern once in KO stages (22/23) since takeover while we met Real a lot.

other than that final Rodri, Dinho, Kun all benched:(, the eliminations vs Lyon, Spurs also hurt as neither won it and after Spurs we would have had an Ajax side to beat to reach final.

fair to say that in this 10 years given we were top2 sides in Europe for large part of it maybe could have done better in CL. like PSG when they are on top they won it back to back, also lost a final vs Bayern.

CL is hard, no guarantee we even do a final next 10 seasons. Maresca has never managed in CL, for him the level of pressure and tactical difference will be a shock. getting into good form at the right time and avoid injuries and red cards for crucial games and stay calm can get you very far tho.

dippers won in 2019 but has not looked close to get into final since.
Chelsea won it in 2021 again has not even got close since.
Barcelona last final was in 2015. close to another last season.
Arse had last time got into final 20 years ago.

hope we take ultra serious the league stage and that can help with the KO draws. Arse finished 1st in league stage and had to beat Leverkusen then Sporting to reach semis while for us it was a route of Real then Bayern, sick difference...
not worth it given how hard to manage these extra hard games in March/April in return so you can relax few players vs Lverkusen and Bodo in league stage.

Dippers were in the final in 2022, we’d have played them in Paris if we’d held onto the 2 goal lead we had in Madrid for a few more minutes.

And Maresca looked pretty chilled on the sideline after Chelsea scored their third at home to Barcelona in last seasons Champions League group stage.