Another new Brexit thread

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mcfc1632 said:
I am not a Conservative

I am just capable of objective analysis as nd unbiased thinking
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west didsblue said:
The poor Brexit supporters who don’t give a fuck about the economy are in for a nasty shock when they realise that they can get a whole lot worse off.
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That maybe so but they don’t care, that’s my point.

Minds won’t be changed as we care about different things to a lot of leave voters.
 
Ban-jani said:
That maybe so but they don’t care, that’s my point.

Minds won’t be changed as we care about different things to a lot of leave voters.
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People always care if they end up with less money on their pocket. They might not admit it but they will not be happy.

As for minds being changed, that really doesn’t matter. I’m fairly sure that there’s been a Remain popular majority for most of the time since the vote but because of the way our system works that doesn’t matter. What matters is which party gets the biggest share of the vote and that has been a Brexit supporting party in the last two GEs. So we’ve all got to suck up whatever shit we’re dealt with until 2025 when we next have a say.
 
west didsblue said:
People always care if they end up with less money on their pocket. They might not admit it but they will not be happy.

As for minds being changed, that really doesn’t matter. I’m fairly sure that there’s been a Remain popular majority for most of the time since the vote but because of the way our system works that doesn’t matter. What matters is which party gets the biggest share of the vote and that has been a Brexit supporting party in the last two GEs. So we’ve all got to suck up whatever shit we’re dealt with until 2025 when we next have a say.
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I think the 2nd paragraph is very hard to know, it’ll be close to 50/50 in my opinion, as it has been since 2016.

You’ll always get people who vote for the same party and they may have voted for them despite of Brexit policy.

Polls aren’t always accurate too.

Anyway, on the first points, I genuinely don’t think they care and they won’t be convinced otherwise.
 
Some thoughts from Eurasia Group. Don’t disagree, although idea that ‘a deal would put Brexit to bed’ did make me lol. Wasn’t the GE meant to do that? Brexit will never be put to bed. Brexit will rumble on forever.

‘Agree there are now tailwinds behind a UK-EU Brexit trade deal, but *not* because EU is supposedly suddenly willing to compromise on state aid, but rather because 10DowningStreet now believes a deal is in its political interest Put simply: no deal will give Starmer space, opportunity & ammunition to attack Govt's credibility; a deal would put Brexit to bed. So the thinking in Govt about how no deal would play in Commons has evolved. That's biggest driver for change in sentiment on UK side.

On managed divergence, EU is sceptical; on state aid, picture is complex. Yes, Covid-19 has made EU more liberal in their use of state aid, but the 27 are also becoming much tougher with 3rd countries (did people see presser w/China on Monday?) Implications for UK still unclear. Covid-19 has shot Govt's short-term credibility. No deal would compound that. That's how Coronavirus & Brexit/trade talks are now interacting. Thinking was diff just a few weeks ago. It’s all politics.’
 
Mëtal Bikër said:
You are SUCH a hypocrite!

You "hate" when people use gifs, yet "applaud" the use of this one.

tenor.gif
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They have their uses occasionally particularly in response to patently ludicrous comments.

Yours seldom make any sense and are usually there just for trolling, this one included.
 
west didsblue said:
They have their uses occasionally particularly in response to patently ludicrous comments.

Yours seldom make any sense and are usually there just for trolling, this one included.
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Yes... that is the whole point of a 'reactionary gif'.

Of course you don't like the gifs I post; they're used for the exact same reasons as you just cited as Zuriblue's to mcfc1632, but you don't like them because their aimed at you and others like you. Gifs make sense to those who understand the context of their usage and what it's reacting to.

But you don't call up zuriblue for using them in the same way, because it benefits your viewpoint when it's used to demean others you disagree with. So you don't hate the usage of gifs at all, do you, you just hate when they're used against you and cannot understand the context of it, even when others do.

As I said, you're a total hypocrite. ;)
 
BobKowalski said:
Did my first ignore today. That bizarre laughing gif, or whatever the fuck it was, did for me. I mean it’s not even lunchtime.
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It's a clip from Austin Powers about Dr Evil.

I mean that's the 'bizarre laughing gif' you mean, right? You wouldn't be selective in which gifs you approve and disprove of now, would you? :)
 
BobKowalski said:
Some thoughts from Eurasia Group. Don’t disagree, although idea that ‘a deal would put Brexit to bed’ did make me lol. Wasn’t the GE meant to do that? Brexit will never be put to bed. Brexit will rumble on forever.

