Eh...?
Dassey confessed as to being there AT THE ALLEGED RAPE AND MURDER at the station (never said he was a witness in court)!!
Everything else would have been circumstantial and not enough to arrest Avery with, without placing him 'at the scene' with a first hand account.
That's what they used and why they tried them separately.
So, one of the very first things you have to ask is WHY they were tried separately.
Why, if the younger one was coerced, did they not get him to point the finger at Avery, in court?
Probably cos Dassey, a minor at the time, wouldn't have as it was bullsh*t.
Fire experts stated during the trial that it was consistent with burning a body. We can argue that one expert is better than another, but it is important to note that Zellner misled her fire expert - the photo shows the fire was dug into a pit which wasn't explained to him, and it lasted for a minimum of 6 hours according to witnesses, probably longer (instead of 4 she told him). There were at least 6 tyres used instead of the "maybe 2" she told him. Bone fragments were found in/attached to the steel wiring which remained from within the tyres.Like the guy who is the top expert in the States on burnt bodies saying the nature of the fire Scott Tadych claims Avery was having was in no way consistent with how it would look if a body was being burnt?
The amount of DNA the WSCL got was perfectly reasonable and actually on the lower end of the range reported for touch DNA (1.9 ng on the hood latch, ~5 ng for the key), and the amounts only look suspicious relative to the "experiments" KZ's team did. Ask yourself why didn't she test another groin swab for a simple comparison?Like the experts who roundly debunked the sweat DNA on Teresa’s hood latch?
i) Rahmlow spotted what he thought was a car matching that description. He told a cop at Cennex but it can be proven on the day this happened that Colburn wasn't working (so wouldn't have been dressed as a cop - even if you think he was busy planting evidence). A different police officer did call this report in however. As far as Rahmlow being independent, well nope, he recognised Colburn on the documentary as he he had been arrested by him for drink driving.Like the fact that Teresa’s Rav 4 was spotted by an independent witness 3 days after she went missing near Scott Tadych’s trailer, only to turn up on Avery’s property 2 days later?
It was actually more than 40 minutes. The Sturms were not the only two people searching the yard (confirmed by Earl Avery), so they were covering different ground. Earl testified in a pre trial hearing that he suggested a starting point for them and by following the perimeter around its a completely reasonable amount of time (if not a little slow). If she knew where it was in advance (which is alleged) then it took her a long time.Found by Pam Sturm just 20-25 minutes after starting to search an area that’s about 40 acres in size, contains thousands of vehicles, and her reason for finding it so quickly is that God led her to it?
I have not read anywhere that stated anything that said anything more certain than "possible human" which by the nature of language can also mean possibly not. The documentary edited the trial footage of that line of questioning.Like the bones in the quarry that Ken Kratz said only needed 20 seconds of attention because, according to him, it was inconclusive whether any of them were human only for it now to come out that a report stated some of them actually were human?
I can't dispute this and it is odd. I was surprised they didn't give more time to this given it was the only bit of doubt in the 10 episodes. I'm guessing Barb was reluctant to talk to the documentary after KZ accused Bobby publicly but there would have been other ways to investigate it further.Like Bobby Dassey claiming he saw Teresa go into Avery’s trailer and never saw her come out, only for his own mother to now fess up that this statement was a complete lie?
Tower pings are not reliable. Find someone who says otherwise and I'll show you an idiot, because it has been proven time and time again that they aren't. If you want to ignore that, Zellners incoherent theory is that Bobby caught her within 30 seconds and got her to turn off on Kuss Road. The remnants of the phone are ultimately found in a burn barrel at SA's trailer. At what point did she or her phone get 12 miles away?Like Teresa’s mobile pinging off a tower at 2.41pm 12 miles away from Avery’s property and after she was reported to have left? (Yet Bobby Dassey claims he saw her go in and not come out)
The documentary explained why Calumet County led the investigation and why the Manitowoc coroner was excluded. Irrespective of this, the crime lab was better qualified than the coroner to handle the excavation, and the analysis of the bones took place in a lab setting as would have been the case even if a coroner had been there watching. Zellner is all over the place here again and now its the Calumet fault preventing Manitowoc from pursuing justice. I thought it was supposed to be the other way around on all her other theories? Turn the argument around, if the Manitowoc coroner had been allowed onto the scene, wouldn't you and the documentary have a stronger argument that it was part of a cover up?Like the coroner who, after some of Teresa’s remains were reportedly found, was told to stay away or she would be arrested?
