Another new Brexit thread

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M18CTID said:
Not sure where you were mate - we were on the pitch and I thought it was fine. Stadium gigs can sometimes be weird acoustically in that it sounds great in one part but not in another.
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Yep I was in the point and the sound never got there clearly. It was weird . Should have fucked off corporate and got on the pitch.

I would not have sang oh Jeremy Corbyn though, I mean who chants football songs about a politician?
 
M18CTID said:
Was there anything more cringeworthy than those "Oh Jeremy Corbyn" chants? I had the misfortune of having to hear them at a Radiohead gig at Lancs a couple of summers ago and it was instigated by the band. When I go to a gig, I don't go to hear some fucker spouting off about politics because, shock horror, I just want to hear a band play decent music.

I'll add that if I ever hear anyone chanting "There's only one Boris Johnson", they deserve a fucking slap as well!
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Yes, bands/artists spouting about politics pisses me off too, just sing your fucking songs FFS.
It's also a stupid thing to do, many in your audience will think differently, they're presuming everyone watching them
must agree with them, they won't. It's what put me off John Lennon, he was one of the first, and his peace and love and no
war cobblers made me smile, apparently he was a bullying acerbic bloke and the last person to preach to anyone.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
Yes, bands/artists spouting about politics pisses me off too, just sing your fucking songs FFS.
It's also a stupid thing to do, many in your audience will think differently, they're presuming everyone watching them
must agree with them, they won't. It's what put me off John Lennon, he was one of the first, and his peace and love and no
war cobblers made me smile, apparently he was a bullying acerbic bloke and the last person to preach to anyone.
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And apparently very materialistic. But still a genius
 
Ancient Citizen said:
Yes, bands/artists spouting about politics pisses me off too, just sing your fucking songs FFS.
It's also a stupid thing to do, many in your audience will think differently, they're presuming everyone watching them
must agree with them, they won't. It's what put me off John Lennon, he was one of the first, and his peace and love and no
war cobblers made me smile, apparently he was a bullying acerbic bloke and the last person to preach to anyone.
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Yeah. It’s like players doing jokey tweets thinking everyone will get the joke.
 
If you want an example of the dangerous direction we are heading check out BBC Politics Live 23:40 just now with Spiked editor (formerly 'Living Marxism') Brendan O'Neill calling for riots if No Deal is prevented in October - citing the Gilets Jaunes, Suffragettes, Chartists and Levellers etc as examples of how radical protest is justified when the people's voice is ignored. That would be handy if BoJo was planning to define such widespread civil unrest as an emergency and invoke the Civil Contingencies Act to suspend the Benn legislation through an Order in Council. I think a new October Revolution could be on the cards.
 
George Hannah said:
If you want an example of the dangerous direction we are heading check out BBC Politics Live 23:40 just now with Spiked editor (formerly 'Living Marxism') Brendan O'Neill calling for riots if No Deal is prevented in October - citing the Gilets Jaunes, Suffragettes, Chartists and Levellers etc as examples of how radical protest is justified when the people's voice is ignored. That would be handy if BoJo was planning to define such widespread civil unrest as an emergency and invoke the Civil Contingencies Act to suspend the Benn legislation through an Order in Council. I think a new October Revolution could be on the cards.
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I can see Johnson and the rest of the cabinet marching on the streets, waving placards and demanding the Govt implement Brexit...er hang on. I’ll get back to you.
 
“We know that the normal approach is doomed to produce the normal results and normal results applied to things like repeated WMD crises means disaster sooner or later. As Buffett points out, ‘If there is only one chance in thirty of an event occurring in a given year, the likelihood of it occurring at least once in a century is 96.6%.’ It is not necessary to hope in order to persevere: optimism of the will, pessimism of the intellect…If one were setting up a new party in Britain, one could incorporate some of these ideas. This would of course also require recruiting very different types of people to the norm in politics. The closed nature of Westminster/Whitehall combined with first-past-the-post means it is very hard to solve the coordination problem of how to break into this system with a new way of doing things. Even those interested in principle don’t want to commit to a 10-year project that might get them blasted on the front pages. Vote Leave hacked the referendum but such opportunities are much rarer than VC-funded ‘unicorns’. On the other hand, arguably what is happening now is a once in 50 or 100 year crisis and such crises also are the waves that can be ridden to change things normally unchangeable. A second referendum in 2020 is quite possible (or two referendums under PM Corbyn, propped up by the SNP?) and might be the ideal launchpad for a completely new sort of entity, not least because if it happens the Conservative Party may well not exist in any meaningful sense (whether there is or isn’t another referendum). It’s very hard to create a wave and it’s much easier to ride one.”
 
