Mancini Coaching Article by Peter North

Fantastic post nick. A real eye-opener.

Kind of explains to me why I've always liked Sven, why I've always thought Roy Hodgson was one of the best managers in the Prem, and why I'm now in love with Mancini (and why I always knew Hughes was a total waste of space).

I've not heard of this 'Gentleman's Club' though, and am getting nothing on Google. Could you explain more what it is?
 
nick.nikky said:
Wheelsy said:
I just had a flash back to nick.nikky's formation threads under Sven...
Click to expand...

I'm not the guilty party here though it's almost identical, but you're actually spot on by proxy - Mancini incorporates the same exact defensive system we had under Sven (pressure and support) and even started out using 4-4-1-1 before scrapping it and venturing into another one of Sven's prefered system; the under England much scolded 4-3-1-2.


The one thing I didn't like about the article was for him to call it "catenaccio". In broad terms it was somewhat correct, but this is a mix of Rinus Michels, Sven's, Bob Houghton's/Roy Hodgson's (from their days at swedish 1st division), Antonio Herrara and Nils Liedholm's school of football which Sven used to garner success around Europe with an inferior Swedish team and later used to polish Benfica and Lazio (and more) into wonderfully organized sides. It transfered in it's initial form to Italian football via Nils Liedholm's proteges (Ancelotti, Capello, Trapattoni, Scala, Maldini, Baresi, Conti) and it got solidified by Sven's Houghton/Hodgson/Rinus Michels/Swedish mix.

That's why all of these guys - Sven, Mancini, Hodgson, Capello, Trapattoni, Ancelotti and Scala... all have a very similar brand of football. They're all intertwined and know each other on a personal level. In short:

*The Swedish/Italian mob - Capello was assistant coach under Liedholm and manager under him when he was chief advisor for Roma. Leidholm coached Milan. Trapattoni played with and trained under Liedholm. Both of em used Liedholm youth graduates Maldini and Baresi (Liedholm let them have their debutes at 16 and 17 respectively). Bruno Conti was given the nod at 19. Ancelotti at 20. Sven was handed the Roma job under Liedholm. Sven coached Ancelotti. Sven coached Mancini (also assistant coach under Sven). Both Sven and Mancini coached Sampdoria, Lazio and City. Ancelotti currently coaches Chelsea for Sven's pal Abramovich. Capello snagged the England job. Brian Kid worked for Sven, Brian kid works for Mancini... etc...

*The Swedish/Fulham mob - Bob Houghton was assistant to Bobby Robson at Ipswich. They played together at Fulham. Bobby R later managed Fulham. Houghton went to Sweden and Malmö FF where he took them to the European Cup finals. Through Houghton's advice Hodgson got hired by Halmstad where he introduced what he called the "English school of football". Later by Malmö. Hodgson coached Mancini's Inter. Hodgson coached the United Arab Emirates (hehe). Hodgson was on cue for the England job when they decided to go for Sven instead. Hodgson is back at Fulham, where it all started with Robson and Houghton, a job he executes for Fayed, with his new player Geovanni... etc...

So in reality it's not "Italian" football but a mixture of English(zonal defense and training application)/Swedish(team play. Zonal became mixed zonal or pressure and support)/Dutch football(total football)/Italian(catenaccio) - and it's initially mostly Sven's brand of football adopted by the "Gentlemans Club" and perfected through trade. Pure catenaccio is an entirely different thing.

And since Sven was the first to peice them all together, it should if anything, be called Svenaccio or something because what he did was to fuse all of it together into a perfect system as well as introducing it in both Portugal and Italy with great success. There'd been no Mourinho without a Sven... just as there would have been no Sven without a Lidholm or a Hodgson... or a Hodgson without a Houghton... or a Houghton without a Robson.

And there most certainly wouldn't have been a Mancini. Catenacio - it is not.


This also touches on another subject. Somehow all of this manages to pass over the pundits heads, but there are coaches that truly are worth more than others on so many levels. And Hodgson is one of those guys. He's connected with The Gentlemens Club. Just like Mancini.

Hughes, the arrogant twat, never got this. Cook, I'm sure, is still pretty clueless. The former City board certanly didn't know fuck all. But ADUG is on cue... Hodgson's United Arab Emirates pals... fucking ADUG... thank you Shinawatra...

Managers like Sven are in this sense is more than just managers. They are indeed a fucking Dons. When Sven calls his sheik friends (the real ones) or picks up the phone and gives his opinion on his former player Ancelotti, Kaka deal killer and Ronaldinho hirerer Ancelotti, to his buddy Abramovich - shit will happen.

You simply do not fuck with these guys. They all know each other. And they rule football behind the svenery.


It is impossible to describe how much the appointment of Mancini (or Sven at his time) really means and meant. Hughes was a fucking parenthesis in a job Sven got started. The money he spent, the gloating little prick, came about through Sven's connections. And now it's sorted. On and upwards.

Let's hope the board isn't as lax this time around...
Click to expand...

I tried to find your earlier posts about Sven NN, but they seem to have lost somewhere in the great Damocletian underworld that is early Bluemoon. Don't suppose you could find them again and repost if they add to the story?
 
What the hell is happening here? Posts just disappearing...

Just wanted to show my gratitude to nick.nikky, who in my mind is the greatest Bluemoon poster of all time. Hail to the chief!
 
johnny crossan said:
nick.nikky said:
I'm not the guilty party here though it's almost identical, but you're actually spot on by proxy - Mancini incorporates the same exact defensive system we had under Sven (pressure and support) and even started out using 4-4-1-1 before scrapping it and venturing into another one of Sven's prefered system; the under England much scolded 4-3-1-2.