They aren't holes though, the documentary is disputing evidence and presenting it in a particular way, and you're trusting that to be gospel. For what its worth, I wouldn't describe Gorgonzola as a particularly hole-y cheese either.These aren’t loopholes mate - they’re big fuck-off gaping chasms in the prosecution’s case and there’s more of them than there is in a fucking Gorgonzola cheese.
Which she hasn't been able to do, because it wasn't.I’ll also add that one doesn’t need solid evidence that they didn’t do it to get a conviction overturned. That’s not how it works. All that needs to be shown is that the prosecution case was flawed.
Fire experts stated during the trial that it was consistent with burning a body. We can argue that one expert is better than another, but it is important to note that Zellner misled her fire expert - the photo shows the fire was dug into a pit which wasn't explained to him, and it lasted for a minimum of 6 hours according to witnesses, probably longer (instead of 4 she told him). There were at least 6 tyres used instead of the "maybe 2" she told him. Bone fragments were found in/attached to the steel wiring which remained from within the tyres.
The amount of DNA the WSCL got was perfectly reasonable and actually on the lower end of the range reported for touch DNA (1.9 ng on the hood latch, ~5 ng for the key), and the amounts only look suspicious relative to the "experiments" KZ's team did. Ask yourself why didn't she test another groin swab for a simple comparison?
I can't dispute this and it is odd. I was surprised they didn't give more time to this given it was the only bit of doubt in the 10 episodes. I'm guessing Barb was reluctant to talk to the documentary after KZ accused Bobby publicly but there would have been other ways to investigate it further.
All I would say is that Barb was a bit all over the place at that point in the documentary whereas Bobby has been consistent about it from the beginning. Barb's version of events still does not have TH leaving the property so not sure how it helps SA much. If you believe Barb, then that obviously throws doubt over Bobby's story and whether you can believe any part of it, but then I would throw back SA's version of events that day which is a complete and utter shit-show, which he has had to change on numerous occasions when family members have contradicted him.
Tower pings are not reliable. Find someone who says otherwise and I'll show you an idiot, because it has been proven time and time again that they aren't. If you want to ignore that, Zellners incoherent theory is that Bobby caught her within 30 seconds and got her to turn off on Kuss Road. The remnants of the phone are ultimately found in a burn barrel at SA's trailer. At what point did she or her phone get 12 miles away?
I meant how Barb created her own version of events based on what Bobby allegedly told her, which is different to Bobby's version of events. Admittedly that is not phrased much better than my first attempt, but hope you get the gist.Barb was at work that day.
That’s one of the reasons they were tried separately (Dassey changed his story and wouldn’t testify) but the fact that Avery was convicted without Dassey suggests the evidence against Avery was strong enough for a conviction anyway (for many on here, too much evidence) - evidenced by the guilty verdict. He had also been arrested and charged for the murder long before Dassey’s ‘confession’.
Do you not think about the logical aspects of this whole thing?
I'll have explain it to me cos I'm struggling to understand what you see.
What was the point of Brendan Dassey's 'confession' if they'd already had Avery charged with murder with the strength of 'too much evidence'??
Avery's alibi...?
Why would they undermine their own efforts harassing a kid who was not convincing, who placed the 'murder' in different places and who 'saw things' he clearly didn't see.
Unless he's playing the long game a la 'Keyser Sozé'...?
Now THAT would be something!!
