Manchester_lalala
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The level of the best version of Diego Costa is very high, I’d take that.
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Gabriel Jesus - 2017/18 performances
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The level of the best version of Diego Costa is very high, I’d take that.
Seem to see a fair few opposition fans just tag him with the tap-in merchant tag. Presumably this is because they just watch highlights such as MOTD; whereby admittedly the majority of his goals for us have been getting in the right position & finishing from close.
This however obviously misses off a huge part of his game, which is why he is able to usurp Aguero from our line-up under Pep; his build-up play & work rate. The kid works incredibly hard, always puts in a shift closing down, and is much more involved in our build-up than Aguero manages to achieve. Combine this with having a pretty strong goal scoring record & it's easy to see why Pep loves the guy.
I also find the "tap-in merchant" tag a bit of a strange one; often that's exactly what a team needs. We're a side that builds up patiently then cuts teams open from near/in the box; we don't need a striker who'll be scoring 30 yard screamers regularly. I always look back at Papiss Cisse for this, he had that season where he couldn't stop scoring worldies - I said to everyone they should sell him, with my reasoning being that he never seemed to score a tap-in & his worldies will dry up. Low & behold once the worldies stopped he looked pretty awful. I've little doubt Jesus will get his share of screamers/quality goals for us, but they can be few & far between for all we care, his job is to score/assist at the end of moves, doesn't matter how he does it.
This however obviously misses off a huge part of his game, which is why he is able to usurp Aguero from our line-up under Pep; his build-up play & work rate. The kid works incredibly hard, always puts in a shift closing down, and is much more involved in our build-up than Aguero manages to achieve. Combine this with having a pretty strong goal scoring record & it's easy to see why Pep loves the guy.
I also find the "tap-in merchant" tag a bit of a strange one; often that's exactly what a team needs. We're a side that builds up patiently then cuts teams open from near/in the box; we don't need a striker who'll be scoring 30 yard screamers regularly. I always look back at Papiss Cisse for this, he had that season where he couldn't stop scoring worldies - I said to everyone they should sell him, with my reasoning being that he never seemed to score a tap-in & his worldies will dry up. Low & behold once the worldies stopped he looked pretty awful. I've little doubt Jesus will get his share of screamers/quality goals for us, but they can be few & far between for all we care, his job is to score/assist at the end of moves, doesn't matter how he does it.
Exeter Blue I am here
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Worked hard as always tonight and not easy to play on the shoulder of the last man when the opposition are defending deep and in numbers. He never strikes me as a line leading centre forward though, and tonight seemed to be an endless round of heavy touches and wall passes. Diaz looked more of a nuisance in his 10 minute cameo to be honest. Got no protection from that idiot Tierney either
I have to say that for the first time I am actually beginning to have some doubts about GJ. He has played a lot of games recently and, for the most part, has been very average. I am not seeing the bits of brilliance I was hoping for or maybe that great individual goal. Instead his passing and control can be poor and I hope this is just down to his inexperience...he is only 20 after all. His workrate is tremendous but sadly I have to say that, at this moment, he is not living up to his billing as one of the best young talents in world football. I really hope he improves next season and realises his undoubted potential.
Bpughh
Well-Known Member
He's hardly older than foden and brahim but judged as a veteran. The kid has a lot to his game. His instincts and workrate, the stuff you can't teach, are as good as they come. Look how much sterling has developed over the past few years. Besides mbappe, there's nobody close at that age. Still so much to come and so much room for him to grow
tenententen
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Not the best game. He struggled to control the square passes and fumbles them, as if his first touch has left him tonight. It's important to get into good positions but it's worthless when opportunities are wasted.
I would like to add, that maybe by looking at the last few (or maybe a bit further back for some cases earlier this season) pages of this thread (eg p.114), the Sané thread, the Zinchenko thread, the Sterling thread, the Danilo thread, the Walker thread, the Stones thread, the Ederson thread, and so on; you'll see a recurring theme whereby people seem to jump the gun on their opinions from one game to the next. One match awful, the next good, the next ok but not worth keeping, the next great, the next needing replacing for an academy player...
Some of you need to take a step back and chill.
