Liverpool Thread - 2022/23

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Ducado said:
So you are saying he's a curse ;-)

You have to admit their implosion is both interesting (from the psychological point of view, it's what happens to most cults) and enjoyable in equal measure

And despite what they may believe (that they are the most loved and respected club and fan base in the universe) the rest of the football world is enjoying just as much as us
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Klopp is a poisoned chalice.

He’ll get you a measure of short-term success, as he has at all of his clubs, at the expense of long-term struggle, warning signs of the latter being hidden over several seasons by the cult following he builds. He is a deal with the devil.

As opposed to Pep, who gets you sustained success *and* sets up the club for further success (though, not quite the dominance, which you can only get with him specifically) after he leaves.

That attribute of Pep—creating a foundation for a club to do well without him, both on and off the pitch, as long as it appoints a competent manager to replace him—is arguably the most overlooked.

Despite their achievements whilst managing clubs—and you begrudgingly have to acknowledge them—continuity is absolutely not something most other supposedly “top” managers provide. Ferguson and Wenger didn’t (the former seemingly sabotaging the club to protect his legacy and the latter stubbornly overstaying his effectiveness to devastating effect). Mourinho famously doesn’t. Neither do Tuchel or Conte. Even Ancelotti does not guarantee a proper foundation post-departure. And you certainly don’t get that with Klopp; it’s the exact opposite basically everywhere he has managed.

Only Pep has consistently done it, after also providing success during his tenure. Some might argue that it is a small sample (Barca, Bayern, City) and that they are all big clubs with big apparatus behind them that supports their success beyond the manager. And that he hasn’t won the CL since leaving Barca.

But I would argue that actually makes what Pep has done even more difficult. Building a foundation is even more complicated at such high profile clubs. Sustaining it even more difficult. The CL, too, is a poor barometer, as it is both largely a crapshoot and also a very corrupt competition (see UEFA treatment of City and favouritism toward Real Madrid).

And, once more, City wasn’t at the level we are now when he arrived. We were good but not at Barca and Bayern’s level. He has helped to build us in to a juggernaut, even despite our missing out on CL glory thus far. We are now truly a top, top club, attracting the best young players in the world, and that will persist even after he goes (hopefully not for some time, mind).

Pep is the holy grail.

Klopp is one of the other cups in the manager talent crypt and now Liverpool are realising the consequences.

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Trevor Morley's Tache said:
Interim manager at Chelsea for the remainder of the season and then Klopp next season, or do you think he'll go further afield?
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I think he goes to Spain next. Not sure he’ll want to manage another PL club after Liverpool (it undermines his cult grooming tactics) and I think he wants to prove his approach works everywhere Pep has managed. I think he sees Pep has his ‘legacy rival’, whether he publicly admits it.
 
Trevor Morley's Tache said:
The players appear to have stopped playing for him.
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i dont think stopped playing for him is right words. liverpools plan and always has been even with bodger was blow teams away in first 20 minutes then hoof it about. we controlled game even at 1 down we kept pass pass pass and just pissed them off
 
bluemoon32 said:
Former Liverpool striker Michael Owen does not think it is all doom and gloom, however.

"Liverpool's strength is that group of players who have been to the trenches and won together. That takes years of building. Pity they are all too old now. Owen said, speaking on BT Sport.

"I think Liverpool have got enough. Looking through their starting XI, there's nobody out there better than their goalkeeper except Eddy. Their right-back is unbelievably bad at defending, the left-back is a dirty twat, Virgil van Dijk is probably the best in the world when he is on form, which is never. Ibrahima Konate is brilliant at knitting.

"The front five are dodgy. Darwin Nunez was the hottest striker around last year but has now been found out. Cody Gakpo was one of the stars of the World Cup kissing team.

"When they bought Mohamed Salah, Sadio Mane and Roberto Firmino they weren't £100m players, they weren't the best in the world at the time and they never rose above mediocrity. Nunez could be anything from useless to worse than useless. He could be one of the best cake makers in the world in five years."
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Edited for accuracy.
 
SebastianBlue said:
Jurgen Klopp: "[I’m the] last man standing… I'm aware of the fact I'm sitting here because of the past, not because of what we did this season"

Pressure mounting and he is starting to unravel, as he did at Dortmund. And he’ll leave Liverpool in a similarly depleted state, which will see them struggle further for seasons to come.

Rinse and repeat at whichever club picks him up next.
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Mad Eyed Screamer said:
You are correct the song is not about Hillsborough exclusively but if the word "always" is included, when Liverpool fans were victims at Hillsborough, then how does the song not include Hillsborough?

If it isn't about Hillsborough then why not sing "always the victims, but not Hillsborough" that way it is clear 100% that it isn't about Hillsborough.
By using the word "always" meaning everytime, it is open to interpretation so don't be surprised the scousers have interpreted it differently to you.

In no way am I standing up for the scousers, but City fans should be better than this. There are plenty of songs to aim at them with scoring points over tragedies.
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I guess we will agree to disagree.
We are not scoring points over tragedies as the song is not about tragedies. Its about them causing mayhem misery and destruction wherever and whenever they go anywhere and then blaming others for what they have done. They are absolutely pathetic. They actively go out of their way to find offence with anything and everything. Then everyone runs around pandering and apologising to the needy scumbags.
 
melrose40yarder said:
Why are City coming out against our fans.They should be highlighting everything the feral scouse rats do and not let it go.I would love fans of all clubs to start singing justice for the 39 and see what the media and our PR department make of it.
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They’d just do what they always do and go bwaaaah hillsborough!
 
theres only one carlito said:
I wonder if years of trying to compete with us and for the most part coming off second best has had a motivational factor for them. Klopps insistence that they can’t compete with us and the fact they watched us purchase the best number 9 in the world has eroded that motivation even further. Then the club announce their owners arnt particularly interested in carrying on by putting it up for sale. Mane leaves, and their midfield relies on a 90 year old Milner and an amateur in Elliot. I think they have regressed big time and I don’t see it changing unless a fresh approach and idea is implemented. Long may it continue!
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Are you saying its our fault ?
 
PPT said:
Where's the ambiguity? The song is not about Hillsborough.
Let's hand over our list of songs and chants to the scousers so they can decide what we can and can't sing. Because that is effectively where this is heading. If you think it will stop at this song you are badly mistaken.
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It has already started. The Allez song the young Blues re-worded specifically said 'all the way to Kiev' and yet within weeks the dippers said it was about Sean Cox getting assaulted.
They will twist anything and everything to suit what they want.
 
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