75 years ago today (Hiroshima bomb)

[Ancient Citizen]

What of the Allied fire-bombing of Dresden in Feb 1945, when tens of thousands of civilians were roasted alive, just to crush the spirit of German resistance, when there was no strategic or military objective to be gained other than a show of force. Morally it was at least as bad as Hiroshima, though the implications for future wars were perhaps less far-reaching.
No wonder Bomber Harris is not everyone's hero.

As you said, it was about crushing German resistance, which was still very
strong amongst the populace, war is brutal and nasty, and this was total war,
resistance had to be totally crushed. That is, and it was then, a military objective,
the Germans had no compunction roasting thousands alive with the Blitz on London,
the devastation of Coventry, cities like Manchester, Liverpool, and plenty more, all
targeted.
The Germans knew after Dresden, that Britain would intensify attacks, Bomber Harris
at the time, and to most now, was lauded, morale is a powerful tool, he destroyed
that for most of the German population, and hastened the end.

 

[FCBarca]

Good read

 

[Blue_eyes]

Both sides of the argument can be convincingly presented, but the Japanese were no innocent bystander in the arena of war crimes. Their raping of some chinese cities was apalling, choosing to murder with swords to save ammo and glorifying in it. This period in history was arguably humankinds darkest hour. It is now down to us as the products of the course that history took, to learn from it and use the knowledge gained to improve for the future generations.Dragging up previous generations actions to use to incite blame/hatred achieves nothing, maybe a lesson was learned, the use of nuclear weapons is pointless given the numbers now involved, their shadow has kept the superpowers from worldwide conflict since. Lets pray that we can find peace that lasts long after mistakes are forgotten.

 

[flook]

This is obviously a very complex and still very emotive subject, was the first bomb a warranted action despite the huge number of civilian deaths, to prevent even more deaths should the conventional war continue via invasion to its logical conclusion? I'd argue it was, but I wouldn't want to have been involved in its sanction.

Was the second bomb warranted is more contentious, the argument for is as I've linked to above in that there was no surrender after the first bomb and elements at least of the Japanese leadership advocated continuing the war in the hope of a negotiated settlement brought about by large allied losses (at the cost no doubt of incredible Japanese civilian and military deaths). This argument supports the view that the bombs actually saved lives.

The argument against is the short time between the first and second bombs allowed little time for diplomacy to succeed. Thrown into the mix is the well documented Japanese mistreatment of PoW's many of whom were American, which may go some way to explaining, along with the experimental aspects, the American "enthusiasm" for the second bomb.

 

[nick750]

My Farther was in the Royal Navy on destroyers during WW2 and was protecting Australia from invasion of the japs, after they dropped the two bombs they cruised to japan and had shore leave to Hiroshima just said he went and never talked about it ! lived until he was in his 80s never got to see the success of MCFC.

 

[Innsbruckblue]

What of the Allied fire-bombing of Dresden in Feb 1945, when tens of thousands of civilians were roasted alive, just to crush the spirit of German resistance, when there was no strategic or military objective to be gained other than a show of force. Morally it was at least as bad as Hiroshima, though the implications for future wars were perhaps less far-reaching.
No wonder Bomber Harris is not everyone's hero.

Trust me, at the time, lots of German military production had been moved to the DD area. Their arrogance assumed it was too far for Allied planes to reach. Bombing the Altstadt was unnecessary, I agree, and most of the strategic targets were missed or hidden, but to say that DD had no military importance was propaganda cooked up by the occupying Soviet forces. I used to live there and did some research on this while there.

 

[inbetween]

Japan wasn't a peaceful nation prior to the bombs being dropped on them. It had invaded countries even before WWII & it was brutal by any standards. Judging Japan then and Japan now is pointless navel gazing. The atomic bombs cost lots of Japanese lives but saved at least as many in occupied countries and in Allied troops lives.

Japan massacred 200,000+ in Nanjing, attacked the US/Pearl Harbor without any declaration of war, invaded the USSR, attacked British Hong Kong and Malaysia.

There may be a legality question but I have no doubt about the morality question, the bombs were a price they brought upon themselves.

By today's standards it's horrific but from the standards at the time when there are 1 million+ dead, I'd drop it twice!

The pacifists and the left won't like it but the US and USSR really did save the world in that decade.

 

[shevtheblue]

The Atomic Bomb is one of the worst things man has ever created. The famous quote from Oppenheimer “Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds” just says it all, apparently he held that remorse till he passed away. But it's also likely he did not feel remorse for Hiroshima, mores so about what they had created and the potential of it to create a nuclear war. We are so far down the line now that its impossible to disarm every nuke, a harrowing thought.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

The Atomic Bomb is one of the worst things man has ever created. The famous quote from Oppenheimer “Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds” just says it all, apparently he held that remorse till he passed away. But it's also likely he did not feel remorse for Hiroshima, mores so about what they had created and the potential of it to create a nuclear war. We are so far down the line now that its impossible to disarm every nuke, a harrowing thought.

Also worth remembering that despite living in fear of the Soviets, Iran, China or north Korea for most of our lives only one nation has been bonkers enough to ever use this weapon in anger - the same one that has used the fear of others doing so as a pretext for all sorts of shit over the years.

 

[Man_City_Loyal]

Question: How soon after the bomb dropped did the railway in Hiroshima re-open?
Answer: The next day! Amazing.

christ we have leave on the line over here and the lines are shut for days