Political relations between UK-EU

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bluethrunthru said:
much the same applies to people coming here - you meet certain criteria and you can live here subject to certain rules. Sad that some categorise that as us flexing our sovereignty muscle but when others do it then its fascism - I can see we will all get along swimmingly.
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I'm not the one constantly telling everybody that they can't travel/reside
in Europe, tell those that are.
As long as they're not fascists.
 
WRicko said:
Boris practically said as much so yes

Do you think we won’t want in Erasmus or great access for services or passporting for banks or great data sharing to fight crime ?
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Tell me where he's said we want to get back what we had, Erasmus is being
replaced with our own arrangement, we are not part of the EU.
 
WRicko said:
Depends how you Phrase it Channel 4 I think it was had a debate show and had poll company ask people what they wanted to keep or loose from the EU Single Market Custom Union etc and a majority wanted Freedom of movement but the politicians on the panel even the remain ones basically wrote it off as how the question was worded if you ask people do they want Free Movement to move to the EU you get one answer if you ask if they want Free Movement for people to come here you get another answer
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No, it doesn't depend on how you phrase it, and a poll held by a left wing,
little watched channel is irrelevant. You're presenting what you want and believe as fact, it's far from it, the govt. has a big majority, and one of its
policies is the points based system. All this has been said and done for ages mate, we're getting what Priti says we're getting, the SM and CU are now
just a construct of an organisation in Brussels, all in all, these arguments are dead.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
Having delivered successful change programmes for half of my career and successfully received them operationally for the other half, I am pretty familiar with the impact it can have on individual, group, or organisation. I think you will find that most on here are past the stage you describe on your consultancy course.View attachment 7514

if you take a typical change curve, I think most on here are way past depression, stage 4, many are past acceptance Stage 5 and are actively looking at what the new arrangements and relationship will mean. Stage 6.

My point was, let’s not revisit the past as that will certainly send Some of us us back to stage 2 and stage 4. No matter what your beliefs about the EU are, best we all concentrate on stage 6.
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Whilst my experience on here and indeed a good number of the posts over recent days, might lead me to disagree with your view that:

"......I think most on here are way past depression, stage 4, many are past acceptance Stage 5 and are actively looking at what the new arrangements and relationship will mean. Stage 6......"

I whole-heartedly agree with your view that:

"My point was, let’s not revisit the past as that will certainly send Some of us us back to stage 2 and stage 4. No matter what your beliefs about the EU are, best we all concentrate on stage 6."

Interesting that when I made such suggestions the other day I got pulled up
 
mcfc1632 said:
Whilst my experience on here and indeed a good number of the posts over recent days, might lead me to disagree with your view that:

"......I think most on here are way past depression, stage 4, many are past acceptance Stage 5 and are actively looking at what the new arrangements and relationship will mean. Stage 6......"

I whole-heartedly agree with your view that:

"My point was, let’s not revisit the past as that will certainly send Some of us us back to stage 2 and stage 4. No matter what your beliefs about the EU are, best we all concentrate on stage 6."

Interesting that when I made such suggestions the other day I got pulled up
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You should have used a change curve graph.
 
BobKowalski said:
No, they don’t. Non EU immigration is handled by the individual member nations, each of whom has their own criteria.

From 2022 there will be a new electronic system for citizens of non EU countries to travel to the Schengen area, basically an electronic authorisation replacing the visa system which will grant you a 90 day stay. It will encompass 60 countries.
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Sigh.. ok if you won’t get there yourself I’ll get there for you...

If freedom of movement was such a great idea then the EU nations would have extended it to elsewhere too, not just Europe.

The fact is, it does obviously cause issues and that’s why they haven’t extended it to elsewhere.
 
Ric said:
Sadly, I don’t think any of us will be at all surprised about the policies, priorities and decisions that will come forwards in the next 12-18 months. Even Tory MPs are starting to get anxious it.
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That tweet was 'unavailable'

But, what I was meaning is that I would fully expect that there will be significant investment in the midlands and North - prioritised above other areas of the UK.

Given some of the 'Tories - what are they like.....' posts and attitudes we see a lot of on here - then I thought that would be a surprise to some people.

I do not say this as a Tory supporter - as I am not - just that it is such an obvious thing for them to do - indeed an essential thing for them to do if they are to have any hope at the next GE.
 
