Coronavirus (2021) thread

[wolfie1988]

By letting people just catch the virus instead of vaccination you risk the whole Gamut of side issues like long covid which have a big impact on the economy as it can take people out of work for months. However with the level of Vaccinations we have I cant see there being a huge amount of choice. we kinda hit a wall with people willing to have it.

Definitely. A lot of factors such as the media, the EU to an extent and their negative agenda against the AZ vaccine, and the large scale of moronic people in this country who are happy to be tattooed from head to toe and shove whatever unknown substances they are into up their noses each weekend, meant that we were always going to hit a wall. Sadly it fell even well short of where we hoped it would.

 

[True_Blue69]

Indeed.

Everything I've suggested would help that; letting covid run uncontrolled does the opposite.

To be fair, at the moment your last statement is being proven wrong every day, that’s if you are classing the current situation as letting it run uncontrolled. Unless something dramatically changes then this is where we are for the foreseeable.

 

[Barcon]

Yeah. Just hadn’t occurred to us our kids wouldn’t be allowed in without quarantine having had their required jabs here.
Just waiting to speak to NHS to try to get them booked in for additional Pfizer jab. Hoping I dont meet with resistance.

Fly to New York, train to Niagara falls Go downstream, swim across and I'll pick you up on the good side.
I'll shoo the raccoons out of the shed.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

To be fair, at the moment your last statement is being proven wrong every day, that’s if you are classing the current situation as letting it run uncontrolled. Unless something dramatically changes then this is where we are for the foreseeable.

Nonsense.

A thousand people a day are being hospitalised, and a thousand a week dying.

Are you seriously suggesting that has no effect?

Both would be substantially lower if we had more immunity, which vaccinating would have delivered as I suggested; this wave has been driven almost entirely by unvaccinated schoolkids.

 

[True_Blue69]

Nonsense.

A thousand people a day are being hospitalised, and a thousand a week dying.

Are you seriously suggesting that has no effect?

Both would be substantially lower if we had more immunity, which vaccinating would have delivered as I suggested; this wave has been driven almost entirely by unvaccinated schoolkids.

On the economy? I don’t think the current deaths and hospitalisations are having a negative effect on the economy at all. Everywhere I go is exactly the same as it was pre-pandemic. Viruses have always been around and unfortunately some people get seriously ill through them. The current levels with covid make it worse than these but not by much, which is why we are carrying on as normal as possible.

No one wants people to get ill, but it’s still here and it’s no longer out of control, so we have to live with it. If is gets worse then we should reconsider.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

On the economy? I don’t think the current deaths and hospitalisations are having a negative effect on the economy at all. Everywhere I go is exactly the same as it was pre-pandemic

You don't think that people unable to get hospital treatment because of the civil overload doesn't affect the economy?

Or the current 50% reduction in the use of public transport pre-covid doesn't effect the economy?

Or the ongoing cost of testing doesn't affect the economy?

The higher the prevalence, the more the economy is affected, through both official restrictions and people stopping activities off their own initiative.

 

[grunge]

On the economy? I don’t think the current deaths and hospitalisations are having a negative effect on the economy at all. Everywhere I go is exactly the same as it was pre-pandemic. Viruses have always been around and unfortunately some people get seriously ill through them. The current levels with covid make it worse than these but not by much, which is why we are carrying on as normal as possible.

No one wants people to get ill, but it’s still here and it’s no longer out of control, so we have to live with it. If is gets worse then we should reconsider.

1.2 million long covid cases and rising daily. Vaccines cut long covid Significantly if not totally.

we absolutely need to be vaccinating more but how is the question.

for scale it’s close to the level of unemployment.

 

[True_Blue69]

You don't think that people unable to get hospital treatment because of the civil overload doesn't affect the economy?

Or the current 50% reduction in the use of public transport pre-covid doesn't effect the economy?

Or the ongoing cost of testing doesn't affect the economy?

The higher the prevalence, the more the economy is affected, through both official restrictions and people stopping activities off their own initiative.

And your magical plans will fix all that yeah? It’s a global pandemic of course things are going to be impacted. The economy is currently exceeding forecasts, can’t ask for any more than that.

 

[True_Blue69]

1.2 million long covid cases and rising daily. Vaccines cut long covid Significantly if not totally.

we absolutely need to be vaccinating more but how is the question.

for scale it’s close to the level of unemployment.

