Next Labour Leader - Miliband Resigns

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Damocles

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You really are very silly, it is not possible to state with absolute certainty whether a child born in leafy suburbia to a well healed family this morning, will fare better than one born in less advantageous circumstances two minutes earlier, because they've yet to take their first dump, Only a study of historical data can give any indication as to what might happen to them and we need to contrast and compare what opportunities existed then and now, whether as a society right now, social class is more or less a defining factor in life chances and so on.

If, as SWP states, it's all about choices, that statement is true only if those choices are available to all people to choose, if those choices are not available to all people then the statement is eroneous, because it can't be all about choices if those choices are not there for all people.

You should be batting on my side on this, you're the prove it king.

The problem is that I read the actual study. It categorically states that the defining factor is education of the parents and not social class.

This is generally why I don't bat on your side, I don't post links to crap articles and instead read the original source material.
 

The perfect fumble

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The problem is that I read the actual study. It categorically states that the defining factor is education of the parents and not social class.

This is generally why I don't bat on your side, I don't post links to crap articles and instead read the original source material.

And that's your reply.
 

cibaman

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I'm only economically right wing, which usually wins the Tories my vote. I'm socially libertarian and as with all things, there is no party that suits my views even remotely.

Back to Corbyn, I have a naive curiosity to see how this pans out. As an expat with no plans on returning in the short term, him getting in won't affect me but what I do worry about is if he scares the electorate and the Tories are returned in 2020 with Labour in tatters, it allows them a free hand to lurch further to the right which is not a good thing.

Many disagree but I think the Lib Adams putting the hand brake on the Tories in 2010 was a good thing. And a similar arrangement would have been better for the UKIP 2015 than the situation there is now.

It all depends on how ruthless Corbyn and his supporters are in removing the Blairite "virus". If they take advantage of his honeymoon period to re-write Labour's rule book, return power from the PLP to the Party Conference and make it easier for centre right MPs to be de-selected then there will be an SDP type split. Whether that would be more successful than in the 80s is debatable, it would need a much greater number of MPs to defect.

If Corbyn is more conciliatory, allows the likes of Kendall to continue to have a voice, then the centre right might just bide their time and wait for Corbyn to fail.
 

urban genie

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It all depends on how ruthless Corbyn and his supporters are in removing the Blairite "virus". If they take advantage of his honeymoon period to re-write Labour's rule book, return power from the PLP to the Party Conference and make it easier for centre right MPs to be de-selected then there will be an SDP type split. Whether that would be more successful than in the 80s is debatable, it would need a much greater number of MPs to defect.

If Corbyn is more conciliatory, allows the likes of Kendall to continue to have a voice, then the centre right might just bide their time and wait for Corbyn to fail.


I think a lot will depend on this new group they are forming between them, if they look like being a deliberate thorn in his side his supporters will react. Also I think progress with have to be dissmissed from having an influence in the party for Corbyn to be successful
 

Damocles

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It all depends on how ruthless Corbyn and his supporters are in removing the Blairite "virus". If they take advantage of his honeymoon period to re-write Labour's rule book, return power from the PLP to the Party Conference and make it easier for centre right MPs to be de-selected then there will be an SDP type split. Whether that would be more successful than in the 80s is debatable, it would need a much greater number of MPs to defect.

If Corbyn is more conciliatory, allows the likes of Kendall to continue to have a voice, then the centre right might just bide their time and wait for Corbyn to fail.

I think you've pretty much got it right there. It will be genuinely interesting either way, cannot imagine that the centrists in the party will do anything drastic and will probably just fall back in line until after the next election.

The best question in this thread is if there are any non-Labour voters who would consider voting for Corbyn in a national election against Cameron or his replacement. I'm a non-Labour voter and he'd have a lot of work to do to convince me, let alone people who are more to the right which is most of England
 

Danbert

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The best question in this thread is if there are any non-Labour voters who would consider voting for Corbyn in a national election against Cameron or his replacement.

I've been voting Green since 1997 and would definitely return to voting Labour if Corbyn was the leader.
 

Damocles

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I've been voting Green since 1997 and would definitely return to voting Labour if Corbyn was the leader.

It was more wondering if he could take the average Tory/Lab swing voter than bringing in from parties with not a great amount of numbers such as the Greens.
 

Danbert

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It was more wondering if he could take the average Tory/Lab swing voter than bringing in from parties with not a great amount of numbers such as the Greens.

It would be even better if he could engage some of the 35% of the population who failed to vote at all.

A lot of these people hold the view that there's no difference between politicians and to be honest i think they've been right. The Labour party have just been Tory light since 1997
 
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