The reason I post this on the Jesus thread is because it's disappointing to see how few people actually get it with him. I was at the game today and even behind me a conversation was struck up entitled, 'I still don't know what Jesus does'. And yet he's getting picked regularly and we're winning games regularly. So he's clearly doing something. It's 95% off the ball movement i.e. the stuff you don't see that they're doing 95% of the time anyway. That's by far and away the most important difference between being a good technical player like most in the league are and being a good technical player good enough for a Pep team. It's why clunky footed Raheem Sterling is one of our most productive players. It's why the Pellegrini era past his peak Silva has been reinvented as a central midfielder and prospered into greater heights than ever. It's why Gundogan is chalking up so many passes a game. And it's why Jesus is so important to the way we play (when he does play). Because their movement without the ball is world class. They constantly find space and buzz around creating it for others and it brings the best out of the team.
When I'm at the games I enjoy watching Jesus and Sterling sometimes just to see how they move without the ball. Jesus today for example was constantly buzzing, and more impressively constantly providing an option for the direct pass from defence to attack. He's dragging defenders around and always looking to make darting runs into the box. The reason he's getting tap ins and opportunities for such is because he's somehow finding the space to do so.
Unfortunately, if you're watching the game like a normal person and following the ball instead of playing the player cam then you don't see this stuff. All you see is the player getting the ball for one second, doing something mildly uninteresting and then moving it on to someone else. But it means you won't get to see what the player's doing the rest of the time and why it's so important.
He reminds me of *Sterling in that sense of yesteryear. It's not exactly clear what it is he offers, and like it was for Raheem it can be frustrating because we've seen this previously explosive and prodigal talent go through the process of being coached into becoming a boring, no end product kind of guy (I think this is where a lot of the disappointment with Jesus stems from knowing how talented he really is). And yet somehow as by magic as soon as Sterling hit that age where players start to mature, his intelligent play started getting major results and this seen his productivity has hit heights he once promised to do as a youngster but on top of that he plays with maturity and contributes greatly to our play. Just think about how good Jesus can be at that age, knowing he's only a couple of years behind. I mean he's already starting up front for Brazil now! It'll be Stones next too.
*Just think with Sterling by the way, there are plenty of more obviously typical wingers with a lot of talent who can do things we never really see Sterling do (eg Zaha, Oxlade-Chamberlain etc). But there's a reason why he's got it in him to become a world great and not many others do.
Obviously he's not a better footballer than Aguero outright. But then again that's no insult, because which striker in the premier league is as good a footballer as Aguero at his best? Aguero can do things very very few footballers in the world can do, and it's a blessing we have him still to this day. But that doesn't mean Jesus doesn't have it in him to lead us to greatness one day when he hits his better years (23+). He has a gift that not many others have, a great amount of in play intelligence. It needs nurturing and when it comes out you'll all be glad you were there to witness it.
ps. If you don't think intelligence is that big a deal, then just look across the road at Pogba. He has arguably as much as Yaya had physically, arguably better technically and yet will never be quite as good as Yaya, because one was a genius on the pitch and the other is not. It's a legitimate reason why Gareth Barry has more PL winner medals than Gerrard, despite in many regards being a lesser player (except the one useful bit of course). I hate to use this example, but it's why so many people (rightly or wrongly before you go there) have in hindsight rated Rio Ferdinand so extremely highly. It's why England were for the previous 10 years so shit internationally. And it's why Raheem Sterling is top of the league.
Well said. His hold up play was so much better than usual today. I apologise for the comparison but he's looking like the player Balotelli was trying to be for us back in 11/12
Some of you need to take a step back and chill.
The reason I post this on the Jesus thread is because it's disappointing to see how few people actually get it with him. I was at the game today and even behind me a conversation was struck up entitled, 'I still don't know what Jesus does'. And yet he's getting picked regularly and we're winning games regularly. So he's clearly doing something. It's 95% off the ball movement i.e. the stuff you don't see that they're doing 95% of the time anyway. That's by far and away the most important difference between being a good technical player like most in the league are and being a good technical player good enough for a Pep team. It's why clunky footed Raheem Sterling is one of our most productive players. It's why the Pellegrini era past his peak Silva has been reinvented as a central midfielder and prospered into greater heights than ever. It's why Gundogan is chalking up so many passes a game. And it's why Jesus is so important to the way we play (when he does play). Because their movement without the ball is world class. They constantly find space and buzz around creating it for others and it brings the best out of the team.
When I'm at the games I enjoy watching Jesus and Sterling sometimes just to see how they move without the ball. Jesus today for example was constantly buzzing, and more impressively constantly providing an option for the direct pass from defence to attack. He's dragging defenders around and always looking to make darting runs into the box. The reason he's getting tap ins and opportunities for such is because he's somehow finding the space to do so.