George Hannah said:
If you want an example of the dangerous direction we are heading check out BBC Politics Live 23:40 just now with Spiked editor (formerly 'Living Marxism') Brendan O'Neill calling for riots if No Deal is prevented in October - citing the Gilets Jaunes, Suffragettes, Chartists and Levellers etc as examples of how radical protest is justified when the people's voice is ignored. That would be handy if BoJo was planning to define such widespread civil unrest as an emergency and invoke the Civil Contingencies Act to suspend the Benn legislation through an Order in Council. I think a new October Revolution could be on the cards.
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Just been reading his wikipedia page and I think he may be a twat.
 
M18CTID said:
Was there anything more cringeworthy than those "Oh Jeremy Corbyn" chants? I had the misfortune of having to hear them at a Radiohead gig at Lancs a couple of summers ago and it was instigated by the band. When I go to a gig, I don't go to hear some fucker spouting off about politics because, shock horror, I just want to hear a band play decent music.

I'll add that if I ever hear anyone chanting "There's only one Boris Johnson", they deserve a fucking slap as well!
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Why?
I quite like the "Thanks be to Jaysus" part of that song.
 
robbieh said:
You point out the differences between then and now well.
That said although there were lots of unskilled, semi skilled etc in poorly paid manual jobs back then, there are still lots of poorly paid people now, they are just not in industry and for the most part have no union representation.
The Labour audience is there it's just not quite so captive as it once was.
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Sure there's a hard core of Labour support, either through circumstance - people who feel Labour policies will do more for them in the situation they are in; or through family tradition perhaps.

But the point is the numbers of such people, as time passes and the nation as a whole becomes more and more affluent, is decreasing. There's a clear correlation I am sure you would agree, between the levels of prosperity in a given area and the propensity for that ward to return either a Labour or Tory MP. Many more Labour MPs in the relatively less well off North, relatively less in the more affluent south and what support there is, is concentrated in inner city areas with higher levels of poverty. So it logically follows that greater affluence favours the Tories, and the country for the past 50 years has been getting more and more affluent.

I found this data quite interesting from the Guardian, showing the rise of union power over the past decades, with membership peaking on the post war years, and declining away again nowadays. Correlated with the amount of unrest and days lost due to strikes.

 
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Chippy_boy said:
Sure there's a hard core of Labour support, either through circumstance - people who feel Labour policies will do more for them in the situation they are in; or through family tradition perhaps.

But the point is the numbers of such people, as time passes and the nation as a whole becomes more and more affluent, is decreasing. There's a clear correlation I am sure you would agree, between the levels of prosperity in a given area and the propensity for that ward to return either a Labour or Tory MP. Many more Labour MPs in the relatively less well off North, relatively less in the more affluent south and what support there is, is concentrated in inner city areas with higher levels of poverty. So it logically follows that greater affluence favours the Tories, and the country for the past 50 years has been getting more and more affluent.

I found this data quite interesting from the Guardian, showing the rise of union power over the past decades, with membership peaking on the post war years, and declining away again nowadays. Correlated with the amount of unrest and days lost due to strikes.

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I've seen a lot of graphs but that must be one of the oddest. What does the left axis represent? 10000 etc union members?

No correlation to pay awards or hours in the working week? Trade unions - the people who gave you the weekend.
 
Vic said:
I've seen a lot of graphs but that must be one of the oddest. What does the left axis represent? 10000 etc union members?

No correlation to pay awards or hours in the working week? Trade unions - the people who gave you the weekend.
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Sorry, yes it's not very clear. It's union membership in 1000's and strike (man) days that year in 1000's.
 
mcfc1632 said:
Did you get an answer?

I am actually a bit concerned about reading the next pages

Some proper disturbing stuff being posted
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mcfc1632 said:
Fuck - failed toskip over sufficient pages and landed on this exchange

What utter envy and unreasonableness you are addressing here. Talk about wanting to live in the collective and all we need is for parents to stop wanting to do their best for their children - let's all just have a human nature by-pass

Some true natures have come to the fore these last days
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I don't want to get off topic again but there are some closed minds if your only interest in society is your own children's interest. Some of this is basic history (the fight for all children to get schooling) and some is basic philosophy (e.g. what is the utility of wanting better education for all?). Nowt to do with envy.

Same with land.
"As soon as the land of any country has all become private property, the landlords, like all other men, love to reap where they never sowed, and demand a rent even for its natural produce. The wood of the forest, the grass of the field, and all the natural fruits of the earth, which, when land was in common, cost the labourer only the trouble of gathering them, come, even to him, to have an additional price fixed upon them. He must then pay for the licence to gather them; and must give up to the landlord a portion of what his labour either collects or produces"
(That old lefty Adam Smith)
 
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