COVID-19 — Coronavirus

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purplenose said:
Indeed if there are any delays to these being rolled out it will be down to cock ups most likely overseen by the government rather than any big delay due to science. The people working on the vaccines by and large wont have much interest in politics and have no reason to give misinformation. I think if there were any major issues that have come to light we would have heard about it.

The first vaccines will most likely not be a fantastic miracle solution but will most likely be suffice to see a reasonably paced return to normal where mask wearing and social distancing are no longer required....even the grim reaper Vallance said as much.

Its pretty obvious that the first to get this jab will be frontline workers and those who currently are recommended to have the flu jab and so its perhaps not unreasonable to think that might not be completed until Feb/March even if they start at the beginning of December. On that basis I would have thought it quite reasonable for the rest to not expect availability until Spring/Summer.

After all that is not really an issue because once the most at risk are vaccinated and therefore the risk of them contracting it or being seriously ill is vastly reduced then if the virus is still circulating amongst the others there will be very little danger from covid. On that basis I would think it perfectly good were the target to be having everyone of any age who wishes to be vaccinated done by the start of next years flu jab season mid September time.
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It will be interesting what the take up is when it is first rolled out
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
some good thoughts, right up until you used China as an example. Then you lost me as I dont think anyone really believes the figures coming out of China. They couldnt care less about human lives, the numbers are clearly made up by a ruthless dictatorship hanging on to power.
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Indeed I don't believe anything coming out of China but then I don't see why they would lie about the things they are doing and then not do them. I honestly think they have it under control and the only lie they are telling is with the pain they've taken to get it done.

Here really we are playing at it, we are supposedly in the highest lockdown yet I can goto the shops, I can goto restaurants, I can even see my mates in a park so we are bound to do worse. In China they don't have this, if an outbreak is detected you are locked in your houses until the outbreak is over and that can only be proven through testing. This protects the virus from spreading from those areas and so the rest of the country is seeing total normality.

Even if you want to get on a train to go elsewhere in China you are tested, they know where you are going and so if you test positive they know where the next outbreak is. Here I can get on a train and travel 250 miles to Cornwall and no-one would have a clue but I could spread the virus there and off it goes, no-one would know until testing proved an outbreak which by then would be too late.

I'm not saying China have the right approach but it's the right approach if the only goal was to stamp out the virus and return to normality as soon as possible. The US is the best example of the opposite end of the spectrum, they have valued their economy and freedoms above dying people which is why more people have died and are still dying there than anywhere else.
 
inbetween said:
Indeed I don't believe anything coming out of China but then I don't see why they would lie about the things they are doing and then not do them. I honestly think they have it under control and the only lie they are telling is with the pain they've taken to get it done.

Here really we are playing at it, we are supposedly in the highest lockdown yet I can goto the shops, I can goto restaurants, I can even see my mates in a park so we are bound to do worse. In China they don't have this, if an outbreak is detected you are locked in your houses until the outbreak is over and that can only be proven through testing. This protects the virus from spreading from those areas and so the rest of the country is seeing total normality.

Even if you want to get on a train to go elsewhere in China you are tested, they know where you are going and so if you test positive they know where the next outbreak is. Here I can get on a train and travel 250 miles to Cornwall and no-one would have a clue but I could spread the virus there and off it goes, no-one would know until testing proved an outbreak which by then would be too late.

I'm not saying China have the right approach but it's the right approach if the only goal was to stamp out the virus and return to normality as soon as possible. The US is the best example of the opposite end of the spectrum, they have valued their economy and freedoms above dying people which is why more people have died and are still dying there than anywhere else.
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i simply dont believe the figures coming out of China, I see no reason to start believing their figures now more than there was 9months ago. They are a truly terrible dictatorship that have and will continue to put their regime and economy ahead of freedom of information and press, human rights of their people, and the sovereign rights of other countries. A country with a long history of missinformation.

Im staggered that in a country that has the above government combined with such low health care standards per capita, typically a tenth or less than that the European average, people believe the nonsense that they have been doing a good job saving lives and keeping the virus in check.

The only developed country in the world to do this aside from New Zealand which is unique in its ability to do so.
 
anyone well up with the stock market situation,,was watching a video of some financial guy who was explaining its about to go tits up, he was saying its being propped up by the Federal Reserve who are simply printing money on demand, 'digital money' but it cant carry on and the FR will pull the plug at some point causing it to crash, he was saying its not an if its a when and sooner rather than later, in 2008 we seen a 30% reduction on property value and this could be double that
 
marco said:
anyone well up with the stock market situation,,was watching a video of some financial guy who was explaining its about to go tits up, he was saying its being propped up by the Federal Reserve who are simply printing money on demand, 'digital money' but it cant carry on and the FR will pull the plug at some point causing it to crash, he was saying its not an if its a when and sooner rather than later, in 2008 we seen a 30% reduction on property value and this could be double that
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I'm sure a Tier 4 will help which is currently being discussed in Whitehall by civil servants immune to economic volatility.
 
mosssideblue said:
It will be interesting what the take up is when it is first rolled out
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I think it will be quite high. Though age will play a part in that.

The over 50s and vulnerable and at risk will probably by and large be keen to get it done. I am in that category being mid 50s and whilst not one of those who is considered high risk I am considered as the lower end of the high risk if you like. On that basis alone I will not hesitate to get it done. Any risk from the vaccine is outweighed from the risk of covid in my view under such circumstances.

If I were younger and in good health I may be less enthusiastic, and would perhaps take the view that those whom are at risk should get vaccinated so if I got it I would not pass it one to them. If I had older relatives I would still probably decide to have it to be double certain of not giving them something though.

What could be the persuasive factor amongst the younger ones is this so called Long Covid. If it is as common as being suggested amongst the young then they would be foolish not too have it. As someone who copped for M.E. and Fibro (nailed on same thing as Long Covid) from Glandular fever from this thing decades ago I can assure you I will be suggesting to both my 18 and 24 year olds that they have the vaccine as soon as possible. Equally were they under age I would be taking them to have the vaccine asap.
 
purplenose said:
I think it will be quite high. Though age will play a part in that.

The over 50s and vulnerable and at risk will probably by and large be keen to get it done. I am in that category being mid 50s and whilst not one of those who is considered high risk I am considered as the lower end of the high risk if you like. On that basis alone I will not hesitate to get it done. Any risk from the vaccine is outweighed from the risk of covid in my view under such circumstances.

If I were younger and in good health I may be less enthusiastic, and would perhaps take the view that those whom are at risk should get vaccinated so if I got it I would not pass it one to them. If I had older relatives I would still probably decide to have it to be double certain of not giving them something though.

What could be the persuasive factor amongst the younger ones is this so called Long Covid. If it is as common as being suggested amongst the young then they would be foolish not too have it. As someone who copped for M.E. and Fibro (nailed on same thing as Long Covid) from Glandular fever from this thing decades ago I can assure you I will be suggesting to both my 18 and 24 year olds that they have the vaccine as soon as possible. Equally were they under age I would be taking them to have the vaccine asap.
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Thanks for a detailed response, most appreciated. I am older than you but would not be rushing to the front of the queue. Over this year, I have become very sceptical of the Government and simply have become paranoid that any vaccine rushed through might not be as safe as it should be.

Many will see that as being nonsense, but that is my thinking.
 
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