Unfortunately, if you're watching the game like a normal person and following the ball instead of playing the player cam then you don't see this stuff. All you see is the player getting the ball for one second, doing something mildly uninteresting and then moving it on to someone else. But it means you won't get to see what the player's doing the rest of the time and why it's so important.
He reminds me of *Sterling in that sense of yesteryear. It's not exactly clear what it is he offers, and like it was for Raheem it can be frustrating because we've seen this previously explosive and prodigal talent go through the process of being coached into becoming a boring, no end product kind of guy (I think this is where a lot of the disappointment with Jesus stems from knowing how talented he really is). And yet somehow as by magic as soon as Sterling hit that age where players start to mature, his intelligent play started getting major results and this seen his productivity has hit heights he once promised to do as a youngster but on top of that he plays with maturity and contributes greatly to our play. Just think about how good Jesus can be at that age, knowing he's only a couple of years behind. I mean he's already starting up front for Brazil now! It'll be Stones next too.
*Just think with Sterling by the way, there are plenty of more obviously typical wingers with a lot of talent who can do things we never really see Sterling do (eg Zaha, Oxlade-Chamberlain etc). But there's a reason why he's got it in him to become a world great and not many others do.
Obviously he's not a better footballer than Aguero outright. But then again that's no insult, because which striker in the premier league is as good a footballer as Aguero at his best? Aguero can do things very very few footballers in the world can do, and it's a blessing we have him still to this day. But that doesn't mean Jesus doesn't have it in him to lead us to greatness one day when he hits his better years (23+). He has a gift that not many others have, a great amount of in play intelligence. It needs nurturing and when it comes out you'll all be glad you were there to witness it.
ps. If you don't think intelligence is that big a deal, then just look across the road at Pogba. He has arguably as much as Yaya had physically, arguably better technically and yet will never be quite as good as Yaya, because one was a genius on the pitch and the other is not. It's a legitimate reason why Gareth Barry has more PL winner medals than Gerrard, despite in many regards being a lesser player (except the one useful bit of course). I hate to use this example, but it's why so many people (rightly or wrongly before you go there) have in hindsight rated Rio Ferdinand so extremely highly. It's why England were for the previous 10 years so shit internationally. And it's why Raheem Sterling is top of the league.
He's hardly older than foden and brahim but judged as a veteran. The kid has a lot to his game. His instincts and workrate, the stuff you can't teach, are as good as they come. Look how much sterling has developed over the past few years. Besides mbappe, there's nobody close at that age. Still so much to come and so much room for him to grow
Well said. His hold up play was so much better than usual today. I apologise for the comparison but he's looking like the player Balotelli was trying to be for us back in 11/12
WeAreTheKippax
Well-Known Member
I’m really struggling to see the potential so many are hyping up. First touch and passing at times is seriously poor. Quite worrying if he is the apprent answer to Aguero.
Something is just missing from Jesus' play at the minute and has been for most of the calendar year. The spark he had in Brazil, and when he came over has just disappeared a bit, and he's made some really sloppy mistakes in the past 5 games since Aguero got injured and he's had a run.
Everything just looks like a lot of effort, lots of attempted flicks not coming off, lots of passes getting intercepted, getting tackled every time he tries to drop back to receive the ball and spin, jumping well to reach crosses but mis-heading them.
On form he makes these things look effortless and natural, and at the minute it looks like a slog.
I don't know if it's just a patch of bad form, a bit of end of season tiredness, just taking a while to get fit from his injury, thinking of the World Cup, but he's definitely nowhere near his best right now.
We've seen Sané go from poor to sublime from Sunday to Wednesday though, so hopefully he's on it at Southampton and has a great world cup. Next season is going to be a really important one for him at the club.
Everything just looks like a lot of effort, lots of attempted flicks not coming off, lots of passes getting intercepted, getting tackled every time he tries to drop back to receive the ball and spin, jumping well to reach crosses but mis-heading them.
On form he makes these things look effortless and natural, and at the minute it looks like a slog.
I don't know if it's just a patch of bad form, a bit of end of season tiredness, just taking a while to get fit from his injury, thinking of the World Cup, but he's definitely nowhere near his best right now.
We've seen Sané go from poor to sublime from Sunday to Wednesday though, so hopefully he's on it at Southampton and has a great world cup. Next season is going to be a really important one for him at the club.
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