We are vaccinating people, not sure I get your point? Anyone that wants one can get one.

 

[Bluewonder]

1.2 million long covid cases and rising daily. Vaccines cut long covid Significantly if not totally.

we absolutely need to be vaccinating more but how is the question.

for scale it’s close to the level of unemployment.

Where has the 1.2m long Covid cases figure come from?

 

[grunge]

Where has the 1.2m long Covid cases figure come from?

seen it mentioned a few times in the last couple of days.

More than 1,200,000 suffering with long Covid as cases soar

This is up from 1.1 million last month - a jump of nearly 10%.

metro.co.uk

Long Covid cases soar with over 1.2m people suffering in 9% jump

The number of people suffering from long Covid rose by around 100,000 across September, with 426,000 still inflicted by the condition a year after catching the virus, according to the Office for National Statistics

www.mirror.co.uk

it was 1.1m less than a month ago.

 

[grunge]

We are vaccinating people, not sure I get your point? Anyone that wants one can get one.

You were saying there was no issues to the economy I pointed out there is.

we are not vaccinating as much as we could. Tons of kids out there not vaccinated and getting long covid and plenty of adults still not vaccinated.

if we just said about keeping masks while continuing to vaccinate we’d be far better off with zero impact on economy.

Should be offering incentives like other countries.

 

[True_Blue69]

You were saying there was no issues to the economy I pointed out there is.

we are not vaccinating as much as we could. Tons of kids out there not vaccinated and getting long covid and plenty of adults still not vaccinated.

if we just said about keeping masks while continuing to vaccinate we’d be far better off with zero impact on economy.

Should be offering incentives like other countries.

Kids aren’t getting long covid though, the biggest study into this found that more kids were suffering with long covid symptoms that hadn’t actually had it, than in those that had.

If it’s just mask wearing then I don’t see that as a big deal personally. As long as it’s not daft like you have to wear in your seat at football or when walking to the toilet in a pub.

Don’t wales and Scotland still mandate mask wearing? Real world trial right there how is that going for them?

 

[grunge]

Kids aren’t getting long covid though, the biggest study into this found that more kids were suffering with long covid symptoms that hadn’t actually had it, than in those that had.

If it’s just mask wearing then I don’t see that as a big deal personally. As long as it’s not daft like you have to wear in your seat at football or when walking to the toilet in a pub.

Don’t wales and Scotland still mandate mask wearing? Real world trial right there how is that going for them?

Sorry but they are. There was some odd reporting around it but I guess this is the study our meaning from Sept 2021 involving 220 000 people. This study even had comparison groups to compare against for false positives.

Long covid: One in seven children may still have symptoms 15 weeks after infection, data show

A large study of children and young people who caught SARS-CoV-2 has found that as many as one in seven (14%) may still have symptoms 15 weeks later.1 However, this figure is lower than in some studies that have reported a prevalence of long covid as high as 51% in children and young people...

www.bmj.com

1 in 7 children may still have symptoms after 15 weeks. Not as bad as adults and not as bad as worst case predictions but still not trivial at all.

Personally I think masks wise would make a reasonable difference even if they were just in shops / transport etc, im surprised the gov hasn't bought in a mandate yet for winter to be honest. Even if it was a 25% reduction in cases its still 25% less people getting ill or long covid.

Most headlines were more around "Long covid not as bad in children as feared".

 

[Healdplace]

Should be offering incentives like other countries.

In my view that is upside down.

We should be offering DISincentives to those who decline.

Giving people the idea that if they hang on and do not bother they will benefit in the long run by desperate politicians needing them to do what any decent human being would see as their civic duty unless they have sound medical reasons not to do so is like rewarding the greedy who put other people at risk. Their families included. Whilst they wait for the carrot.

We are at the point where the stick is needed imo. You have a job that interacts with the public a lot then you HAVE to be vaccinated or you lose your job to one of the many who did the right thing and lost theirs.

That is how we get out of this not waiting for the selfish to bother if they see having a jab as a win for themselves.

I respect many will disagree and I was initially opposed to this kind of persuasion as I thought Britain was a caring society. But the reason people who feel they are invulnerable due to age or fitness are waiting is because they expect there to be a benefit first.

In World War Two those who did not want to fight were sent down coal mines not given free passes to nightclubs. There WAS a choice but there was also a fair price to pay for making it.

 

[grunge]

In my view that is upside down.

We should be offering DISincentives to those who decline.