I saw this post earlier in the week when I was in Kharkiv, and I've just remembered I wanted to address a few things. Not hoping to change anyones mind - the documentary is obviously very emotive and persuasive, but wanted to point out some inaccuracies or if they've intentionally missed out some salient information to mislead viewers. I would hope people realise why its in the documentary makers self interests to do so. Its up to people to make their own minds up, but you should only do so when you have a an informed viewpoint, and not just base it on the documentary.
Fire experts stated during the trial that it was consistent with burning a body. We can argue that one expert is better than another, but it is important to note that Zellner misled her fire expert - the photo shows the fire was dug into a pit which wasn't explained to him, and it lasted for a minimum of 6 hours according to witnesses, probably longer (instead of 4 she told him). There were at least 6 tyres used instead of the "maybe 2" she told him. Bone fragments were found in/attached to the steel wiring which remained from within the tyres.
The amount of DNA the WSCL got was perfectly reasonable and actually on the lower end of the range reported for touch DNA (1.9 ng on the hood latch, ~5 ng for the key), and the amounts only look suspicious relative to the "experiments" KZ's team did. Ask yourself why didn't she test another groin swab for a simple comparison?
i) Rahmlow spotted what he thought was a car matching that description. He told a cop at Cennex but it can be proven on the day this happened that Colburn wasn't working (so wouldn't have been dressed as a cop - even if you think he was busy planting evidence). A different police officer did call this report in however. As far as Rahmlow being independent, well nope, he recognised Colburn on the documentary as he he had been arrested by him for drink driving.
ii)More importantly, someone else spotted the same vehicle and established it wasn't TH's.
So no one can confirm the car left the Avery property.
It was actually more than 40 minutes. The Sturms were not the only two people searching the yard (confirmed by Earl Avery), so they were covering different ground. Earl testified in a pre trial hearing that he suggested a starting point for them and by following the perimeter around its a completely reasonable amount of time (if not a little slow). If she knew where it was in advance (which is alleged) then it took her a long time.
I have not read anywhere that stated anything that said anything more certain than "possible human" which by the nature of language can also mean possibly not. The documentary edited the trial footage of that line of questioning.
I can't dispute this and it is odd. I was surprised they didn't give more time to this given it was the only bit of doubt in the 10 episodes. I'm guessing Barb was reluctant to talk to the documentary after KZ accused Bobby publicly but there would have been other ways to investigate it further.
All I would say is that Barb was a bit all over the place at that point in the documentary whereas Bobby has been consistent about it from the beginning. Barb's version of events still does not have TH leaving the property so not sure how it helps SA much. If you believe Barb, then that obviously throws doubt over Bobby's story and whether you can believe any part of it, but then I would throw back SA's version of events that day which is a complete and utter shit-show, which he has had to change on numerous occasions when family members have contradicted him.
Tower pings are not reliable. Find someone who says otherwise and I'll show you an idiot, because it has been proven time and time again that they aren't. If you want to ignore that, Zellners incoherent theory is that Bobby caught her within 30 seconds and got her to turn off on Kuss Road. The remnants of the phone are ultimately found in a burn barrel at SA's trailer. At what point did she or her phone get 12 miles away?
The documentary explained why Calumet County led the investigation and why the Manitowoc coroner was excluded. Irrespective of this, the crime lab was better qualified than the coroner to handle the excavation, and the analysis of the bones took place in a lab setting as would have been the case even if a coroner had been there watching. Zellner is all over the place here again and now its the Calumet fault preventing Manitowoc from pursuing justice. I thought it was supposed to be the other way around on all her other theories? Turn the argument around, if the Manitowoc coroner had been allowed onto the scene, wouldn't you and the documentary have a stronger argument that it was part of a cover up?
They aren't holes though, the documentary is disputing evidence and presenting it in a particular way, and you're trusting that to be gospel. For what its worth, I wouldn't describe Gorgonzola as a particularly hole-y cheese either.
She is desperate for a loophole and hasn't found one despite the "chasms".
Which she hasn't been able to do, because it wasn't.
Like?Then you read stuff that’s left out of the documentary and it starts to add up.