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squirtyflower said:
Do you really believe the Ukraine are joining the EU?
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.............and I am sure that the existing members are looking forward positively to the 'investment opportunity' (aka burden) that membership for Albania, Bosnia and others will enforce upon them.
 
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mcfc1632 said:
That tweet was 'unavailable'

But, what I was meaning is that I would fully expect that there will be significant investment in the midlands and North - prioritised above other areas of the UK.

Given some of the 'Tories - what are they like' attitudes on here then I thought that would be a surprise to some people.

I do not say this as a Tory supporter - as I am not - just that it is such an obvious thing for them to do - indeed and essential thing for them to do if they are to have any hope at the next GE.
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I'm not sure what this has to do with the thread title but the structural bias to trad Tory (rich) areas is still there - e.g. a lower council tax base means councils in more deprived areas don't raise as much money from the same percentage increase in council tax.
 
Ancient Citizen said:
No, it doesn't depend on how you phrase it, and a poll held by a left wing,
little watched channel is irrelevant. You're presenting what you want and believe as fact, it's far from it, the govt. has a big majority, and one of its
policies is the points based system. All this has been said and done for ages mate, we're getting what Priti says we're getting, the SM and CU are now
just a construct of an organisation in Brussels, all in all, these arguments are dead.
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This last day has emphasised why I was hoping that the thread might move on from the past and look to the future.

@Saddleworth2 these last days has also demonstrated why I do believe that you were possibly somewhat optimistic on where people on here are on the 'change journey'.

Perhaps you can deploy some of your experience to help then to progress up the curve?
 
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mcfc1632 said:
This last day has emphasised why I was hoping that the thread might move on from the past and look to the future.

@Saddleworth2 these last days has also demonstrated why I do believe that you were possibly somewhat optimistic on where people on here are on the 'change journey'.

Perhaps you can deploy some of your experience to help then to progress up the curve?
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No need. That conversation was about future movement of people processes between UK and EU.
 
hilts said:
Just vote for a party that wants to rejoin next election mate:-)
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That won’t happen, but would bet most parties, and most votes will go to parties offering, closer alignment to the single market, and N.Ireland. Enough to beat the tories, remains to be seen.
 
blueparrot said:
That won’t happen, but would bet most parties, and most votes will go to parties offering, closer alignment to the single market, and N.Ireland. Enough to beat the tories, remains to be seen.
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If there isn’t a significant enough economic hit, felt in the majority of people’s back pockets, like there isn’t looking likely to be, this would be absolute suicide for Starmer to go down this route.

If he focuses on maintaining our distance with the EU, keeps at least very similar immigration controls as the Tories have put into place, but campaigns for economic improvements for many, whilst ignoring the social justice stuff, he’ll walk it.

His problem is his MPs.
 
Vic said:
You don't get it. "Looking forward" means that rights we enjoyed as EU citizens must now go in the memory hole.
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I do get it mate. But thats true isn't it. It is a memory. Maybe its you that doesn't get it?
For right or wrong, we lost the argument.
Until a party outside Scotland decides to back rejoin, memories are all we have. I've accepted that and am now looking at what improvements can be made to the current deal.
 
blueparrot said:
That won’t happen, but would bet most parties, and most votes will go to parties offering, closer alignment to the single market, and N.Ireland. Enough to beat the tories, remains to be seen.
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I know it won’t happen:-) Lib Dem’s will have rejoin in there no doubt, Tories won’t for sure. labour will be in a pickle. I just laugh when I see people mentioning fptp as a negative even when they have spent their lives voting Labour.
 
hilts said:
I know it won’t happen:-) Lib Dem’s will have rejoin in there no doubt, Tories won’t for sure. labour will be in a pickle. I just laugh when I see people mentioning fptp as a negative even when they have spent their lives voting Labour.
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4 years is a long time, I pretty sure Labour policy will be closer to being closer to S.M than anything else, Liberal not sure, but if they have any sense rejoining will be put on the back burner and they'd see single market as a first step. I'm sure by then though the election will be foought on other issues and would be very surprised to see the tories winning a majority.
The big unknown though is the SNP. They will be the 3 rd party, and would be the obvious partners for Labour to form a government. We know they will have a rejoin policy, question is would they support Labour in government, and in joining N.Ireland with the single market deal, or would they insist on only voting to rejoin.
 
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