The one thing I didn't like about the article was for him to call it "catenaccio". In broad terms it was somewhat correct, but this is a mix of Rinus Michels, Sven's, Bob Houghton's/Roy Hodgson's (from their days at swedish 1st division), Antonio Herrara and Nils Liedholm's school of football which Sven used to garner success around Europe with an inferior Swedish team and later used to polish Benfica and Lazio (and more) into wonderfully organized sides. It transfered in it's initial form to Italian football via Nils Liedholm's proteges (Ancelotti, Capello, Trapattoni, Scala, Maldini, Baresi, Conti) and it got solidified by Sven's Houghton/Hodgson/Rinus Michels/Swedish mix.

That's why all of these guys - Sven, Mancini, Hodgson, Capello, Trapattoni, Ancelotti and Scala... all have a very similar brand of football. They're all intertwined and know each other on a personal level. In short:

*The Swedish/Italian mob - Capello was assistant coach under Liedholm and manager under him when he was chief advisor for Roma. Leidholm coached Milan. Trapattoni played with and trained under Liedholm. Both of em used Liedholm youth graduates Maldini and Baresi (Liedholm let them have their debutes at 16 and 17 respectively). Bruno Conti was given the nod at 19. Ancelotti at 20. Sven was handed the Roma job under Liedholm. Sven coached Ancelotti. Sven coached Mancini (also assistant coach under Sven). Both Sven and Mancini coached Sampdoria, Lazio and City. Ancelotti currently coaches Chelsea for Sven's pal Abramovich. Capello snagged the England job. Brian Kid worked for Sven, Brian kid works for Mancini... etc...

*The Swedish/Fulham mob - Bob Houghton was assistant to Bobby Robson at Ipswich. They played together at Fulham. Bobby R later managed Fulham. Houghton went to Sweden and Malmö FF where he took them to the European Cup finals. Through Houghton's advice Hodgson got hired by Halmstad where he introduced what he called the "English school of football". Later by Malmö. Hodgson coached Mancini's Inter. Hodgson coached the United Arab Emirates (hehe). Hodgson was on cue for the England job when they decided to go for Sven instead. Hodgson is back at Fulham, where it all started with Robson and Houghton, a job he executes for Fayed, with his new player Geovanni... etc...

So in reality it's not "Italian" football but a mixture of English(zonal defense and training application)/Swedish(team play. Zonal became mixed zonal or pressure and support)/Dutch football(total football)/Italian(catenaccio) - and it's initially mostly Sven's brand of football adopted by the "Gentlemans Club" and perfected through trade. Pure catenaccio is an entirely different thing.

And since Sven was the first to peice them all together, it should if anything, be called Svenaccio or something because what he did was to fuse all of it together into a perfect system as well as introducing it in both Portugal and Italy with great success. There'd been no Mourinho without a Sven... just as there would have been no Sven without a Lidholm or a Hodgson... or a Hodgson without a Houghton... or a Houghton without a Robson.

And there most certainly wouldn't have been a Mancini. Catenacio - it is not.


This also touches on another subject. Somehow all of this manages to pass over the pundits heads, but there are coaches that truly are worth more than others on so many levels. And Hodgson is one of those guys. He's connected with The Gentlemens Club. Just like Mancini.

Hughes, the arrogant twat, never got this. Cook, I'm sure, is still pretty clueless. The former City board certanly didn't know fuck all. But ADUG is on cue... Hodgson's United Arab Emirates pals... fucking ADUG... thank you Shinawatra...

Managers like Sven are in this sense is more than just managers. They are indeed a fucking Dons. When Sven calls his sheik friends (the real ones) or picks up the phone and gives his opinion on his former player Ancelotti, Kaka deal killer and Ronaldinho hirerer Ancelotti, to his buddy Abramovich - shit will happen.

You simply do not fuck with these guys. They all know each other. And they rule football behind the svenery.


It is impossible to describe how much the appointment of Mancini (or Sven at his time) really means and meant. Hughes was a fucking parenthesis in a job Sven got started. The money he spent, the gloating little prick, came about through Sven's connections. And now it's sorted. On and upwards.

Let's hope the board isn't as lax this time around...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

So what's all this got to do with Peter North and De Jongs tash?
 
Top post as ever nick.nikky, I often find that the people who naively and blindly backed Leslie to the hilt are the very same people who ridiculed and disrespected Sven's achievements at the club.

Some of of us are aware of the foundations that he built in his very short time at the club, all while having to deal with the interference and impatience of the Thai crackpot.

And it's nice to know that I'm not the only one who is grateful of Sven's efforts at the club.

And while I can praise Sven and demonstrate my appreciation, I hold little respect for Hughes. Not all of us were oblivious to his general sweeping ineptitude, and I for one am delighted that we now have a capable man at the helm.
 
Wheelsy said:
I just had a flash back to nick.nikky's formation threads under Sven...
Click to expand...
My first thoughts also. Nick.Nicky's posts were something else,surreal, how about a mention in classics? I'd like to peruse them and attempt to make them out
 
*singingtheblues* said:
Top post as ever nick.nikky, I often find that the people who naively and blindly backed Leslie to the hilt are the very same people who ridiculed and disrespected Sven's achievements at the club.

Some of of us are aware of the foundations that he built in his very short time at the club, all while having to deal with the interference and impatience of the Thai crackpot.

And it's nice to know that I'm not the only one who is grateful of Sven's efforts at the club.

And while I can praise Sven and demonstrate my appreciation, I hold little respect for Hughes. Not all of us were oblivious to his general sweeping ineptitude, and I for one am delighted that we now have a capable man at the helm.
Click to expand...

What were these foundations? Is there anything left after Leslie's Khmer Rouge assault on our club?

I had Sven down as tactically way superior, obviously, but am not aware of what he tried to build at City. Just wondering.
 
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