Good Humans vs Sh*t Humans...

Stuuuuuu said:
I respect your right to an opinion but I have to say that I don't find it to be following logic.

"Eating fish or chicken does not equate to eating cats or dogs."
Most people (in this country) would agree with you as clearly people eat the former but not the latter. But what is the basis for this view? The way I see it, they are all sentient creatures who want to live; they all feel pain; they all experience a wide range of emotions; they all want to live. I would genuinely like to know what is the basis for treating some animals badly but others well. Is it based on their level of intelligence? If so, why does intelligence give more rights? Could we apply this to humans and give more rights to those with higher intelligence and mistreat those with learning disabilities?

"You can still have a connection with another lifeform that's not your own that you're not tempted to consume at convenience."
So are the rights of animals dependent on their relationship to human beings? Why? What makes humans the factor in this? If I have a connection with another person or animal, why should that give them more rights than the one I don't have a connection with?

"It's silly to say a meat eater cannot be an animal lover or have respect for them in the main."
Is it respectful to keep an animal pregnant for most of its life then forceably separate its young and place it to live in a crate until it becomes so weak that its legs break beneath it (veal production) or to fill a large plastic bag with male chicks until they suffocate (male chicks are useless in the egg industry so are killed by suffocation or by being thrown live into a grinding machine), or to castrate piglets with a tool that looks like a pair of pliers - with no anaesthetic whatsoever etc. etc. That's just the tip of the iceberg; I could go on all day.

If someone pays for this to happen, I don't see how they can logically describe themselves as an 'animal lover.' Why not just be honest and say that you don't care about animals used for food?

"What's your opinion on intelligent life, like dolphins eating fish, but then protects whales from sharks and play with Humans??"
My take on it is that they are carnivores, driven by instinct. There is a wealth of evidence that humans, historically, are largely herbivorous, possibly scavenging small amounts of meat very occasionally. It's clear that we are healthier eating plants. BUT even if we were carnivores or even if you argue that we are omnivores, that's OK (there is a debate to be had but I guess that's a separate discussion) - but we can't reasonably describe ourselves as 'animal lovers' if we support the animal agriculture industry which systematically causes unimaginable suffering. The point is that all animals need to eat to live. If they have evolved to instinctively eat other creatures, it's horrible but unavoidable. However, doing so when is is avoidable is obviously the key difference. And we don't have to treat animals the way we do in animal agriculture; it's a choice based on profit to use intensive farming methods which involve disgusting welfare standards. Or we could just avoid it altogether, which leads to better health, a greatly improved environment and, of course, a way, way, way better deal for animals.

Surely it's better to just be honest and say, "I don't care about animals except when I emotionally benefit from it."
Click to expand...

100% agree with you Stu, was posting something myself to point out the hypocrisy. You cannot say you care about animals and eat meat! There is no difference between animals other than barriers we've added ourselves.
 
Good Animal Husbandry. Applying care and empathy toward sustainable production of our animal food. From farm to plate in an ethical manner without need for distress and pain. Piglets being nueturered by pliers you say without an anesthetic, pigs gassed to death, ritual slaughter most foul to meet the needs and wants of some omnipresent entity hell bent on the infliction of pain. Really...really, is this the way we wish to source farmed food or shall we care for them and rear well before utilizing humane methods of slaughter such as captive-bolt stunning. As for those veal crates, how far as a species have we actually sunk by forcing a sentient creature to 14 weeks of solitary confinemenbt in a bleak wooden crate. Alongside the majority I am a meat eater but good animal husbandry should be at the forefront of everything we do.

​

 
Two Gun Bob said:
Good Animal Husbandry. Applying care and empathy toward sustainable production of our animal food. From farm to plate in an ethical manner without need for distress and pain. Piglets being nueturered by pliers you say without an anesthetic, pigs gassed to death, ritual slaughter most foul to meet the needs and wants of some omnipresent entity hell bent on the infliction of pain. Really...really, is this the way we wish to source farmed food or shall we care for them and rear well before utilizing humane methods of slaughter such as captive-bolt stunning. As for those veal crates, how far as a species have we actually sunk by forcing a sentient creature to 14 weeks of solitary confinemenbt in a bleak wooden crate. Alongside the majority I am a meat eater but good animal husbandry should be at the forefront of everything we do.

​

Click to expand...

There is no humane way. Dairy is a horrific industry, separating calves from their mothers, cycle of pregnancy and emotional distress.
 
RabidCity said:
There is no humane way. Dairy is a horrific industry, separating calves from their mothers, cycle of pregnancy and emotional distress.
Click to expand...

There are ways that are far more humane than the other ways previously mentioned and as meat eaters good animal husbandry should be addressed.
 
Last edited:
Bigga said:
You have pitted a multitude of answers that are complicated and intertwining and none of them are wrong as is my viewpoint. We, as a species are complicated. If a person were racist towards me and I found the same person stabbed and suffering from that wound I'd think twice before making a decision to help or walk away. If I didn't have that information, I'd step in.

We hate each other, we love each other. We kill each other, we love each other. You can extrapolate opposites from those examples.

We eat all types of food sources. I'm pretty sure you will find someone who dotes on a goldfish eating a tuna sandwich. You'll find dog lovers and cat haters, cat lovers and dog haters.

I could get myopic, couldn't I? I mean, if and when you step on a slug or worm, do you stop to bury it? Say a prayer? Unlikely as you don't share a potential emotional connection. Same with a fly or a midge, etc.

Animal agriculture is a different subject, entirely and is not the thread to be holding this kind of discussion because people don't want to see avoidable suffering for a small abandoned life.

These discussions have been held aplenty, but as a species Humans have been eating meat for 2 million years.

From Huffpost 2013

See, the converse to your argument is overharvesting the land.When the quinoa explosion happened 4 years ago, farmers in Peru suddenly had to produce more than they were used to, to cover a bump in orders and their land couldn't cope


https://spoonuniversity.com/lifestyle/the-ethical-reason-why-you-should-stop-eating-quinoa (VPN may be needed)

So, as you can see, there are pluses and minuses to all things, but this point, it's not the thread to examine the discussion.
Click to expand...
Not sure how to reply to that as you used a lot of words to not really say anything apart from something about overharvesting and something along the lines of, "It's OK if I contradict myself because other people do too".

But if we're talking about land use, it's worth noting that the vast majority of plant material is used to feed farm animals. As soon as we stop exploiting animals, we get our land back and restore the environment.
 
Stuuuuuu said:
Not sure how to reply to that as you used a lot of words to not really say anything apart from something about overharvesting and something along the lines of, "It's OK if I contradict myself because other people do too".

But if we're talking about land use, it's worth noting that the vast majority of plant material is used to feed farm animals. As soon as we stop exploiting animals, we get our land back and restore the environment.
Click to expand...

So, I take it you're vegan. You have NO animal products in your household, what you drive, what you wear, anything...?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top
✖
  AdBlock Detected
Bluemoon relies on advertising to pay our hosting fees. Please support the site by disabling your ad blocking software to help keep the forum sustainable. Thanks.