A question for those who think corruption is happening.

UUBlue said:
It is a conspiracy of incompetence borne out of fear of Ferguson. Make a mistake against United and get criticised by him for days. Then your refereeing CV says you can't handle the big teams / games. None of them want that so they go out of their way not to upset him, inadvertently giving United every advantage they don't deserve.
Receive some stick from Holloway and everyone laughs and forgets a day later when he goes on air singing a song to one of his players.
How many points have they gained (I nearly said 'won' there) this season from dodgy decisions? Well three on Tuesday as they would have found it hard to come back from 3-0. Plus those Neville decisions. Rooney getting away with foul and abusive language every game ad infinitum. How many lost? Just two - Birmingham away.
Maybe the refs aren't being paid off, but they live in fear of Ferguson and that affects their performance.
Refereeing United isn't the be all and end all, far from it. Spurs V Arsenal, Arsenal v Chelsea, Chelsea v us..... they're all just as big games as some random game v United. Only a soft **** would be 'scared' of an aged, alcoholic, blue-nosed fuckwit. What is there to be 'scared' of? If people can be that weak they shiver in bed for days after receiving a bit of stick from a manager, they are in the wrong job. Thats why I don't think it happens as much as people are making out, and it certainly doesn't happen just in favour of United. Everyone gets a wrong decision both for and against them, including United. I think if we supported I don't know, err, Fulham for example, we, (or I should say those who do), wouldn't notice it as much but because its our derby team and an element of hatred is there, people think they notice things more for them than any other team. Thats how I see it anyway, which i'm 100% sure many will disagree with!
 
Pigeonho said:
UUBlue said:
It is a conspiracy of incompetence borne out of fear of Ferguson. Make a mistake against United and get criticised by him for days. Then your refereeing CV says you can't handle the big teams / games. None of them want that so they go out of their way not to upset him, inadvertently giving United every advantage they don't deserve.
Receive some stick from Holloway and everyone laughs and forgets a day later when he goes on air singing a song to one of his players.
How many points have they gained (I nearly said 'won' there) this season from dodgy decisions? Well three on Tuesday as they would have found it hard to come back from 3-0. Plus those Neville decisions. Rooney getting away with foul and abusive language every game ad infinitum. How many lost? Just two - Birmingham away.
Maybe the refs aren't being paid off, but they live in fear of Ferguson and that affects their performance.
Refereeing United isn't the be all and end all, far from it. Spurs V Arsenal, Arsenal v Chelsea, Chelsea v us..... they're all just as big games as some random game v United. Only a soft **** would be 'scared' of an aged, alcoholic, blue-nosed fuckwit. What is there to be 'scared' of? If people can be that weak they shiver in bed for days after receiving a bit of stick from a manager, they are in the wrong job. Thats why I don't think it happens as much as people are making out, and it certainly doesn't happen just in favour of United. Everyone gets a wrong decision both for and against them, including United. I think if we supported I don't know, err, Fulham for example, we, (or I should say those who do), wouldn't notice it as much but because its our derby team and an element of hatred is there, people think they notice things more for them than any other team. Thats how I see it anyway, which i'm 100% sure many will disagree with!

As expected I disagree 100% with you Pigeonho.
 
SuperKevinHorlock said:
Pigeonho said:
Refereeing United isn't the be all and end all, far from it. Spurs V Arsenal, Arsenal v Chelsea, Chelsea v us..... they're all just as big games as some random game v United. Only a soft **** would be 'scared' of an aged, alcoholic, blue-nosed fuckwit. What is there to be 'scared' of? If people can be that weak they shiver in bed for days after receiving a bit of stick from a manager, they are in the wrong job. Thats why I don't think it happens as much as people are making out, and it certainly doesn't happen just in favour of United. Everyone gets a wrong decision both for and against them, including United. I think if we supported I don't know, err, Fulham for example, we, (or I should say those who do), wouldn't notice it as much but because its our derby team and an element of hatred is there, people think they notice things more for them than any other team. Thats how I see it anyway, which i'm 100% sure many will disagree with!

As expected I disagree 100% with you Pigeonho.
Are you sure its not just 99.9%? ;-) Fair do's to you.
 
Blue Mooner said:
Clearly, this isn't blatant corruption, this isn't backhanders and games actually being 'fixed' in the sense that the outcome is pre-ordained for the rags before the ball is kicked, I think anyone who believes that is misguided. Plus, for that to go uncovered for 20 years I would think nigh on impossible.