‘Agree there are now tailwinds behind a UK-EU Brexit trade deal, but *not* because EU is supposedly suddenly willing to compromise on state aid, but rather because 10DowningStreet now believes a deal is in its political interest Put simply: no deal will give Starmer space, opportunity & ammunition to attack Govt's credibility; a deal would put Brexit to bed. So the thinking in Govt about how no deal would play in Commons has evolved. That's biggest driver for change in sentiment on UK side.

On managed divergence, EU is sceptical; on state aid, picture is complex. Yes, Covid-19 has made EU more liberal in their use of state aid, but the 27 are also becoming much tougher with 3rd countries (did people see presser w/China on Monday?) Implications for UK still unclear. Covid-19 has shot Govt's short-term credibility. No deal would compound that. That's how Coronavirus & Brexit/trade talks are now interacting. Thinking was diff just a few weeks ago. It’s all politics.’
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A soft brexit on the cards then (with LPF provisions).

The question is what does it do to the tories. You still have 80~100ish ERG types who will shit the bed (they voted this down under May - would they do it again). And an unknown number of new intake Tories who could join with them. No doubt Farage will raise his ugly head and relaunch his grift vehicle/political party and start hammering the tories from the other side. Does anyone have the appetite to do a version of 2019 all over again but almost entirely within the confines of the tory party or do they just roll over and accept the inevitable consequence (i.e. it was inevitable that no political party would ever do no deal and the EU would always have their price for SM access).
 
Mëtal Bikër said:
Yes... that is the whole point of a 'reactionary gif'.

Of course you don't like the gifs I post; they're used for the exact same reasons as you just cited as Zuriblue's to mcfc1632, but you don't like them because their aimed at you and others like you. Gifs make sense to those who understand the context of their usage and what it's reacting to.

But you don't call up zuriblue for using them in the same way, because it benefits your viewpoint when it's used to demean others you disagree with. So you don't hate the usage of gifs at all, do you, you just hate when they're used against you and cannot understand the context of it, even when others do.

As I said, you're a total hypocrite. ;)
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That gif you posted is particularly unpleasant to look at. Tempted to block you myself as I don't read your posts anyway.
 
Gaudion M said:
A soft brexit on the cards then (with LPF provisions).

The question is what does it do to the tories. You still have 80~100ish ERG types who will shit the bed (they voted this down under May - would they do it again). And an unknown number of new intake Tories who could join with them. No doubt Farage will raise his ugly head and relaunch his grift vehicle/political party and start hammering the tories from the other side. Does anyone have the appetite to do a version of 2019 all over again but almost entirely within the confines of the tory party or do they just roll over and accept the inevitable consequence (i.e. it was inevitable that no political party would ever do no deal and the EU would always have their price for SM access).
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That’s odd.
I thought we had a viable walk away option and the political will to use it. I’m sure that’s been mentioned at least once or twice (or 500 times).
 
Gaudion M said:
That gif you posted is particularly unpleasant to look at. Tempted to block you myself as I don't read your posts anyway.
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I'll be sure to... take your 'sensitivities' into account when posting any unpleasant gifs in future. :)
 
BobKowalski said:
You should read the FT article the headline is based on. Contains the words ‘Johnson’ and ‘could consider a possible compromise’.
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Sooooooo?????

I have never said that the UK will not (need to) compromise - indeed, I have of course - several times - recently set out my concerns that Johnson becomes 'overly-involved' due to my concerns that he might compromise where accommodation is not necessary

I have simply stated the truism:

"We will not see movement from the EU unless and until they are faced with the prospect of a viable walk-away option – and the political will to use it”

You and others have seemed to delight in the expectation that the EU can simply boss the UK around - of course you have banged on about the fact that the EU are a rules based organisation and will therefore not make changes.....

After events of the last 10 months - perhaps you should have been always adding a rider along the lines of....

"...unless it suits them...."

or

"...unless the Remainer undermining of the UK's negotiations stops and the EU face the political will do walk away...."
 
jay_mcfc said:
I wish this board had that Facebook feature where you hover over the like button and it brings up other emoji options. The laughing one would suffice here.
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west didsblue said:
Not just any laughing. Rolling over laughing whilst pissing yourself if such an emoji exists.
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Bothered?

You guys have much experience with people from Eccles, Weaste and Lower Broughton???

If so - come across many Tories??

No - you are simply incapable of objective thinking and have never gotten your heads around the simple fact that not all Brexit supporters are Tories
 
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