Giving people the idea that if they hang on and do not bother they will benefit in the long run by desperate politicians needing them to do what any decent human being would see as their civic duty unless they have sound medical reasons not to do so is like rewarding the greedy who put other people at risk. Their families included. Whilst they wait for the carrot.

We are at the point where the stick is needed imo. You have a job that interacts with the publuc a lot then you HAVE to be vaccinated or you lose your job to one of the many who did the right thing an lost theirs.

That is how we get out of this not waiting for the selfish to win.

I respect many will disagree but the reason people who feel they are invulnerable due to age or fitness are waiting is because they expect there to be a benefit first.

IN World War Two those who did not want to fight were sent down coal mines not given free passes to nightclubs

To be honest im with you here. It worked really well in France, You want to go into a restaurant. well get the jab. But maybe a mix of both?

Incentive wise one of the best I heard was a lottery system. Everyone that gets the jab gets put into a lottery to win prizes. make the top prizes big enough to draw people in. In the grand scheme of things its probably a cheap way to do it.

 

[Healdplace]

I dont know about a lottery. If it was weighted to how likely you were to win the earlier you had your jab perhaps. Otherwise it is still a bribe favouring those who will not bother until it benefits them.

So you 'win' money or prizes in said lottery proportional to how long you waited until saying yes after you were eligible. Sand trickling out of a glass - put it off you lose money with every grain.

If it were me I would do it locally and put up a table on TV in ad breaks saying THESE are the ones in your town still saying no - this is the money they have potentially lost this week by declining.

I know that will never be allowed via civil liberies etc but someone can find a creative way to make not doing this if you have no good medical reason something you should be perceived badly for by others not celebrated as a hero of the liberation from the made up hoax virus/vaccine/Chinese/alien invasion via the illuminati.

Just do not give the same benefit to someone who held out for six months versus someone who did not.

The incentive has to be to get jabbed ASAP not whenever it fits into their clubbing calendar if the reward is identical either way.

 

[Tommy_Catons_Perm]

To be honest im with you here. It worked really well in France, You want to go into a restaurant. well get the jab. But maybe a mix of both?

Incentive wise one of the best I heard was a lottery system. Everyone that gets the jab gets put into a lottery to win prizes. make the top prizes big enough to draw people in. In the grand scheme of things its probably a cheap way to do it.

The booby prize for the unvaccinated is death. That's enough incentive for me.

 

[Healdplace]

The booby prize for the unvaccinated is death. That's enough incentive for me.

Yes, but if they really thought that they would not be unvaccinated. AND the real problem is that they might well just play pass the parcel with the virus and hand that on to their granny or the bloke they work with who has a compromised immune system but has never used it as a reason to stay off work. But will pay the price if that person holds out until he thinks he can win a lottery prize.

 

[hgblue]

In my view that is upside down.

We should be offering DISincentives to those who decline.

Giving people the idea that if they hang on and do not bother they will benefit in the long run by desperate politicians needing them to do what any decent human being would see as their civic duty unless they have sound medical reasons not to do so is like rewarding the greedy who put other people at risk. Their families included. Whilst they wait for the carrot.

We are at the point where the stick is needed imo. You have a job that interacts with the public a lot then you HAVE to be vaccinated or you lose your job to one of the many who did the right thing and lost theirs.

That is how we get out of this not waiting for the selfish to bother if they see having a jab as a win for themselves.

I respect many will disagree and I was initially opposed to this kind of persuasion as I thought Britain was a caring society. But the reason people who feel they are invulnerable due to age or fitness are waiting is because they expect there to be a benefit first.

In World War Two those who did not want to fight were sent down coal mines not given free passes to nightclubs. There WAS a choice but there was also a fair price to pay for making it.

You people are seriously losing the plot, I honestly think covid has driven some of you insane because you can't see how unacceptable this sort of thing is in a free society. It's ironic that you invoke world war 2 where millions died to preserve freedom, which surely includes the freedom to decide whether you get vaccinated or not.

Yes, but if they really thought that they would not be unvaccinated. AND the real problem is that they might well just play pass the parcel with the virus and hand that on to their granny or the bloke they work with who has a compromised immune system but has never used it as a reason to stay off work. But will pay the price if that person holds out until he thinks he can win a lottery prize.

The vaccinated can catch and transmit the virus. You seriously think people aren’t getting vaccinated because they’re waiting for a lottery prize?