That said anyone who can't see the blatantly obvious bias when it is in their face are the ones in denial. Clearly, as someone stated earlier, those in positions of power at the Premier League equate the success of the biggest club in the Premiership with the success of the Premier League. As long as that is the case they will continue to get favoured. Those on the payroll of the FA and Premier League are under no illusions what is 'required' in order to retain their status and job - whether that be as a referee or a pundit. It doesn't need to be explicit or written down, it is surreptitious and done by cause and effect, poor decisions against the rags get punished and demotions result, conversely what are viewed as good refereeing performances that help the rags are rewarded. Howard Webb anybody ? World cup referee and now MBE - 4 penalties in 6 games for the rags.

It’s interesting that those who seem to wish to deny any bias will quote our 'luck' against Blackpool and Chelsea's incorrect 'goal' against the rags in some way of justification but that's about the sum total of what they can come up with. No one is denying that at some point in some game in a season you are going to have a decision go in your favour that turns out to be wrong. That is because referees in the 'normal' course of their duties get decisions wrong. Perhaps the ref in the Chelsea game believed that the decision was correct and to deny the 'goal' would have been too blatant a case of bias? The sending off of Rafael (bear in mind this was their first of the season and with only 15 mins left ffs) is a case in point, the furore that followed and over the top criticism will make any ref think twice about making that kind of decision in the future. Fair enough, the second booking was harsh but you could see why it was seen as a booking as at first hand it looked like a professional foul and he was lucky not to have been sent off for the first challenge anyway.

Compare that with the litany of major game changing decisions that go in the rags favour season in season out. Off the top of my head just this season
Rat boy against West Brom - blatant sending off
Rat boy against Stoke - blatant sending off
2 sendings off vs Wigan
Nani hand ball 'goal' against Spurs when everybody could see it should be a free kick to spurs
Blatant penalty at 2-0 versus Blackpool
Brum, Sunderland and Blackburn all concede within 5 mins at OT managed by Bruce, McCleish and Allardyce – enough said !To my mind its only those games when the rags are struggling that they seem to get a helping hand, if the rags are on top anyway then there is no need for the ref to try and swing things in their favour. Don’t think I haven’t questioned my own paranoia, season after season I’ve put it down to my blue tinted specs – the spurs ‘goal’ that went over the line, the six minutes of injury time against us, Mascherano sending off, the Lille quick free kick that Giggs took when the goalie wasn’t ready – its always the rags that seem to have these ‘ridiculous’ decisions go in their favour then the media spend the whole evening justifying it.

The above games I’ve mentioned where the refs decisions have had a direct impact could mean the rags 11 points worse offthan they are and back in the chasing pack. That wouldn't be so bad if the above decisions were offset by poor decisions against them - the only one I can think of is Brum, again continually used as some kind of proof that it’s all fair and above board. Maybe at the time the ref saw no way he could disallow it and to have done so would have caused too much of a storm. These are the sort of things that refs have to contend with.

Lets not forget the Fergie Sycophants identified above who will roll over and play dead for Fergie at OT like Bruce, Allardyce, McCleish, Pulis and to a certain extent Martinez all Fergie lap dogs who all just let their teams be steamrollered at OT. They don’t do the same at home because they have a stadium full of home fans to please.However, there’s also the more subtle things that people don’t notice, that don’t make the headlines and are easily forgotten - booking specific players who then have to watch themselves the whole game for fear of a sending off, fouls given when they shouldn’t be, free-kicks given in dangerous positions, shirt pulling in the penalty box going unpunished, its all very subtle but can help to swing a result in the rags favour - I see it time and again.

Of course, I wouldn’t be foolish enough to deny that in many games the rags are good enough to win games without any 'interference' from the ref but in all of the above games when the rags are struggling (ok they were beating Spurs but the game was finely balanced) they always get the helping hand they need whether that be disallowed goals, slight offside goals given, opposition player sent off, dodgy penalties, overly generous additional minutes (who could forget the infamous 6 minutes!) I've witnessed them all over the years. Such is the fine line between success and failure it is these half a dozen or so games a season that change the season in the rags favour.

The other thing you will notice is the timing of games to suit the rags, Fergie was able to rest a quarter of his team before the game against Blackpool and the game was on the Tuesday, why not the Wednesday, giving Blackpool an extra day to recover ? Is it any surprise that Blackpool looked dead on their feet and all the goals came in the last 15 minutes ? I’ve also noticed the same thing against Birmingham and Stoke. Weekend game followed by playing a smaller team with a smaller squad on the Tuesday giving them less time to recover against a rotated and refreshed rags team.

