kaz7
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That is so cruel
Animal rebellion
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urban genie
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Rarely happens and is a catering myth, you hypnotise them first and put them in a trace, or stick a knife in their head to kill them prior to boiling/steaming
mexico1970
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Yeah, was talking more of random cunts being cruel just for fun, if people are eating animals they shouldn't be cruel to the animals before they are killed for food.
In general I am against cruel cunts.
Bill Walker
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Not in SE Asia or China they don't.
Alan Harper's Tash
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Dressed as David Bowie?
Bill Walker
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That's a bit Low.
urban genie
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Illegal here I think now, tbh I haven't had to kill a lobster for over 10 yrs now, doubt I would do it nowadays
GoatersLeftShin
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For the last four years of my career I had to teach Environmental Ethics.
This was not an area of ethics that used to inspire me. But I always do a lot of additional reading for any topic, as stumbling across an additional idea or perspective that is not in any of the A level textbooks can advantage students if it finds its way into their examination answering. Time and again, I have seen the evidence that they get additional credit and sometimes higher grades, as you can get their scripts back from the board.
Had a very bright student who was involved with ER from the outset. In one of her essays she took Roger Scruton apart, specifically his book Green Philosophy. I even thought of trying to get this piece of work published as an article in Philosophy Now magazine.
Unsurprisingly, she ended up at Oxford. But this was well before the time when ER started to glue themselves to things, prevent people from getting to see their dying relatives in a hospital, pouring shit over statues and so on, all the things that are alienating people from their cause.
I would be amazed if she had remained as an activist. The only reason that I am mentioning her is to correct the impression that all those who are concerned about climate change are militantly stupid.
As a result of all that reading, I have also come to the conclusion that - after the Ukraine-Russia conflict - climate change is the biggest problem facing humanity. Again that doesn't mean that I sympathise with ER. In fact, this thread is all about how counter-productive their methods are proving to be in terms of getting people onside with their cause.
It's a shame though, as going back several years, there were protesters who went about things differently. Unfortunately, Cheat Neutral no longer exists. But they found an amusing, non-confrontational way to get across their objections to Emissions Trading.
As far as animal rights are concerned, well I am still a carnivore. But also almost certainly a moral hypocrite. You end up like that after you read Peter Singer.
Singer is especially famous for championing the cause of animal rights and the claim that we are speciesists in our treatment of animals. Speciesism for Singer happens when we allow the frequently trivial preferences of our own species to override the more weighty preferences of another species.
For example, when shopping for food, most of us would prefer to buy cheap food that tastes good. But if that food is an animal product, in making our purchase we have not taken into account the preference an animal may have for not suffering when they are alive (as often happens as a result of intensive farming) and dying prematurely.
For Jeremy Bentham (a pre-Victorian thinker who was one of the first Western philosophers to suggest that animals were morally significant significance, as he put it, “The question is not, "Can they reason?" nor, "Can they talk?" but "Can they suffer?”
Singer is very much a part of the tradition of utilitarianism and agrees with Bentham’s view. He also introduces the notion of personhood into his version of utilitarianism. For Singer, a person is a being that can value its own existence and knows that it has a future. He argues that many animals are persons in this sense, and research into animal awareness suggests that he is right. For example, chimpanzees have been taught ASL (American Sign Language) and have exhibited linguistic skills that approximate to those of a human child of around two years of age.
Singer is controversial for several reasons:
Anyway, I think I have probably typed enough by now to give readers of this post something to think about.
- He regards speciesism as being as immoral as racism. For example, in old American south, a white slave owner’s preference for profit and cheap labour were allowed to override the preference of black slaves to be free. For Singer, this example is morally equivalent to the example of the food shopper given above.
- He considers unborn foetuses and young babies to lack personhood, which makes abortion and even infanticide morally acceptable for him in some cases. He has even suggested that it may therefore be preferable to carry out medical experiments on orphaned human infants rather than animals because infants are less aware than many species of animals and do not acquire a sense of being a person until they are older.
- Personhood is also something that can be lost (as when someone becomes ‘brain dead’ following a serious accident). This makes euthanasia morally acceptable for Singer.
So will finish with a picture of another lot that got things a bit wrong.
That's a brilliant post and very thought provoking. I also share your view about climate change and it scares me to think what kind of earth our children will inherit. It seems to be every day we hear of droughts, famine, fires, floods, storms and the rest. It's truly frightening and I don't see any way that we will tackle this problem. I suspect it's simply too late.
Anyway, I have a lot of sympathy for some of these causes. The way we've been treating the environment, animals and the earth has been shameful. I honestly that people in future will look back at our time with shame and regret. In particular, industrial scale animal farming will be viewed in the same perspective as slavery. The suffering that sentient animals must endure through their short, miserable lifetimes so someone can eat a cocktail sausage, sausage roll etc is appalling.
From what I understand, cows are not pregnant all the time and have to be given hormones to make sure they can be pregnant and therefore, milked. What a dreadful thing to do to an animal. We've turned a living creature into a milk machine. I don't think the plant based milks are as 'good' as the dairy milk but it's only a matter of time until there will be no discernible difference. However, the difference in taste between a plant milk and dairy milk isn't quality, it's cruelty.
All that said, I find the stunts they perform absolutely mystifying. I've seen protestors pouring milk onto the floor for no reason. We've recently had protestors throwing soup as a masterpiece that has nothing to do with what they are protesting about. It wasn't long ago we had someone else pouring their excrement onto a statue of Captain Tom. I find it very, very difficult to understand what they expect the outcome to be other than revulsion. They seemingly have no understanding of how to change people's minds!
Of course, they could counter that the Suffragettes did some outrageous stunts to draw attention to their cause.
As for these two people pouring the milk, I suspect they are too young to understand the outcome of what they did. They appear to be overly confident, entitled and armed with absolute knowledge and superiority. That will not change a single persons view and if anything will harden the opposition to what they are doing.
If I was them, I'd probably have given out coffees made with plant based milks and got people to try them. Some people won't like it, but some will and they are the ones you are aiming to convert. I know plenty of people who love Beyond Burgers and now prefer them to beef burgers for example.
How on earth that staff member kept his cool with those who doing that is beyond me. I feel sorry for the poor sods who've had to clean that up. Ultimately though, it's the cows who will pay the real price.
Tuearts right boot
Well-Known Member
The twats that glue themselves to the road, leave them in the road, put cones next to them and walk away. They'll soon move once no ones taking whatups, twits and facebooks.
Look into my eyes, look into my eyes, you are feeling sleepy, when you wake up you will be ergh dead.