Qualifying for 2019/20 CL & EL

[keith's curle]

I was wondering about who might qualify for next season in Europe, considering who might win the current comps (Euro and domestic) so looked the criteria up as I couldn't remember.

It's kind of straightforward, but there's some interesting possible twists. To explain:

Top 3 from PL go straight into CL. 4th place should go straight in to group stage as well* but their place can be usurped if an English team outside top 4 win the EL. Chelsea and Arsenal are both currently still in the EL.

*4th place don't go into the play-offs anymore, it's straight in to the group stage from this year.

This means that Chelsea or Arsenal could miss out on 4th place but still take the CL spot from, oh, I don't know, United maybe! Chelsea did it to Spurs a few years ago, and United did it to someone (I forget who).


Places in the EL should go to 5th in PL + League cup winners + FA cup winners.

I think we can all agree we'll make top 4 this year, so as we won the League cup, 6th place gets that. If we win the FA cup then 7th will also get a place.
Wolves are currently 7th, with Watford 8th and only one point behind. The permutations are too great to bother listing, but Wolves could be looking for something against Liverpool in the final game of the season in order to secure EL. Then again, if they are in the FA cup final against us they may also know they can lose and still get the EL place.

That said, given the season start Burnley had they may all be trying to avoid the EL...

Here are some links for anybody interested:
https://www.premierleague.com/european-qualification-explained
https://www.skysports.com/football/...ication-is-affected-by-the-efl-cup-and-beyond
https://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/news/newsid=2499801.html

 

[JimB]

Top 3 from PL go straight into CL. 4th place should go straight in to group stage as well* but their place can be usurped if an English team outside top 4 win the EL. Chelsea and Arsenal are both currently still in the EL.

*4th place don't go into the play-offs anymore, it's straight in to the group stage from this year.

This means that Chelsea or Arsenal could miss out on 4th place but still take the CL spot from, oh, I don't know, United maybe! Chelsea did it to Spurs a few years ago, and United did it to someone (I forget who).

I'm not sure that you've got this right. It is now possible for England to have up to five teams competing in the Champions League. If Arsenal or Chelsea finish outside of the top four but win the Europa League, then the only change that that will effect is that they will qualify for the CL next season in addition to the top four.

The 4th placed team is only in danger if English clubs that have finished outside the top four win both the Champions League AND the Europa League. Given that Liverpool and City are virtual shoo-ins for CL qualification, that scenario can now only happen this season if either Spurs or Man Utd finish outside the top four and win the CL and if Arsenal or Chelsea finish outside the top four and win the EL.

A fairly unlikely outcome, I think it's fair to say.

 

[aguero93:20]

A fairly unlikely outcome, I think it's fair to say.

Masterful understatement.

 

[keith's curle]

I'm not sure that you've got this right. It is now possible for England to have up to five teams competing in the Champions League. If Arsenal or Chelsea finish outside of the top four but win the Europa League, then the only change that that will effect is that they will qualify for the CL next season in addition to the top four.

The 4th placed team is only in danger if English clubs that have finished outside the top four win both the Champions League AND the Europa League. Given that Liverpool and City are virtual shoo-ins for CL qualification, that scenario can now only happen this season if either Spurs or Man Utd finish outside the top four and win the CL and if Arsenal or Chelsea finish outside the top four and win the EL.

A fairly unlikely outcome, I think it's fair to say.

That's what I thought originally, but was wondering about the specifics. When I looked it up, I read this on the UEFA website under 'Key Changes' (link in o.p.):

UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE

Group stage
There will now be 26 teams automatically qualified as per the access list drawn up from the UEFA association coefficients at the end of 2016/17.
For 2018/19 they will be ...
UEFA Champions League holders (1)
UEFA Europa League holders (1)
Top four from associations ranked 1st to 4th: Spain, Germany, England, Italy (16)
Top two from associations ranked 5th and 6th: France, Russia (4)
Champions of associations ranked 7th to 10th: Portugal, Ukraine, Belgium, Turkey (4)

• If the UEFA Champions League holders have qualified for the group stage via their domestic championship, the vacancy will be filled by the champions of the association ranked 11th (Czech Republic), who otherwise compete in the champions path
• If the UEFA Europa League holders have qualified for the group stage via their domestic championship, the vacancy will be filled by the third-placed club from the association ranked fifth (France), who otherwise compete in the league path
• An association may have a maximum of five teams in the group stage

It does say at some point that there is a maximum of 5 teams from any one country, but note the part I've highlighted in red. This very definitely says if e.g. City win the CL then the slot goes to another country.

I could easily have this wrong - it's badly worded on some of the sites I looked at- but that's how I read it.
I'll go and watch the UEFA video explanation and see if that helps!

 

[JimB]

It does say at some point that there is a maximum of 5 teams from any one country, but note the part I've highlighted in red. This very definitely says if e.g. City win the CL then the slot goes to another country.

I could easily have this wrong - it's badly worded on some of the sites I looked at- but that's how I read it.
I'll go and watch the UEFA video explanation and see if that helps!

That only applies if the team winning the CL has already qualified by finishing in the top 4. If the team winning the CL fails to finish in the top 4, then that team gets the extra slot and joins the top 4 in competing for the following season's CL.

The only way in which the 4th placed PL team this season can be demoted to the Europa League next season is if two PL teams that have failed to finish in the top 4 win both the CL and the EL.

 

[keith's curle]

I'm not sure that you've got this right. It is now possible for England to have up to five teams competing in the Champions League. If Arsenal or Chelsea finish outside of the top four but win the Europa League, then the only change that that will effect is that they will qualify for the CL next season in addition to the top four.

The 4th placed team is only in danger if English clubs that have finished outside the top four win both the Champions League AND the Europa League. Given that Liverpool and City are virtual shoo-ins for CL qualification, that scenario can now only happen this season if either Spurs or Man Utd finish outside the top four and win the CL and if Arsenal or Chelsea finish outside the top four and win the EL.

A fairly unlikely outcome, I think it's fair to say.

Going back through it, you're right about Chelsea or Arsenal being a fifth team in the CL if they win this year's EL. This would give the 5 maximum allowable.
However, I can't find anything to contradict the part highlighted in red in my previous post. It does look like if an English team wins the CL and also qualifies for next season by league place there will be one league place slot taken away.

All the bit about the EL places via cups etc is still correct as far as I can see.

 

[keith's curle]

OK, had to read it several times to read into it what you are saying, but got it now. Phew! Thanks, I was going round in circles.

 

[bluesmith]

Going back through it, you're right about Chelsea or Arsenal being a fifth team in the CL if they win this year's EL. This would give the 5 maximum allowable.
However, I can't find anything to contradict the part highlighted in red in my previous post. It does look like if an English team wins the CL and also qualifies for next season by league place there will be one league place slot taken away.

All the bit about the EL places via cups etc is still correct as far as I can see.

You are reading it wrong, there is a spot saved for the winners in case they don't qualify through their league, if they do that spot goes to another country.