The league may not be fixed but there is no doubt in my mind that the rags are favoured and the number of decisions that seem to go in their favour cannot be pure coincidence it will be generally recognised by referees that favouring the rags gets rewarded and not doing so results in punishment, demotion and possible loss of earnings. If that was your job and livelihood what do you think you would do ?

About time somebody hit the nail on the head. Bang on BM, well done. Sometimes I think theres more rags on here than us.
I can only add to your thoughts here mate and tell you about a couple of things that I now for a fact.

I work closely with Lancashire authority and get involved in all sorts of things. First that Blackpool game you talked about. A man I know personlly was involved with the original date of the game. He thinks it was odd when the game was called off and also found it odd that he was not allowed to get into to the ground to see the pitch for himself. He only saw pictures of the pitch with snow on it. Anyone who nows anything about cgi will now what went on here. He even tried to go to the top of the tower to get a picture but the bastards no doubt run by an OOT rag had closed the top that day. Would have been good to see the truth behind it all is what he was saying. Also aparently the met office knew about the snow from as early as july when the fixtures came out.

On to the old boys network thing now mate. Again i have it from close up that allerdyce even went as far as asking dunn and robinson to swap positions. he reckoned they look like each other and nobody would notice. As you say BM they cant do it at home cos of the fans but most people in blackburn havnt got tellys and there away support is shite so he nearly got away with it. luckily the new owners at blackburn are too new to be part of the whole set-up and they got wind of it all. Thats why the **** was sacked and yet still the papers dont see fit to pront the truth. Even the players let these things go on. Makes me mad.

This is why non of the big clubs will ever appoint ex rags to be managers. How can they?
 
Are you really saying Allardyce asked Dunne to play in goal against United to help them win? And that you know this as a fact and this led to his sacking?
 
friend said:
Are you really saying Allardyce asked Dunne to play in goal against United to help them win? And that you know this as a fact and this led to his sacking?

Mate im not saying he didnt just ask him..im saying he did play in goal. youtube it if you dont believe me. as BM says ex rags roll over for taggart and we need people like blue moon to take this info to the masses.
 
Ayone who thinks that Far Eastern individuals and criminal syndicates will risk betting millions of dollars on results then leave those results to chance is seriously naive or deluded.

These are the same people who brutally murdered two students in Newcastle who they suspected of ripping them off.
 
About time somebody hit the nail on the head. Bang on BM, well done. Sometimes I think theres more rags on here than us.
I can only add to your thoughts here mate and tell you about a couple of things that I now for a fact.

I work closely with Lancashire authority and get involved in all sorts of things. First that Blackpool game you talked about. A man I know personlly was involved with the original date of the game. He thinks it was odd when the game was called off and also found it odd that he was not allowed to get into to the ground to see the pitch for himself. He only saw pictures of the pitch with snow on it. Anyone who nows anything about cgi will now what went on here. He even tried to go to the top of the tower to get a picture but the bastards no doubt run by an OOT rag had closed the top that day. Would have been good to see the truth behind it all is what he was saying. Also aparently the met office knew about the snow from as early as july when the fixtures came out.

On to the old boys network thing now mate. Again i have it from close up that allerdyce even went as far as asking dunn and robinson to swap positions. he reckoned they look like each other and nobody would notice. As you say BM they cant do it at home cos of the fans but most people in blackburn havnt got tellys and there away support is shite so he nearly got away with it. luckily the new owners at blackburn are too new to be part of the whole set-up and they got wind of it all. Thats why the **** was sacked and yet still the papers dont see fit to pront the truth. Even the players let these things go on. Makes me mad.

This is why non of the big clubs will ever appoint ex rags to be managers. How can they?

Oh dear
 
Johnsonontheleft said:
friend said:
Does anyone think City have ever benefited from any of these 'corrupt' decisions/FA?

We've benefited from poor refereeing decisions yes, but generally not from FA hearings. The only one I can think of was Tevez after last season's derby, but they let both him AND Neville off.

Off the top of my head,

Evans, Vidic, Scholes, Rooney, Neville, Ferdinand, Rafael have all escaped nailed on 3 match bans because the FA, after studying video evidence, with Fergie presumably on conference call, have decided to take no action.

Mate, seriously give your head a check. You're so intent on picking at little holes you're not seeing the bigger picture. How many times have Gerrard, Terry, Cole, Fabregas, Van Persie etc etc got away with "nailed on 3 match bans"

All well and good when you're trying to make up "conspiracies" to get wound up over.
 

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